Early menopause and vaginal atrophy after breast cancer- can anyone help?
Posted , 10 users are following.
I was diagnosed and went through treatment for breast cancer at 44. I have just turned 50 and amongst all kinds of other health issues, am having a very difficult menopause and now what appears to be atrophic vaginitus I had my last period 4 months ago and also stopped seeing my sexual partner of 5 years at the same time.. . I thad sex with a new partner this week and immediately was in terrible pain,redness, swelling , tearing, due to dryness. I also got a case of instant cystitus. So embarrassing for me and i don't think i will be seeing him again. I really don't want this to be the end of my sex life. i have just turned 50 and may live till i'm 90. My GP and the hospital just say there is nothing they can do as they can't offer me HRT. There must be something!!! Where can i go for proper help and what can i do to relieve the sypmptoms and also get properly checked out? I've made an appointment with a GUM clinic as my Gp doesn't even examine me. Please all help will be appreciated.
3 likes, 47 replies
marge54 amelia_38073
Posted
i was diagnosed with Breast Cancer when i was 37 and i am i now 54 ( i went thru the usually preventative treatment) however, over the last few years i was in a on/off relationship and i did notice that whenever things got intimate its was starting to get painfully so i took myself off to the doctor and she said i was menopausal !! but she was referring me to see a gynae consultant at my local hospital, so in due course my appt arrived and he examined me and said i had Vaginal Atrophy (Charming) but he will refer me to another clinic in another hosp but he was also writing to my Breast cancer Consultant to see if he can prescribe a locally based oestrogen pessary for me ( my cancer was oestrogen receptive). i got my appt thru for the clinic and was given vaginal dilitors and explained how they work, they come in four sizes and so far have helped the sting.Today i have been back to my original consultant and have finally got a reply from my Breast cancer consultant who has said he is happy for me to go on otho Gynest (i think) got to use it for 2 weeks every night and then a couple of nights a week, so watch this space for updates. hope this helps xx
amelia_38073 marge54
Posted
That's great news! You'll be fine again very soon.
I went to the Mango Clinic and there were no infections, so the Doc there gave me a steroid cream to use for a week , morning and night.
That got rid of the soreness and inflamation.
Then i saw my gynacologist at the hospital who gave me an exam and a smear , all normal.
Then i started on the Gynest.
I'm back in the saddle so to speak, and everything is fine!
i just use the Gynest twice a week and last time i had sex i was fine!
I haven't had to use dilators, but i did notice when the doctor gave me a smear and used the opener up thingy ( cant' remember the name of it) she had to use the smallest size , so i'll have to keep an eye on things and make sure i don't shrink anymore!
It's such a shock isn't it? No one talks about these things and bang they happen , but i'm getting used to menopause now and it's not too bad.
Just glad to be alive! Take care and thanks! xx
patricia72274 amelia_38073
Posted
I went in desperation to see my GP with my husband, and the GP was very understanding. He went to talk at a Menopause Conference, and was advised there that for me Balance/Active menopause pessaries would be good, they also do pessaries for BV. He manged to get me a free sample, and was told it might be on pres cription soon, but I have bought it on line since. It does seem to have helped the constant uncomfortable feeling and soreness. I am also taking Omega 7 capsules - 2 weeks into them. We will see!!!!! Still no go from the Oncologist re the oestrogen cream although GP thinks would be OK
amelia_38073 patricia72274
Posted
My gp told me that as Gynest is only 0.01 percent of oestrogen in each dose of cream , so in one year you take it twice a week for 52 weeks . At the end of the year you have only taken 1 percent or one mg.
That is why it's not considered harmful. With HRT people take 1 mg a day. So if you've had breast cancer it's not advisable. it's also only absorbed locally , so in the vaginal tissue and not around the whole body.
I'm taking herbal medicine from a herbal practitioner and supplements like Omega 7 , a natural lubricant called Yes , i bought online ( it's very good) and Balance Active after sex to maintain the vaginal ph and avoid infections. I've also started on the Gynest and taking it twice a week.
patricia72274 amelia_38073
Posted
On Tuesday I see the Urologist, goodness knows what he will think of all my concoctions! My GP has told me many times that he thinks the answer is the Oestrogen cream, but it worries me that the Oncologist always says no.
So far the Balance Activ is helping more than most.
Pat
susan04766 patricia72274
Posted
patricia72274 susan04766
Posted
I am in the uk. Did you have breast cancer? I had a mastectomy 6 years ago.
Will let you know how tomorrow goes.
