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Atrial Fibrillation (AFib) and associated digestive problems?

Posted , 47 users are following.

edward1943
edward1943

I have been diagnosed recently with Paroxysmal A/F. Episodes are usually infrequent- around 1 every 4-6 weeks. Onset is invariably at night and when lying down to sleep or actually asleep. The time spent out of rhythm varies from 30 minutes to as much as 8 hours, usually going back into normal sinus rhythm when the bloating has abated. ECG and Echo tests normal.

But have been prescribed a blood-thinner of course (not warfarin), which I have to start soon it seems.

Two things concern me:

ONE that neither the specialist or my GP seemed to accept that there was any connection between A/F and bloating/IBS yet the internet is crowded with people with the same symptoms as me. Only two (eminent) USA sites mention this as a reality.

TWO I do wish my GP would take seriously a need to review and change my medication routine (I have been on 25mg Atenolol for ectopic beats for 9 years now), especially since I have read in several notable cardiological sites that atenolol can not only contribute to A/F but also that in any event, 25mg is too low a dose.

Would others with A/F AND these IBS-type symptoms please share their experiences/outcomes/view please?

Many thanks!!

1 like, 90 replies

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  • mazieboo22
    mazieboo22 edward1943

    Posted

    Hi Edward, I am certain it is to do with bowel problems. I have a rectocele problem and my AF started 7 years ago, same time as this happened. I did used to get the odd missed beat and7 years ago I woke up with a beat of 150 per minute, ended up having to go to hospital and they were deciding whether to give me a tablet to slow it down and keep me in or sedate and shock me to get it back to normal rythym. As they got blood out of my arm it went back to normal and I asked if it had anything to do with constipation or loose bowel movement and they said very unlikely. I had another bout last November, again woke up with a perculiar fast beat that was doing all sorts of rythyms and the doctor gave me a beta blocker and after an hour it went back to normal but I get more odd beats when I also have bowel problems but the doctors said they had not heard of it but I am convinced there is a link.
    • Carneuny
      Carneuny mazieboo22

      Posted

      Hiya Mazieboo,

      I made some comments to Edward about 11 days ago - if you search back you should find them. if you can't find it let me know and I'll repeat it. I remain ABSOLUTELY, TOTALLY convinced there is a link between my AF and my guts. I was diagnosed with AF (heart rate was 160 bpm) in Jan 2010. In April 2010 I linked the onset of an AF event with food and digestive issues. I have treated only the digestive issues and now cannot recall my last AF event. I am now only taking medication. I was tested for IBS and Coeliac Disease but tests were clear ... I was offerred further tests but declined. Instead I went to a Nutritionist. In my experience its no good asking a GP, A & E Dept or a nurse about the link between AF and digestive disorders - they haven't got a bloody clue. Nor has a Cardiac Consultant or an EP.

      BUT - if you go to a Gastroenterologist, a Consultant in the digestive system/the gut you will get more sense. Also a Nutrionist. The Daily Mail of yesterday ran an interesting article on the digestive system - if you can get it, its worth reading.

      John

    • mazieboo22
      mazieboo22 Carneuny

      Posted

      Thank you John, I am convinced the victoza pen I use for my diabetes by increasing the length of time to 4 hours for digestion has something to do with this. I wasn't suffering too bad at all until a year ago when I started using this drug and all of a sudden it has flared up again and the digestion takes ages, causes all sorts of pains and noises, so much so that I had a scan for Gall Stones as the GP was convinced I had them but that came back clear. The Vagas Nerve certainly links them and the fact I have to take acid reducing medication make the Vagas Nerve seem even more linked to this as it mentions the esophagus being linked too which is damaged by acid reflux so all connected. Thank you John.
    • Carneuny
      Carneuny mazieboo22

      Posted

      Interesting Mazie,

      In my mid 30's I was diagnosed with both gall bladder issues and acid reflux ( something about a valve not properly closing off thus causing bile to come back up). Can't remember all the details now - but no action was taken except to suggest I watched my diet. Then 35 years later AF and controlling it with diet.

