Frozen shoulder - choices of treatment

Hi everyone

It's really interesting to hear a range of experiences because those of us who have had more than one FS seem to have had more pain on one side than the other. If it's true that the dominant side is more painful - certainly the case in my own experience - then perhaps the extra aggravation of HAVING to move it so much more is the cause. This would back the theory that doing nothing, and certainly not physio, may help to speed up the recovery time. Easier said than done though and I hope I never have to test out this theory in the future! Good luck to you all and I hope that any new sufferers exploring this website may benefit from our stories, I know it has helped me to know I'm not alone; sympathising with each other has been a good source of support.

What I have noticed.. is that anyone that preservered for a period of time before seeking treatment seems to find the treatment useful. In other words they could have been at the point of changing stages... from freezing to frozen or frozen to thawing. I am right handed.. my left shoulder is frozen and my right is working on it. So far the pain has not been as bad on the right. I think partly because the other was sooooooo bad that I have a higher tolerance now. I'm not pushing the right at all, in hopes of stopping the process... I know wishful thinking. I would try anything to stop it... I dread losing my ability to wipe my own butt, wash my hair, etc. Any experience on this??

Hi

Firstly, in response to Heatherl, I don't think there's anything to worry about in terms of the FS symptoms becoming permanent. Most ex sufferers will agree that it returns to normal eventually, perhaps with a different time span for each individual. This all points to the fact that there is usually nothing intrinsically wrong with the shoulder. I'm a decorator, and whenever I had it (3 times, each lasting 10 - 12 months) I found that When I was standing I could still work as long as I didn't raise the offending arm above shoulder height, or try to reach around behind me. Both of these movements seemed to be the main aggravators. I also had trouble washing, shaving etc but only in the first few months. However, when I sat down, or lay down, the pain just intensified. So I had to find sleeping positions where this effect wasn't so bad, and I think once I'd experimented a bit and got the hang of it, it started to improve. My sofa proved invaluable. I now believe that its the position of the neck when we sleep which determines the severity of the symptoms. It may well be slightly different for everyone, depending on their different vulnerabilities and tolerances, but I suspect the source and the key to treatment is the same. I think I could go to 5 different professionals for advice and find that they advise 5 different treatments !

It was nice to read that other posters had similar experiences, and I'd hope that that should help with reassuring those who are new to it.

Gerry

I do not think I got thru so call Pain-Freeze stage, of course I am not sure there is any Thawing stage, because I gone thru a MUA, which it did help by getting my range of motion back within week. However the pain still there, at the shoulder joint, and sleep still a problem.

I just like to find out when some one say he/her shoulder get frozen up, is it mean it is the pain that prevent he/she to move further? Or the shoulder just frozen up without pain but cannot move to the range once it can, such as we cannot rotate our head all the way to the back, but when we try, it just stop to the limit but without any pain.

In my case of frozen shoulder, it is the pain that prevent me from going further, such as only able to elevate from hand rest at the side position up to about 120 deg to the front with arm straighten, normaly we should able to go up to as far as 180deg. It is the pain that prevent me from execute the movement, it was not just frozen. So I do not know what is the common saying that there is a Pain-Frozen-Thawing stages. I felt the Pain & Frozen are togehter all the time.

Hi

The term Frozen is used in the metaphorical sense that normal movement is restricted within certain limits, otherwise it causes pain. The limit differs for everyone, at different stages, but a good common denominator would be raising the arm to just about shoulder height before the pain kicks in. Its still possible to raise above this height, its just too painfull. And, of course, the pain can also intensify in certain sitting and lying down positions with no raising of arm whatsoever ( yet another reason for suspecting that its not the shoulder itself which is causing the pain). So, the shoulder isn't 'frozen' as such.....its simply restricted. There is no 'thawing out'.....but there is an easing of the restriction (hopefully) , usually over a set period of time until the problem resolves itself (again hopefully). It does seem that some people get more restriction...i.e only ably to raise arm a matter of inches, and with some people it takes longer to resolve, but these are usually the exeptions to the rule ( I know, not very helpful if its you ). With regard to movements and exercising, i think its obvious what the shoulder is trying to tell us.......don't extend your arm beyond the points where pain kicks in. If a need is felt to have to exercise it, always stay within the pain-free limits allowed, and it will most likely heal sooner. Why the Physios always seem to insist on testing yourself against the pain is just beyond my comprehension. You wouldn't normally see a need to have to exercise your shoulder, so why should it become necessary when your shoulder is even more vulnerable. Crazy !