Pat
susan04766 patricia72274
Posted
Susan
patricia72274 susan04766
Posted
As my file says "no oestrogen" she says I could have it, if I was prepared to sign a form with GP to say I wanted it. Bit scarey not sure what to do.
Hey ho!
Pat
susan04766 patricia72274
Posted
Susan
marge54 amelia_38073
Posted
I am back again, this is starting to become a saga for me to try and get my Orth whatsit pessaries (Estriol) for me to use and thanks to you lovely ladies out there who are going thru the same problems as me and we all read each others comments and support each other, only to find that the piggin thing is discontinued. (so why do the Consultants who we put our lives in their hands not know this and prescribe it) Anyway, rant over, after talking with my pharmacy who were brillant i had to talk to my GP or shall i say receptionist, she then asked why didnt i try another chemist ( do you ever feel that sometimes you want to say what part of the conversation did you miss) i just said they have tried and its a discontinued product and i would need more than a months supply, also because of my history of breast cancer i need a new prescription something that my GP needs to do, so she is emailing him so now waiting for a phone call that i will never get. What is it with these doctors receptionist. My point is that after a year of waiting for a prescription due to letters going missing then finally getting one, to only find that i get one and the product is discontinued grrrrr, i just feel that its one step forward and 3 steps back, ah well just keep plodding on with the lube and dilators.... and relax!!!!
jayneejay amelia_38073
Posted
would you be able to try estriol vaginal cream ( ovestin)
doesnt effect uterine wall maybe have breast health benefits and bone protection.
i too have dryness cant take HRT ... But this is a gentle oestrogen ... We have three female estrogen's and this is the gentle one ..
also helps libido .... 0.1% 1mg Estriol vaginal cream or Ovules ( Ovestin)
may be helpful
Jay xox
jayneejay amelia_38073
Posted
heres more info ...
more info continued ... Estriol ( Ovestin) ( Ovestinon) vaginal Cream internal and external use 0.1% 1mg ....
Estriol Ovulo 0.5mg vaginal ovules x 20 ( Ovestin)
Estriol – The Power of Weak
Estriol is the third form of estrogen. It is called weak estrogen by the medical profession because it only has 1/25th the proliferative effect on female tissues. At the same time it is called weak, its usefulness is summarily dismissed by American doctors as some unknown and unproven substance – a testament to a profession’s lack of comprehension for anything that hasn’t been spoon fed to them by the pharmaceutical industry.
Your ovaries (assuming you still have them) produce 2 mgs of estriol per day, far more than any other form of estrogen. Estriol levels do not rise and fall with your menstrual cycle19, and their production is not naturally curtailed at the time of menopause.
Unlike estradiol, higher blood levels of estriol are generally protective against breast cancer. One large trial20 showed that estriol did not increase the risk for breast cancer, whereas estradiol did.
In women age 85 and older who have no heart disease, higher circulating levels of estriol21 are present and associated with healthy blood flow and good circulation. An animal study confirms that estriol increases the friendly form of nitric oxide22, an important relaxation factor for healthy circulation that helped prevent the formation of atherosclerosis in this study.
A study of women over 80 taking 2 mg of estriol per day found that it increased their bone density23.
Estradiol drugs are known to increase total cholesterol. A 2-year study of women entering menopause24 found that estriol prevented the estradiol-induced rise in cholesterol. Whereas triglyceride levels also increased in the estradiol drug group, estriol again prevented this result – even lowering triglycerides. Since an elevation in triglycerides is a key sign of insulin resistance, leptin resistance, cancer risk, and heart disease – one can only say that a natural substance that directly guards against this (estriol) is a powerful health-promoting compound.
Estriol is sometimes referred to as the pregnancy estrogen, as its production rises from 2 mgs per day to 8 mgs per day during pregnancy. It is believed that this elevation in estriol is highly protective to the evolving fetus, especially to the fetus’s nervous system25. It is also believed that the rise in estriol helps stabilize the mother’s immune response26 to the fetus, dampening the possibility of the mother’s own immune system trying to reject the fetus as foreign. It has been shown that a lack of estriol is associated with low birth weight babies27. Low estriol is also a factor associated with postpartum depression28.
Unlike the obvious issue of excess estradiol being linked to serious autoimmune problems, estriol is linked to immune stability.