      John

    • edward1943
      edward1943 Carneuny

      Posted

      Hello John,

      You are so right about the indifference of cardiologists to the digestion/A/F issues! Wondering why this might be, I have come to the conclusion that their training is based exclusively on published research which is too often sponsored by drug companies so that the so-called expertise of a cardiologist will be based on data of this kind without paying ANY attention the expressed opinions and SYMPTOMS of the patient! This means that the largest and perhaps most significant data on A/F and digestive problems is never see or heeded by the specialist. We tend of course to give the specialist (including the GP) the benefit of experience and expertise but I urge all who suffer from this conjnuction of symptoms to take a more insistant track with either GP or specialist.

      The problem is that failig to see food allergies, bloating and possible Vagus nerve affects as CONNECTED AND CAUSATIVE of A/F means that any therapies or treatment plans are going to be wide of the mark and for those of us with this form of A/F, are going to prove pretty well useless.

      The nutritionist option is one I shall pursue though several weeks on the now well known FODmaps diet (gluten free etc)///a treatment designed for IBS sufferers has only had a marginal effect so far on my bloating, though I suspect that balancing the gut is a long term healing process and no a quick fix.

      Any others going this route?

      Bless you all for taking part in these discussions and sharing your thoughs and experiences.

       

  • frank61666
    frank61666 edward1943

    Edited

    I may be a little late for this discussion but....

    Yes there is certainly a close connection between the Vagus Nerve and afib.  To control, and maybe stop a vagal afib episode, 1. try if possible to stay away from alcohol, including that "healthy red wine"  and 2., take a formulation called "CALM" one hour before going to bed.

    Its all about magnesium and how it is radically depleted in and during afib episodes.

    Alcohol makes you pee out magnesium, which is probably already low for several reasons.  The "CALM" is simply a soluble form of magnesium that is immediately absorbed near the misbehaving vagus and it keeps the vagus under control and happy.

    You take CALM in a warm solution for rapid absorption.

    I and others have stopped vagal afib in its tracks by taking CALM with an onset but now I just take it every night before bed, and I sleep well, and everything goes great.

    Comments?

    Frank (from the USA)  

     

    • derek76
      derek76 frank61666

      Posted

      There is a definite connection with the vagus nerve. I have twice gone into AF when it was stimulated once when having a colonoscopy and the other after a DRE (digital rectal examination)

       

    • jennifer_45307
      jennifer_45307 frank61666

      Posted

      This is so interesting and encouraging. I'm going through so much with IBS and afib. Now I feel I've found people who understand. The magnesium/alcohol thing is so right. I will try and see a nutritionist and get this sorted out asap. Thanks a lot for this website.

  • GotAbitBetter
    GotAbitBetter edward1943

    Posted

    I'm so pleased I've picked up this string, as I thought I was going mad: first really bad bout of AF in July last year, then a critical time in September followed by a 6 month wait for firm diagnosis. Every discussion I had about my symptoms I mentioned 'burping' and 'indigestion' but paramedics, GP and Cardiologist Consultant all told me it was irrelevant and nothing to do with the condition. I will now look into the Vagus nerve in more detail. I am a Coeliac, therefore am aware of nutritional issues, have been gluten free for about 25 years and since AF have consumed no alcohol. Had a 'failed' EP but wish to know whether it is worth having another one to try and confirm what needs ablating. Anyone had this experience as well please?
    • derek76
      derek76 GotAbitBetter

      Posted

      I mostly get the same reaction from doctors. I went to A&E two weekends ago with really high BP and pressure in my chest that had been increasing all day. They did tests and diagnosed AF and kept me on a monitor for 24 hours. The AF settled and they let me home on day two.

      It started AF up again ten days ago and today I have the type of chest pain  that mimics  a heart attack. Now bringing up lots of wind and feeling slightly better. I once even flew to America when feeling like this.

    • GotAbitBetter
      GotAbitBetter derek76

      Posted

      Have they put you on any medication?

      I could hardly leave the house when I was like this....

      and stopped taking my BP because it was up and down like a yo yo!

