fed up

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I am feel particularly fed up .. Having been sailing along quite nicely on my Evorel patch(which I cut in half) for many years. (I'm 66)..However, In October 2015 year my GP decided I had to try and stop?? I complied (idiot) and felt so awful that after a couple iof weeks I stuck a full patch on to alleviate the symptoms. The whole patch was too much for me I had very sore boobs and spotting so I started cutting it down. I cut it down to a half (where I started) and for some reason now it did'nt stop the flushes. So Last Oct 2016 I upped the dose by a small amount and since then I have had spotting after spotting/bloating/wind/actual period pains etc., ..  culminating this last week with red and brown blood. I just wish it would settle down But I know every time you mess around with the dose you will get spotting.. Sorry for the rant ladies I just needed to reach out.. anyone else having these problems? Please let me know! 

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  • Posted

    Having read your post, I wonder why you have not been back to ask your doctor what has gone wrong. I presume that he gave you more prescriptions for the patches that you are using or did you have a stock pile at home?  It strikes me that you need to change to something completely different. Speak to your doctor, ask to be referred to the hormone clinic. I have been on HRT for years and years and I have friends who are a lot older than I and they too are taking HRT still. You are not an expert and should never self prescribe when you do not understand the way these patches/tablets work.  All you are doing is frightening yourself and making yourself unwell. Get an appointment with your GP or Gynacologist as soon as possible and get yourself sorted out. Good luck.

     

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    • Posted

      I understand how they work. My GP does not approve of HRT. I have been on Evorel for 14 years so I believe I have a good understanding. I am trying to find the correct doseage and with that comes the problems I have. Whenever a doseage on whatever HRT you are taking is altered it can lead to the spotting I mentioned. My GP is fully aware of what I am trying..
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  • Posted

    I wish these drs would stop causing problems with our health because of their own personal biases.  They have not done the research.  But now he/she is getting lots more visits out of you, isn't he?

    I am sorry you are going through this.  I have been on oestradiol since an early hysterectomy more than 26 years ago.  Yes, I have had a dr or two tell me how dangerous it is - they read the flawed research from years ago.  So we have to arm ourselves with new evidence.

    I started with implants - wonderful things, however a 12 month would only last me 9 months.  Then they stopped making those and I had to move on to patches - itchy, rashy things which did not last me the full period so I had to top up with daily gel.  Found a compound chemist who makes the implants, great, except they did not do as well as the originals (supposed to be exactly the same).  Only lasted 6 months and I kept having head sweats which I put down to other things for which I was constantly trying to find solutions.

    My implant suddenly failed - well not really, thinking back I had symptoms for a month or so, so I applied a patch - no head sweats, sweet.  So my problem was really not getting enough oestrogen.  My body really needs a good supply of oestrogen to function well.  I had tried taking pregnenolone to help extend my implant but it did not do so.  Perhaps the strength was not enough, but my gp is scared about it because of her ignorance.

    I had also upped my dose of vit D3 to 6000 units per day as per jeff baker md because he has listed a whole host of issues that insufficient vit D3 causes, including head sweats.  But I really think it is more oestrogen that works for me.  The patches only last me about 2 days now instead of the 3 days (supposed to last 3.5 days) so I have found it better to gel in morning and gel again after shower late afternoon.  I am not going to be mean with myself anymore.  I have enough other problems, I don't want to suffer from low oestrogen as well.

    BTW, I am going on 66 too, and my ovaries were removed as well because of extensive endometriosis.  An enlightened dr prescribed progestogen to reduce the affect oestrogen has on activating feral endometriosis cells left behind, but I can't say it actually made any difference.  Last year I stopped taking the progestogen because I thought it might have been causing my head sweats.

    The patches I use are Estraderm MX 100, and as I am doing this, I can feel the itch from the patch.  However, I am not giving up this magic stuff.

    Keep working on it Pat, but perhaps a visit to a menopause clinic may help you better if there is such a thing where you live.

    Drs who force us off hrt for no good reason should be skinned alive imo!!  smile

     

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    • Posted

      Thank you so much Sheryl for your supportive words and experiences. Yes, some GP's are dinosaurs! It has taken me so long to try and get to the place I was before I was taken off my patches!. I am perservering and hopefully soon it will all setttle down once again. i have booked myself in to have another word with my Doc (have to wait a month to see him now). I wish you all the best. I'll keep you posted as to the outcome. Fingers crossed! smile 

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    • Posted

      Hi Sheryl and Pat,

      when I read about your uphill battles and think about mine too, I realise that the change of life can be a positive nightmare for some of us. Like yourselves, I could not exist without my HRT and when all has settled down to normal,you forget how awful it was. This forum is perfect for sharing our experiences and hopefully will help other women experiencing all the different ways we can be affected. I am so impressed by Sheryl's understanding of oestrogen and progesterone ....I have never even tried to find out about the advantages or disadvantages of these hormone drugs, just pop a tablet into my mouth,swallow and expect great results!

      do not let any doctor tell you that you cannot have your prescription for your patches or tablets...find another GP if necessary. I live in Northern Ireland and we have the most wonderful doctors ..I can get an appointment to see them within a day or two...never more. I think a month is appalling , far too long to have to wait to speak with your medical advisor.

      keep going ladies and all will be well.

