Mirt WD Digestive Symptoms

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I am over 6 1/2 months since stopping, and am still having abdominal cramps, churning bowels and abdominal pain. That, along with not much appetite and weakness is seems to want to hang around, and I am miserable because of it. Any replies appreciated. David

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  • Posted

    Hi David,I do know how you feel when your Tum is playing up.  But I think you have to try and eat reasonably well,in order to combat feeling weak.

    A lack of good wholesome food will at least build you up,and maybe you would not feel so weak.  So please try and eat.  It won't solve your Tummy problem but it will help you cope easier.

           Lots of love comeing your way.

    PS Have you tried Kefir Yogurt I know they sell it in the US because Rose has tried it,give it a go who knows.  I'm makeing some but I haven't tried it yet so I can't comment,but I'll give anything a go to get rid of this forever pain.    Worth a try no two bodies a like.

                                     Your long time friend .xx

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  • Posted

    You are assuming the symptoms are due to mirt WD.   After more than 6 months that seems  unlikely to me.   Have you seen a doctor?

      

     

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    • Posted

      Oldboy, yes I have seen several. An abdominal CT with contrast, several trips to the ER. Labwork (blood tests) all coming back as negative (normal) this is part of an e-mail that I received from my GI doctor. "But, I do think that the stress and anxiety that you have been under would contribute greatly to your bowel habit, abdominal pain, weight loss and lack of appetite. Remeron makes you gain weight and increases appetite." I haven't assumed anything with this experience. They even did a CT of the brain when I was having headaches. I went of the mirtazapine cold turkey February 27th, and had tried a year earlier but had to go back on it. 8 years at 45 mgs. I haven't taken anything for granted, but instead, have worried myself sick that evey symptom was something bad and had them checked out. Thank you for your response, it is much appreciated, David
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    • Posted

      The heading you gave to this thread is "Mirt WD Digestive Symptoms".  That means you are assuming the symptoms are from mirt withrawal.

      I think you are wrong.  I agree with the GI doctor. They are due to stress and anxiety.  By coming off mirt you have thrown away any help it was giving you with those.  It is not at all surprising that they have got worse. 

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    • Posted

      Norma, thank you. I know where I was, and where I am, and what caused it. As do you, having been there yourself. Yes, my doctor is right with regard to the anxiety and stress, but guess where they came from? Take Care, David
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    • Posted

      PAIN Gives you stress and worry,especially if it's got worse from the use,or WD from a drug.  We certainly do row the same boat.

               You take care.

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    • Posted

      Geez this drug is a nightmare! In other words once on it, there's no way back?  How does the drug actually work compared to Tricyclics and SSRI's?

      Also does anyone know if St John's Wort is truly effective or other herbal remedies as I just feel I can't trust prescription meds now. Especially as Ive suffered with IBS since my mum died back in 1986 so to have exaccerbated symptoms when the time comes to withdraw from this drug is my worst nightmare!

      Thanks

      Jackie

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    • Posted

      That was the point I was making!

      You did not have the symptoms before stopping the drug  BECAUSE MIRT WAS HELPING YOU.   You have thrown away that help, so the symptoms have appeared.    You cannot blame the drug for that! 

      It is the LACK of mirt which is the cause.   The same would have happened with any drug which helped you.  Mirt is a very powerful drug and can therefore give a lot of help.  Perhaps that is why some people  call it evil when they throw that powerful help away.   

         

       

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    • Posted

      OK. But what about when the medication stops working, and the side effects are now the only thing that you are getting from taking it. Including heart rhythm problems, the famous Remeron morning hangover, dizzines and headache. Also vision problems? I took it for 8 years, and am familiar with the pros and cons. My mother is on 30 mg, and probably will be for life, but it is making her feel better. She tried titrating down to a lower dose, but had to go back to 30. That is fine for her, as she has no side effects. But I had no choice. It is just that simple. Sure, Remeron is a life saver for some folks, but for others it isn't.
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    • Posted

      Hi Jackie,

      Please do not say this drug is a nightmare unless you have personally experienced that.  I suspect you are just infering it from David and Norma.   Their opinions may not be typical.  Are they experts?  

       

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    • Posted

      Please do not say this drug is fine unless you have personally experienced WD.  Your oppinion may not be typical.  YOU are not an expert.

      Ive experienced both sides of this drug,and like I say unless your on it for life you MAY suffer WD.. Each body is unique. But you can only make an oppinion on your own experience,which you haven't had.

       

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    • Posted

      I did not say that mirt is fine so your whole argument is false.

      I merely say that your limited experience may not be typical.   

       

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    • Posted

      I'm agreeing with David here,I'm ending this debate with you,because you just do not understand. Bye Bye
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    • Posted

      I did not criticise you for coming off mirt, as you seem to think.

      Nor was saying there are no problems with mirt.

      I was suggesting why you are getting those symptoms. 

      You can ignore what I say and blame mirt for everything, but that does not make you right. 