Indeed, the observation of the regression of autoimmune multiple sclerosis during pregnancy has led to some fascinating studies. Non-pregnant women with MS29 have been given 8 mgs of estriol per day (the pregnancy level) and their MS has gone into regression. When the estriol is stopped it comes back, and when it is started again it goes away (including the removal of brain lesions). Phase II clinical trials30 are currently under way. One of the fascinating aspects of these initial studies showed that estriol could powerfully modulate TNFa31, a significant inflammatory signal that is overactive in many autoimmune problems. A separate cell study shows that estriol3216 is far better than estradiol at protecting brain cells from toxic exposure.
Estriol has proven effective as a treatment for vaginal dryness and atrophy33, as well as urinary tract infections. It has been shown to help relieve hot flashes34, acting as a natural hormone balancer. It helps many women with mood. If you try some, make sure you can tell it is doing something useful.
The body of evidence shows that estriol is safe and effective, a form of estrogen that is produced throughout one’s life. It acts as an antioxidant and anti-inflammatory, and is particularly effective at protecting the female system and nervous system.
As with any bioidentical hormone replacement, women should always ensure they are working on an overall health improvement program and it is moving in the right direction. Never rely on any one hormone as a “magic bullet.” And always keep it to a level that is within what your body would naturally produce.
Estriol is readily available in OTC creams and through a compounding pharmacist.
patricia72274 jayneejay
Posted
jayneejay patricia72274
Posted
bless you hun...
failing that ... Theres also natural estriol cream on biovea uk web..
check with doc too though..
good luck .. I know how you fell down there, i have researched this estradiol, and seems the weaker safer option...
i too am off to get some tomorrow ... Enough is enough ....
my gyno mentioned it ... But i said no at the time...
I also have some pre meno duo ovules on the way ... They are natural, very good reviews... From stress no more uk web...
dont buy off amazon they were £16 a box
but from stress no more uk i got 3 boxes for £20 and free delivery
premeno duo are for vag dryness and have duo effect ie: also for itch from dryness and the thrushy feel but its not thrush feeling ..
Jay xx
amelia_38073 jayneejay
Posted
thanks for this information. Really interesting!
At present i'm using Gynest cream twice weekly and the active ingredient is Estiol 0.01 percent. It's very good. Everything is back in balance. And i feel really well on it.
I'm going for a scan this week to see if the lining of my womb is ok- not getting too thick. and then i have annual mammogrammes in September.
Hopefully all will be well.
Amelia xxx
jayneejay amelia_38073
Posted
thats great ... gynest sounds much the same as estriol ovestin ..
i am off to get a tube later 😀 estriol is the much better, kinder, if the three oestrogens our bodies have ...
it says its doesnt effect uterine wall and protects breast so you should be fine
take care ...
jayxx
marlene21102 jayneejay
Posted
I'm sure I remember dr gave me cream,way back,got a feeling that was Ovestin,rang a bell.Boy don't I wish one would fit all females,nothing but hassle. I've been on those Vits B s for 3 days,so far so good with the B6 prob had few years back.Hope anxiety drops nowxxx Mar
jayneejay marlene21102
Posted
i just been into town to fetch mine... 9.99€ it was..
got my natecal ( calcium and vit D) while I was there..
i feel quite dandy today, but its the flushes... i came in ( it is hot though) checked ipad and sweat running off me on the screen.. ( oh delightful) my head and back of neck is sopping... so off for yet another bath...
cant go on like this its obscene hahahahaha
i only weigh 125lb so dont know why this is happening so intensely ...
flush flush flush flush...... if this is full meno then no thank you..
just bought 4 huge bottles of water as all this glowing needs water back in water ...
my dad always says ' dont say sweating'
ladies Glow, Men perspire and horses sweat 😃😃😃😃
hope your okay ... hope the B's perk you up Marlene .. they did me for sure
back soon when i had another bath 🛀
Jay xx
marlene21102 jayneejay
Posted
Hope my girl takes after me,hey you've got a pool ,you could spend day in there.
Your ole dad,shows his age,proper gent ,bless himTell Dottie she glows ,she will like that,that's how the Victorians described it,they use to carry smelling salts ,that was for light headed ness. My mum would be your dad's age,hers was a giddy turn .Can recall her going to the back door to get air. Odd things you remember,Dottie quiet today?
