Estrogen creams/inserts and joint pain
Posted , 4 users are following.
Hello! I am 45 and in the grip of peri-menopause. I've been dealing with vaginal dryness and AV for at least 2 years. When my estrogen level was last tested it came back as less than 5. Hardly anything. I have hot flashes sometimes as well. In order to keep the awful dryness and urinary urgency/pain symptoms at bay, I have to use some kind of estrogen. I've tried to do without and the symptoms always come roaring back. Estogen definitely helps, but the problem is my body is super sensitive to even topical estrogen. Right now I'm trying Imvexxy two times a week plus using a tiny bit of permarin cream externally when needed. Prior to that I'd tried using only Premarin cream. My joints and the tendons around my joints start to swell and get sore when I use these products for any length of time.
Does anyone have experience with the joint pain side effect and a suggestion of an Estrogen formulation that did not cause it?
I also tried Intrarosa (DHEA cream) but I really did not notice it helping the genitourinary symptoms like estrogen does.
Thanks in advance for any advice . . . and I have to say this condition just stinks. It makes a sex life all but impossible.
0 likes, 10 replies
Gigi368 sally77999
Posted
Sally,
I use Estrace cream, zero side effects. I tried Vagifem and I had leg cramps with that. Same estrogen just delivered in different ways, only thing I can think of was maybe a filler in the pill for the vagifem caused it. But I'm very happy with the Estrace cream, its restored all my moisture, plumped things back up, repaired my tissues and most of all my bladder is HAPPY lol. The dosage is weak enough that very little enters your blood stream if any, so my doc gave me the ok to use as much or as little as I need.
I hope you find something that works for you and this helped a bit... I'm also very sensitive to meds so I understand reluctance to try stuff and stick with it.
sally77999 Gigi368
Posted
Thank you, Gigi368. I will ask my Gyn about Estrace and see what she says.
Guest sally77999
Posted
Hi Sally,
Interesting that you say your estrogen gave you problems with joints and tendons. I have been using a compounded estradiol but for the past few months have had tendon pain and knee pain and I know I didn't hurt either one. Now I am wondering whether this new pain (which I never have had in my life) may be due to estradiol cream! Curious, what is your weight and your body mass index? A doc told me that your estrogen can fluctuate with body mass and fat mass. All of my friends who are heavier than I have NO trouble with the estrogen issue. I am on the low end of the body mass for my height and weight but don't want to put on 10 lbs just o see if it would help. What's your diet like? What lotions have youtried?
Have you looked either on earthclinic.com or the yahoo site for these issues? Might be some help there.
biscuit
sally77999 Guest
Posted
eggbiscuit, my pain actually started in just one knee. I thought perhaps I'd bumped it. Then it started creeping up in the other. Then a few weeks later a little bit in my elbows. It's all bursitis/joint type of stuff that I don't normally ever have. Drug-induced lupus is a worry in my family so I fear this could be the estrogen. My doctor said it can definitely cause it in certain people. So ... ugh! I fluctuate between a size 8 and 10 these days, although 6 to 8 is my normal size. It's so hard to keep it off the middle since all of this perimenopause. I really have to shave my calories and I do love chocolate! I guess I'm going to have to stop with the Imvexxy and premarin and see if the joint/tendon pains ease up. Of course that means everything else "down there" will go south again.
I will try coconut oil and other stuff in the meanwhile to try and hold things at bay as best I can while I see if the imvexxy/premarin is the culprit. My doctor said it can take 6 weeks to really get the estrogen effect out of the system if that's what's doing it so it will take some time to figure it out. If it is . . .
Guest sally77999
Posted
Hi Sally,
This is very interesting. Not good, I know, but interesting. You have auto-immune problems... I also have thyroid antibodies but have had them forever. I am 64 now and generally healthy and in good physical shape. HOWEVER---yes, the pounds do seem to come on even when you're not eating as much. I have cut out sugar but, not beer or liquor as it relieves pain. Six to 8 is my normal size as well. I do feel you on that. Do you exercise? Just to be clear, your pain is IN your knee joint and your doc said it was possible to get this pain from topically applied estrogen? I realize the Imvexxy is a suppository but my doc said those things and the estrace type creams do not get absorbed into your system like oral estrogen would.
