What constitutes alcoholism?

Will chat tomorrow too. 

Thank you for your response and I'm very sorry to hear that you've been through this, it sounds like you've had an ordeal.

I think the fact that I've been made aware of it is only a positive thing because now I can start to address it instead of assuming it's "normal".

What symptoms would constitute a physical withdrawal to alcohol? I don't think I've often gone more than 96 hours without at least a very tiny drink (at least not in the last few months), so I've no idea whether I'd experience this. Also, with reverse tolerance, do you literally have about one drink and feel drunk very quickly? I had no idea that happened.

Reverse tolerance isn't the same as a "cheap drunk".  It's a lower tolerance due to the fact that you've used it to the point where your body simply cannot process it as well.  Also, periods of sobriety make it worse.  Refer to the "kindling" effect of withdrawals in your research.  Tolerance is similar.  To answer your question of physical withdrawal, it can be as mild as a "hangover"...do yourself a favor and get a Thiamin (vitamin b1) supplement; people who drink regularly only absorb a small amount of thiamin.  This is the leading cause of Wernicke-Korsakoff Syndrome, or "wet brain". Other symptoms may include involuntary movement of limbs, sweats, nausea, severe sensitivity to light.  They may progress into hallucinations (mostly due to light/noise sensitivity and a dehydrated and depleted body of the core B1,6 12 and vitamin c.  If you want to continue to drink, do not drink water afterwards.  It dilutes your body's homeostasis (already thrown off from the alcohol).  Drink Gatorade or powerade.  Or if you wanna spend the money, buy Pedialyte. Leading cause of alcoholic seizures is electrolyte imbalance due to gorging on water.

I failed to answer your questions in order with the last message.  My apology No, it doesn't take one drink to become drunk with reverse tolerance; I was in the US Navy and drank HEAVILY so where a case of 6% beer got me loaded, it takes roughly half.  Symptoms of withdrawal outside of a "hangover" do not act as a hangover. Agitation is expected when "hung over".  However, the biological ramifications of over-indulgence can be rated without the use of a doctor on this scale.  1) Mild: 1-4 hrs after the last drink.  Restlessness, cold sweats, overly-anxious.  Headache, usually symptoms of a casual hangover after a binge 2)  Moderate: Migraine-like symptoms, palm sweat and paranoia or feelings of persecution/judgment.  Normal hangover symptoms become worse and only with alcohol reintroduced into the body subsides the body's "anxiety".  3)  Severe:  Heart palpitations, irregular heartbeat or a pulse rate at or above 100/minute.  Involuntary eye movement, general unawareness of time/date, seizures, potential stroke or heart attack. 4) Death.  If you achieve anything past step 1) and then "taper" or lessen your use then go back to a greater amount, each time will increase the likelihood of the withdrawals becoming more severe or life-threatening.  Diazepam or Lorazepam (Valium, Ativan) will greatly decrease the possibility of death (Alcohol over-actives the GABA receptors in the brain and those drugs act in the same manner).  Yeah, it's not fun, it's not a guarantee for every drinker or heavy drinker.  Genetic gamble if you hit the sauce as we do hope that helps

I have to say that all of that sounds utterly terrifying. I can't be sure I have suffered withdrawal symptoms since the meds I'm currently on cause a lot of nausea, anxiety, night sweats, etc, and my heart rate has always been quite erratic. I suppose all I can do is severely cut down and be aware of what I'm drinking (although, saying that, I have just got home from work and poured myself a large glass of whisky!).

Thank you for explaining things in so much detail.

I am not a former drinker so this isn't a Pro-Sobriety commentary  I drink.  Daily.  Problem with whiskey or any brown/orange liquor is it slows down the ability of the liver to process the ethanol into sugar.  That's also why brown/orange liquor have more flavor than clear ethanol (Vodka takes on any flavor of mixer because the majority of its ingredients are filtered out before distrubution).  Point? If you want to cut down, I would not recommend whiskey or anything above 12% ABV (wine, essentially).  It won't work and it will get worse.  Or maybe it won't, but as this is a forum for alcoholism I'd say it's not an off-base assumption. Sticking to beer is my recommendation.  As we drink as we do, it will eventually cause health problems.  Beer will prolonge that unfortunate reaction with the body rather than spirits.  It may take more to get the desired effect but your liver will thank you as your stomach fills up before your liver has problems

 

And you are most welcome for going into detail.  Better to learn it from someone that has been there than experience it. 