Ever find screw to those glasses ?xx
jayneejay marlene21102
Posted
well i unfortunately didnt take after my mums peri... she was 2 years start to finish aged 42 - 44 ... done... natural and i remember her having an underactive thyroid, no energy and drinking sanatogen wine ... ( shes no drinker ) this was suppose to up her iron...
weird what you remember .. she is 83 now, when i speak to her she says, are you still doing the menopause mallarky ' good lord' hahahaha
i did the iodine patch test last night, blimey mine vanished .... so i am restarting the iodine of kelp again when it arrives..
no... didnt find screw to specs .... they were my old pair which i favour, so its made me wear the new ones now, which i should anyway.. I can take a screw out a really old pair and repair them... they are vary focal ... imwear in house, i chop and change between contacts and glasses ..
will be in pool tomorrow .... had things to do today so gave it a miss..
enjoy your evening marlene
jay jay xx
marlene21102 jayneejay
Posted
Your mum was lucky,your iffy meno gene from your dad's side.
Malarkey haven't heard that said for a while.think again you have to go through it to understanding it,or even try,distant memory to your mum.
My mums was brought on by the death of my 4 month old brother from whooping cough in 1951.Called it shock meno for her,sad she had it really bad ,again what you remember.lifes a bitch that for sure .xxx
jayneejay marlene21102
Posted
oh thats sad about your little brother ... big hugs..
dont know much about my Dads female family side.. hes one of three boys, there was a girl, was a sister but she died in child birth ....
oh all sadness ay..
His Mother My grandma died when i was just 7 years old, which i saw and it was a memory that i still see vividly...
my Dad has had PMT of a male type all his life 😀
oh ... so you discussed sanatogen only yesterday.. spooky
my mum was told to drink a Maccason is it... she didnt like it .. yak
jay xx
jayneejay marlene21102
Posted
i spelt it wrong ..
its was Mackeson my mum was told to drink back in the day..
Mackeson "looks good, tastes good and, by golly, it does you good.
remember the advert 😀😃😃😃
Jay xx
marlene21102 jayneejay
Posted
7 was young age to witness your gran,my youngest sister was 8.
Oldest was 18,sad old time hey,yes you never forget ,at times you go back ,me and the eldest bring that night up at times,imprinted in your memory.
Your dad wasn't very old to loose his mum ,lost mine at 31.
Love the bit of your dad having PMT all his life,bless him.
Yea spooky us talking yesterday about mums Sanatogen ,as it began talking about menopause ,as eldest sister having probs still,and my girl was here.so she had a listen in to tales about her nans menopause .
Don't recall mum and what your mum took.
jayneejay amelia_38073
Posted
abit more info, from a different scoure on web .. To share ....
Estriol the kinder choice..
To understand menopause, it’s imperative to know more about your hormones, estrogen and progesterone. When a woman hits her 30s, blood levels of estrogen and progesterone gradually decline as nature intended because the childbearing years are over.
In the ’60s, more than half of the 30 million postmenopausal women in this country were prescribed esterified estrogens (usually from a horse) as the antidote to aging. However, about that same time, studies began showing that these women were five times more likely to develop uterine cancer and an increased prevalence of breast cancer than the women who did not take this estrogen replacement therapy.
There are three types of estrogens in a woman’s body that work like a symphony to safely produce the desired effects. The three types of estrogen are estrone (E1), estradiol (E2), and estriol (E3).
However, estrone and estradiol have now been shown to be *'carcinogenic when given by themselves unopposed with progesterone, while estriol has been found to be * anti-carcinogenic and therefore protects the body from the harmful effects of the other two.
Because natural products in this country cannot be patented, all of the current estrogen drugs used in this country are combinations of synthetic copies of estrone and estradiol.
Estriol is considered the “forgotten” estrogen. It has been labeled historically in the U.S. as a weak or ineffective estrogen.
However, in Europe, estriol has been recognized for its benefits and has been used for years. I like to call estriol the anti-estrogen, and the need to use a safer form of estrogen seems crucial at this time. One of the most exciting things about estriol is the fact that it exhibits considerable evidence showing that it protects against breast cancer and even shows promise in reducing the brain lesions of multiple sclerosis. Fear of cancer prevents many women from restoring youthful hormone levels. We have also found when large quantities of estrone and estradiol need to be removed from the blood stream, probiotics, vitamin B6, fiber, fish oil, and calcium-D-glucarate (you find this in apples and oranges), will also help the elimination process. The pith of tangerines and oranges is especially good for this. When estriol is applied through the topical (transdermal) route; estriol is not associated with increased cancer risk because estriol has a much lower affinity for binding to blood protein as compared to estradiol; therefore, a greater percent is available for biological activity. Other methods women can use to prevent hormone-related cancers include consuming abundant vitamin D, cruciferous vegetables, soy, D-glucarate, and lignans, while minimizing meat and high-fat dairy intake.