      Rosemary.

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    • Posted

      I phoned the compound chemist company yesterday and spoke to a pharmacist (female this time).  She told me the implants were only meant to last 4-5 months - new one to me.  And obviously my oestrogen was waning well before the 6 months but I kept putting my symptoms down to other reasons, and I could not think why I was feeling depressed as well as being distressed from my cooking head.  Then when I started getting waves of anxiety and arrythmia, and immediately I realised it was because I had run out of oestrogen.  After putting on a half patch that I had left, within 15 mins I was cool, foggy brain and other symptoms gone and I was able to get off my butt and do what I had to do that day.  So that confirmed it.

      The compound chemist pharmacist also told me to order 150 mg implant next instead of 100mg as it was obvious my body needed it, and SOME OF US NEED MORE AS WE GET OLDER.  It won't last longer - just give me the full relief I need.

      What an enlightment.

      Also, Pat, if you still have your uterus, you are supposed to take progesterone/gen? as well to prevent spotting, and such problems with your uterus.

      I went in search of what was the optimal level of oestrogen for menopause.  This is the answer from a dr from the University Hospital of Leicester NHS trust.

      "There are no true optimal levels but there are general guides to optimise individual treatment regimens.

      For oestradiol, the benchmark is a CURE of vasomotor symptoms and vaginal dryness which could be achieved by levels around 200pmol/l.  Bone protection, however while can be helped at lower doses, maintaining levels above 250pmol/l can cover over 94% of women.  Levels of up 1200pmol/l are sometimes required to maintain symptom free state.  As to the progesterone, levels are generally not helpful but if the withdrawal bleeding occurs at the end of the progesterone phase without intermenstrual bleeding and in the absence of adverse effect then the dose is adequate for endometrial protection.  We have published menstrual diaries recordings and interpretations with various progestins, including a dose ranging study of trimegestone.

      As to the testosterone, it is effective on Free Androgen Index of around 4-7% provided adequate oestrogen levels preceed the introduction of testosterone.  Therefore measurement of oestradiol, SHBG and testosterone are required in the management of patients requiring testosterone supplementation."

      So gird your loins, ladies!

       

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    • Posted

      The dr is Farook Al-Azzawl if you want to check out any of his research.  I am yet to do that.
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    • Posted

      Brilliant Sheryl smile You really are a great source of information. My Evorel patch contains both oestreogen and progesterone (equal measures) I'm pretty sure my spotting is from upping my dose, as I do recall this happening before. Apart from this spotting (which is tapering off now ) I feel ok, no sweats, mood seem stable.. I'm all for researching as we are told one thing and then  another, it's so confusing for us women! I was told by a female GP that she 'does not approve of HRT' I hope she's one of the lucky ones then who sail through it.... if not she will re-think her options . 

      Thanks again Sheryl.. you are appreciated smile

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    • Posted

      Actually I don't fully understand progesterone - I know basically why we have to have it when we are menstruating and fertile, and post menopause if we still have our uterus.

      But that it is an antagonist to oestrogen, some medicals sites saying it is important to our well being - just read it helps us have a peaceful sleep, keeps our weight balanced - and others that it causes bad moods, sweating, and other unhappy stuff.

      As an antagonist to oestrogen, does it reduce the efficiency of oestrogen (for those who are in or post menopause)?  I have not got my head around it as I have not studied it enough.

      A puzzle.

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    • Posted

      Thanks Pat - One would think that by upping the dose then the progesterone increases too to protect your uterus.

      As I said to grannyrose I don't fully understand progesterone or progestogen.  Perhaps if I had not had a hysterectomy I would study it more.

      I do know that that the scripts we are given for it are a drug pretending to be a hormone.  Therefore it would not work exactly as natural progesterone does.  I asked my gp for a script for bio-identical progesterone from the compound chemist but she said I could not have that and pregnenolone as well.  I was running out of my allotted time and had more to deal with my gp, so I left the question why for another time.

       

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    • Posted

      Hi Sheryl. It IS a minefield! I watched a programme on BBC2 a couple of nights ago outlining the many problems women go through when reaching menopause. The guidelines are conflicting and fuzzy and so many women are reluctant to ask their GP's for HRT. Too many GP's have been misinformed or are unsympathetic. The main point of the documentary was to lift the taboo on talking about the menopause and encouraging women to speak about any problems they are going through. They have found that some women are genetically predisposed to Flushing and mood swings, there is hope that now these genes (14 of them) have been identified, something can be done to alleviate the misery .. I do hope so for the sake of all women going through a nightmare. Thanks again for all your help, much appreciated. x

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