Oh, blimey, how do I not know any of this (about how brown/orange liquors are processed)? I'm 32 for goodness sake, not 19! I am a fan of wine, but since I drink quite a lot of red (hence why I'm here), I do like to switch to whisky or brandy now and again, since they are my favourite other drinks.

Unfortunately I am not a fan of beer, unless it's an ice cold bottle (of few) at a BBQ in the summer! I do like vodka, but since I won't drink fizzy drinks/mixers (because, ironically, I find them unhealthy) with it, I rarely drink it because I'm not overly keen on the taste of it on its own (same as gin).

Oh dear. I have a lot of work to do.

Beer is hit-or-miss like many tastes; I cannot stand the taste of scotch, gin or brandy.  Beer? I have my preferences as well but you only build a preference if you enjoy the first few in the first place.  Some do, some don't. Worst thing to drink in my opinion is tequila or mezcal and those are also the best drunken nights I've had. I think you know to never take the "drink the bottle and then eat the worm test on mezcal" challenge.  There never is a winner as nobody can keep score anymore...or remember their first grade teacher haha.  Being a drunk can be an art, but most of the time it turns against you and that is what it did to me.  It became a proverbial "devil" on my shoulder.  It still sits there and taunts me that I'm only a few yards (mtrs for you metrics) away from programmed bliss.  Associate good times with alcohol enough and good times need alcohol.  Still in that cycle.  Funny how you can every other fishbowl on a counter and comment on their bowl's shape, size and do it logically but do it from a standpoint that everyone but me is in THEIR fishbowls?  Little do you know, they're thinking the same thing.

Last section about fishbowls was a joke, there was supposed to be a proverbial "I/you" in the bowl but Windows 8 is terrible with its pad.  Deleted the context otherwise it would make sense

 

Haha, funny...

Having drunk all my alcohol supplies on Wednesday night (half a bottle of whisky and two bottles of red wine.......!!) and stayed up until half past five the following morning doing so, I am now refusing to buy any more booze this weekend, hence I will not be able to drink even if I want to.

However, it's Friday early evening, & I am already craving a glass of whisky. But I shall not succumb. If I can't go a few days without drinking then I really DO have issues greater than I thought

It is easy to get sucked in, but if you feel like not drinking at all but start having those side-effects I talked about then either get some booze or go to a doctor and get a  script for diazepam or lorazepam.  Better to do it slowly than just stop! me? I'm doing my beer diet as usual.  Whiskey and wine days are behind me haha

HOPE ALL OK ! XX

 

I can't imagine ever using the words "whisky and wine days are behind me"...

I was a good girl last night, I didn't succumb, but today I have bought a litre bottle of Famous Grouse and two bottles of Prosecco. Not to say I will open/drink any of them, but they are there...

 

Thanks for asking, all ok for now thanks

I never imagined the days of not drinking my favs; Dirty Belvedere martini, 3 olives.  Or Jameson on the rocks til I forgot how to spell.  It may not come for you, and I sincerely hope it doesn't; it is not a fun experience to know the finer things in a drinking habit and not be able to do them.  Better to have loved and lost it than to have never loved at at all, right?  If things are ok, then things are okay.  Maybe you had better luck (or I drank a SHIT TON more way too early in life) than I did.  Still riding the horse, but I don't go full speed anymore.  Who knows?  ...for now I'm a VERY not social drinker but not where I was (or where you are) about 3 years ago. 

I agree with that entirely (better to have loved and lost...). I'm tempted to ask my doctor for a blood test to assess my liver, but not sure if she'll agree to it... At least then I can know what I'm working with and try and adjust things a bit if REALLY necessary. What do you reckon?

I do not see why your doctor would not agree to it; if you are having questions of what you've done to your liver and come to her with this voluntarily, it doesn't hurt to run the tests.  They may be inconclusive or perhaps she'd feel that if the results were generally positive it may be a false indicator that your current use isn't harmful physiologically.  But even then it's a simple test that is non-invasive or risky.

I'm going to ring up and see if I can book in for the tests. I see what you're saying about positive results being a false indicator.. Although the way I see it is, if they come back ok, then I have caught the issue before it's done damage, so I can continue trying to cut down safe in the knowledge that I did something about it in time... But if the results come back and I have done damage, then I will have to re-review the entire thing again.

But I'm not giving up alcohol for good. No way.