       

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    • Posted

      Hi Pippa1364, 

      There are lots of supplements that can help, including 5-htp, tryptophan, SamE, St. John's Wort.  There's a book called The Mood Cure that goes over natural ways of improving mood, going into which supplements to use under which conditions.  I don't think this book takes withdrawal recovery into account and withdrawal symptoms may not respond as well as they would if you had never been on psych drugs.  I got myself into trouble taking supplements, though, when I was in withdrawal from Effexor and didn't realize it.  I took 200 mg Sam-E in the AM, and 5-htp or tryptophan at night (tryptophan is a precursor to 5-htp which is a precursor of serotonin).  I began haviing horrible generalized anxiety, not sure if it was due to the Effexor WD or the combo of supplements.  I read on survivingantidepressants that Sam-E can cause anxiety.  Also, I reinstated Effexor briefly, stopping the supplements, and ended up with mild Serotonin Syndrome!  So, one must be careful with combining these, especially in close proximity to taking an SSRI or SNRI!

      At any rate, it is worth a try with 5-htp or L-tryptophan by themselves.  I used to take L-tryptophan as a teenager to help with sleep.  L-tryptophan is high in turkey, which may be why we get so groggy after a turkey dinner.

       

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    • Posted

      Hi Betsy,

      Many thanks for that info. I have a very good Herbal practitoner near me so I may give them a try too. I feel a lot of my symptoms are exaccerbated by hormone swings though given my age and I really notice my mood plummet at certain times. Nothing really seems to make a difference. I have even tried Black Cohosh.

      When you're feeling hopeless waiting for meds to work seems like forever.

      Interesting about Turkey though I must say.

      Bye for now,

      Jackie

       

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    • Posted

      I agree, David!  I had to go up to 37.5 mg because each lower dose quit working.  Not only did it not help, I became incredibly apathetic and demotivated.  At that point the only good it did was help me sleep, and I began gaining weight.  I have read that it can contribute to diabetes!  So, when my Effexor was reinstated, I wasn't going to just keep going with the Mirt - wanted off.  I have experienced numb lips/tongue, headaches, fatigue, and abdominal cramping, and that is just with a 10% per month taper!  So, yes, some have no trouble coming off, but others suffer greatly.  Just because the p-docs think WD should only last a few weeks doesn't mean that someone suffering longer isn't in fact suffering from WD.  The docs do NOT have a true bead on WD!  They immediately say you are relapsing if your WD lasts longer, but when it comes to the physical, what is the relapse?  Certainly not anxiety/depression!

      You can read Peter Breggin's books to learn more.  He's a psychiatrist who writes about withdrawal and the harm psych drugs can do. 

      David, are you on probiotics?  You might want to make sure that one of the strains is Saccharomyces boulardii.

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    • Posted

      I do speak from personal experience. I have been trying to get established on this drug since April.

      I have now met my new NHS therapist who was a Psychiatric nurse and he did say that this one and Seroxat are difficult drugs given they have more side effects. However, if they do agree with you then it appears the results are good. BUT staying on AD meds longterm is another dubious area.

      I have tried Seroxat, Prozac, Sertraline, Citralipram..Even the filthy drug Prothiadene in the 80's.. So yes I talk from a great deal of experience and am having to make an informed choice as to whether the risk severe withdrawel is worth it, especially  given my GP doesn't like you to become dependent on any drug where posiible. And given the fact of I am extremely prone to relapses.

      It's a tough choice this one but I knew Seroxat was a nightnare way before it came out in the media!

      We are the Guinea Pigs of today and the Experts of tomorrow alas!

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    • Posted

      So, you came off psych drugs before - and how long off of them before you relapsed?  I was having crazy levels of anxiety and depression after coming off of Effexor, even eight months out - levels I had never experienced before psych drugs.  Of course, all the docs thought I had relapsed and wanted to medicate, but once I learned about WD it all became clear to me.  Unfortunately, I am now not just on Mirt but Effexor, too, since I reinstated before realizing what was going on.  Now, I am tapering off of Mirt first and then Effexor, very slowly.  

      I managed to go without psych drugs until I was 30, when Prozac was all the rage and I thought that pill could solve all my problems. Had I learned the cognitive skills I am learning now, I may never have started psych drugs 20 years ago!  I'd been on different ones until Effexor, which I'd been on for the prior 12 years.  The longer you've been on the them, the longer it takes to get off of them safely!

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    • Posted

      What I asked was that you do not say this drug is a nightmare unless you have experienced that nightmare yourself.  Otherwise it is just hearsay.  

      Hearsay is where you hear something from somebody and repeat it as if it were the gospel truth.

      I have read several times that mirt is less difficult than SSRIs but that does not carry much weight with me. 

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    • Posted

      Hi Betsy,

      For me I haven't had any problems getting off the SSRi's. More on starting them really.

      I don't tend to increse a drug more than once though. Tollerance of any drug isn't great. That said I had hoped I could go back to Prozac eventually and if necessary.

      Seroxat made me very sick. 

      The other SSRIS upset my digsetive system too much as well and made it impossible to go out for fear of episodes. Not good when you're trying to integrate and lift your mood!

      I was put on Mirt when I asked for sleeping tablets alongside Prozac in the initial days. Something I'd successfully done in the past but it looks like there are new restrictions on Zopiclone now.

      I particularly want a medicine that will help me stop over obsessing/focussing on things. I really need freedom from this toxic relationship and I can see a light at the end of the tunnel if I can at least acheive this and also I want to cut down on alcohol consumption as that's no prop at the end of the day. 

      I needed to start Psyche drugs following Postnatal Depression. My mind has never really got back to how it was pre children. So I am thoroughly convinced that hormone fluctuations have paid a major part and I seem to be allergic to half of them!

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    • Posted

      I'm in exactly the same boat as David, same symptoms, same length of time etc and I was only put on this because I wasnt sleeping so youre wrong.
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