Today I had a biopsy of the place that hurts. I went in worried but the procedure itself was not that bad. Very quick. Then the numbing agent wore off and OMG. The pain I had before was negotiable with cushions or adjustments but now, after this procedure, cutting out even a little bit of skin seems to have set all the nerves on fire.
On Earth Clinic dot com (can't put links here I don't know why) you will find lots of recommendations for a wide variety of symptoms. I encourage you to check it out. You are also welcome to private message me. I knowhow you feel and I care.
sally77999 Guest
Posted
Thank you, eggbiscuit. Yes. Knee joints and bursa. Elbows too. And a knuckle or two has joined in. Premarin cream topically applied vaginally. And a tiny bit at that. I've never taken any oral estrogen. My doctor said topically applied creams absolutely do still get in the bloodstream to a degree, and that amount can affect some people more than others. Some have no problems at all. Others do. It's a bummer. My last application was on Thursday night so I'm hoping to see at least some sign of joint/tendon relief in a few weeks of not using either Imvexxy or Premarin at all to let me know if this is the root of the problem. It's the only new thing I've done so I strongly suspect it is. But I will let you know how it turns out! So sorry about your knee and biopsy. That sounds miserable and I hope the procedural pain quiets down soon for you. This WOULD be a good time for a little chocolate.
Guest sally77999
Posted
Hi Sally,
Yes, chocolate, liquor, pasta.... all the things one should limit!
Interesting that your topical application has done that. I am going to have to look in all of our medical journals to see what that's about. That's a story I have never heard. The biopsy pain is much better, thank you and, I began using EmuAid on the area. Seems to be helping!
I imagine you have anxiety over all of this besides the pain. Do you meditate? I am trying to get back to that with some success and must spend around an hour outdoors everyday. That helps. We are in the southern US but it is getting cold here as well, too early. I will post what I find from the medical journals . As a professor I can get hundreds of med journals and over time, have learned to read them.
take care, biscuit
sally77999 Guest
Posted
Fabulous, thank you. I'm in the midwest so outdoor meditating is not so pleasant right now. But I do try and take time periodically to just decompress, deep breathe, be in the moment. This has been a rough year and my body choosing now to go into mid-life hysterics is not helping. But one day at a time - for all of us! 😃
Guest sally77999
Posted
Sally,
I am from the midwest so I know what you mean and I see what you're going through now...We will get it next week. They will shut down the entire town and there will be no milk, bread, beer, water, or frozen pizza in any store. Hah. But enough of that. I did a search in our medical database/dozens of medical journals and, not only did I not find an inverse relationship between estradiols and joint pain, problems , but, rather, a positive correlation between taking estrogen orally or topically and LESS pain, less inflammation and a decrease in many of these symptoms. Meaning, those who were deficient in estrogen have more problems Those who took some estrogen had less pain and fewer problems. I'd ask that doc again. Did this pain only come on with taking the estrogen?
Intrarosa is DHEA (dihydroepiandosterone) and that includes both testosterone and estrogen. Our body can convert some testosterone to estrogen. Body builders take DHEA and you can buy tablets over the counter. Did the DHEA bring on the joint pain? How soon after you used the Imvexxy/premarin did the pain come on? Might it have been caused by some of the inactive ingredients in those products? Maybe you need compounded estrogen with no preservative? Coconut oil?
Been a totally rough year for me too and I can't help but think that has something to do with it.... 😃
Hang in.
bis
sally77999
Posted
Thanks for this. I've found studies that connect estrogen and lupus/RA/autoimmune disease so I will see if I can dig those out. A few say for the better, but most said IF one is predisposed, it can be bad. I am trying the coconut oil and other moisturizing stuff. One other thing I had to start doing about 5 months ago is taking oral progesterone USP for 10 days a month to keep the flow on track (so endometrial lining doesn't get too think from months of no period and then wham). Maybe it's the progesterone too or the combo? I'm skipping that this month as well. for better or worse. Take care and I will let you know how my symptoms do over time.