    • derek76
      derek76 GotAbitBetter

      Posted

      Last time I went into AF I asked the doctor if I should have started to take some of the Bisopropol I had left from before. He said yes so I have been doing that as I prefer to see him rather than other doctors at the practice as he has been on holiday. I'll see him tomorrow.

      I went out not felling very good this afternoon but felt a lot better by the time I got back.   

  • Chappers
    Chappers edward1943

    Posted

    Last reply 8 months ago, but found it and thought I would comment. I probably have Paroxysmal A/F although Ive never been formally diagnosed. I've had three episodes, all three of which were very similar. Overeating, woke at 4am with a distended, gassy stomach and heart going crazy, around 150-160 beats per minute and all over the place. 

    Was given Flecanaide to take at the onset after my second episode. My third episode happened after I'd been juicing veggies and fruits. My stomach couldnt take it, over did the gas and bloated my stomach. 8 hours later Im in rescuss and they want to cardiovert me. I say I'm not really interested in that, and the last two times Ive just fallen asleep and my heart has reverted naturally. 

    This time, I couldnt get to sleep in a noisy ward so they sedated me ready for cardioversion. Fortunately, I popped back into sinus rythm after the sedation. Cardiologistics want to do ablation. I don't. I know its my digestion, but none of them would listen. I am scheduled for an ECG and a 24 hour holter test... I had this same procedure after my second episode and they found nothing and couldnt work it out. 

    Im not surprised as its nothing to do with the heart, but everything to do with the stomach and guts. It still scares the crap out of me though when it happens, roughly every two years. I think I need to stick to a boring diet of the same stuff that I know doesnt send me into full 'bloat'. Three times it's been potatoes, chinese takeaway and veggie/fruits. All really acidic foods :-)

  • Jodev
    Jodev edward1943

    Posted

    I hope you guys get notified of my reply, and you can update us on your progress?

    You can guess why I'm here, having also listened to my body and the blatantly (to us) obvious connection between AFib and digestive issues.

    I'm male - 37, 7 years of digestive issues. Diagnosed Severe IBS, Functional Dyspepsia and Hiatal Hernia. I was diagnosed with AFib 3 months ago after rushing to A&E after waking with a pounding 160 heartbeat. It rectified itself after meds so was sent home after 1 night. On 3 occasions since then, I have had episodes similar but heartbeat not as fast as the first occasion but on everyone of those occasions I've had an overwhelming sense and feeling of it starting or being caused by my gut.

    After tonight's episode I did a bit of 'Googling' and the first thing that came up struck a very resonant chord with me, due to the very specific symptoms I experience when I have an episode.

    It has always been whilst eating or drinking. I suddenly get a pressure sensation in my neck and head, feel slightly confused, panicky, bowels and intestines start to spasm, feel nauseous and also like I HAVE to go to the loo for a bowel movement urgently. I also have to lie down quickly as I feel like I'm about to pass out (did pass out the 2nd time). Have loose stool when I can eventually stand back up and get to the loo. Also, heart rate starts to shoot up and feels pronounced.

    These symptoms can literally all happen in a matter of seconds, whilst eating. Only happened 3 times but all those symptoms are so specific that the Internet comes up with 'Dumping Syndrome'.

    Do those symptoms sound familiar to any of you? It was thought that people would only be susceptible to this condition after stomach surgery but I've just born reading studies where they are realising it can affect people without having had a stomach surgery and is connected to the Vagus Nerve.

    Is our Afib really Afib or is it 'Dumping Syndrome'? Do a quick bit of research into it to see if the symptoms make so much more sense for you too.

    The docs do look at us like we're such fools sometimes but my body and mind is sceaming at me that AFib is caused by or is connected to our guts.

    • derek76
      derek76 Jodev

      Posted

      Stimulation of the vagus nerve in various ways can cause AF. Eating and bloating among them. I have not read up on dumping syndrome but passing a large stool can stimuate the nerve and put you into AF. The Sister on the ward where I had my pacemaker fitted last year said that it was quite common. 
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