 

I understand that mentality competely.  Moment of COMPLETE honesty on my part:  I have tried pot, shrooms, LSD, MDMA and suboxone recreationally to no addictive effect.  I have also done cocaine with a medium addictive effect but broke it off 13 years ago.  Morphine sulphate and other pain killers (Hydrocodone, Oxycontin, etc) were also prescribed to me and I still walked away from them scott-free.  Alcohol is my achilles' tendon.  I only use alcohol (legal reasons do make it easier) and it's an old friend that you don't want to lose.  I still use it and think the same way you do but seeing someone else say "I'll never give it up" makes me look at my own mentality of reason to continue to use.  I may be mistaken and I don't want that because then I lose my old friend.  Something to ponder on...and now a drink thoughts, Bella?

I appreciate your willingness to talk about this with a stranger for a lenthy communication I enjoy this as it is hard to talk about such things.  If your liver function tests come back wiith a less-than-positive result, it may temporarily curb you to slow down on drinking but as you have previously stated, 1/2 a bottle of whiskey and 2 bottles...that's roughly 30-40 drinks in a night.  I have been there, but it led me to this current status of having been hospitalized on numerous occasions and now (even with liver function tests stating normal) it is not good.  Again if you continue to drink (as I do ) keep some multivitamins especially B1.  When you're hung over, DO NOT drink water.  Drink a sports drink or anything similar; drinking water when severely dehydrated actually worsens your body's chemistry.  Take it from an expert on the concept of alcohol abuse

I agree with you with regards to alcohol being your Achilles' tendon. I did a lot of coke in the past, and was probably moderately addicted at the time, but I stopped it very easily when I decided I needed to. I also used to smoke (just cigarettes) & have always been able to take it or leave it - I haven't smoked for years and don't plan to start again. But alcohol... it's always there, and I cannot imagine things being any different. I don't want them to be.

You seem to be completely in control of things now, and you also acknowledge your "addiction" (if that's the right word for it - sorry if not), so I wouldn't be too concerned at re-evaluation your mentality. But maybe I'm being naive saying that......!!??

 

Well, that would be an assumption that I would make based on my messages on this forum.  I do have more information on the topic than I care to admit to people surrounding my life but as it turns out I violated my own rules and bought a bottle of Bushmill's Irish Honey. And I am drinking it as if it were water.  so it goes to show that no matter how long you go without it, it comes right back.  I have a handle on it only as much as anyone who is in their early 30's and has been drinking regularly since their late teens.  Everything else I could do without.  Have neighbors constantly toking and inviting me over but I know i don't want to go down that road again....then I got out and buy a bottle of whiskey haha.  Again, it's a sneaky bastard

It's a sneaky b.....! I think u r? U know that UR drinking will and is controlling UR life.. 

My son is a alcoholic and I know every excuse in the book. So how's that workin for ya?

Where r u now.. sober I pray to GOD,

Why do u say being Irish in UR blood that's a reason to drink? 

drinking a drink to the alcoholic the difference is the addiction.  Most drink out of anxiety and to self medicate.

u have described many things alcoholics design their lives around describing the mind of a alcoholic.  U however left out what exactly reverse tolerance is? Is that the toxic part from not eating food or withdrawals?

I am sorry u struggle thru UR addiction.  U make it sound so nonchalant. U have to get past the denial stage is what was left out of the explanation.

UR have been thru withdrawals and in the hospital?

AND U CONTINUE TO DRINK......,!!!?."

HOW'S THAT WORKIN FOR YA?

If that's what I understand u to explain in UR own words. Actually is too much to imagine UR life sober forever..no drink at all. can u imagine a life with no booze? In fact I hear a little bit of denial in there.... UR cheating urself out of a life.

Mabe UR not in jail.. Or Living on the streets.... or lost UR drivers liscence....... Just put a YET after each of those statements.

MY SON THOUGHT THE SAME WAY.. He was on life support last May..he's been back in jail out again on the streets. Begging for food and money and alcohol.  JUST ADD A YET AFTER THAT STATEMANT ABOUT MY SON FOR YOU.

I pray that u see the light... And seek help soon.

HOPE4CURE

Now that's a alcoholic revelation!  Wow sharing UR alcohol knowledge.

now does that mean UR smarter than the average alacocolic?

 

Hi Nathan , it's about my wife , everything on this page I can relate to .. And am going through.. I could write a million page novel ..

Anyway quick question :

She binges for between 3 & 14 days ( longest binges happening more frequent and recent now . )

When she 'stops' Is it possible to go from shakes / anxiety / regret day 1&2 to cool as a cucumber on day 3? I can't for life of me find any booze but am convinced she must be topping up to take edge off.