Hi Jerry, thanks for all the useful information , it has given me hope that after 9 months of agony that no one seems to understand there maybe a light at the end of the tunnel without extremes of painful exercises and operations not sure how long mine will last but reading all the comments certainly gives one hope and the knowledge one is not alone.thanks to all who ate the time to write.

My pleasure. And here's a tip that might help. Try taking an afternoon nap on a sofa. Make it comfortable for your neck when you rest it on the arm of the sofa by using some soft pillows. Lie sideways with the offending shoulder on the sofa (not on the pillow because that raises it), and tuck your arm tightly into ribs. Cover well to keep yourself warm, and see how you feel when you wake half an hour or hour later. Might need a couple of days to get an effect because thats how long it can take the neck to adjust. Used to work for me, to the point where sometimes I would get up in the night and do it. Less bed and more sofa definitely kept the pain from becoming intolerable. Also, if you can take a nap in an upright position, in an armchair for instance, with your head rested upright against some pillows, it can work as well. These positional adjustments can help to break the cyclical nature of the symptoms, whereas doing the same routines like always sleeping in the same bed in the same positions just encourages the cyclical spasm. At first it will seem irritating or awkward to have to change your usual cosy routines, but it really can help to improve things, and if the result turns out to be less pain....its a winner.

Gerry

Does anyone else have terrible 'crepitus' along with this? Creaking and cracking with even the slightest neck movements, and loud pops in the elbows? Mine are so loud and cracking...I sound like a one man band going up the stairs!

Hi Gerry; My FS started back in Feb, with a little pain which increased until June when it became unbearable. I started sleeping on the lazy boy in March... because that was the only way to get any sleep. Since June I have slept sitting up in the crook of the sectional sofa. I use one of the U shaped travel pillows to support my neck and have 3 other pillows that I use to prop my neck and arms. Since the cortesone shot 3 weeks ago.. I tried the lazy boy again.. and managed 1 1/2 hour sleep on it. The result of 3 sleeps on the lazy boy... the right arm got worse. Its this Friday (72 hrs) that I will have a therapeutic arthrogram. Here is the link for those interested. www.hospitalnews.com/humber-river-regional-hospitals-cutting-edge-imaging-procedure-unlocking-frozen-shoulder/ I will report in afterwards.

Gerry the neck, you wrote >> Usually, with frozen shoulder, there is absolutely nothing wrong with the shoulder itself. Mostly it results from a trapped or threatened trapped nerve in the cervical spine (the neck).<

i'm sorry - i don't want to appear confrontational - but where on earth did you get that information, as it is totally not what i have learned about frozen shoulder. i was told it has absolutely nothing to do with trapped nerves and is everything to do with tendonitis and damage to the rotator cuff. i'm="" sorry="" -="" i="" don't="" want="" to="" appear="" confrontational="" -="" but="" where="" on="" earth="" did="" you="" get="" that="" information,="" as="" it="" is="" totally="" not="" what="" i="" have="" learned="" about="" frozen="" shoulder.="" i="" was="" told="" it="" has="" absolutely="" nothing="" to="" do="" with="" trapped="" nerves="" and="" is="" everything="" to="" do="" with="" tendonitis="" and="" damage="" to="" the="" rotator="" cuff.="">

i'm sorry - i don't want to appear confrontational - but where on earth did you get that information, as it is totally not what i have learned about frozen shoulder. i was told it has absolutely nothing to do with trapped nerves and is everything to do with tendonitis and damage to the rotator cuff. >

Hi

That's ok. It's an important question to ask. Many professionals will refer to Frozen Shoulder as either Adhesive Capulitis or Rotator Cuff Damage, and they will use that as a reason to justify interventions. I don't know for sure how valid their description is. But I do know that in the circumstances where a condition (FS) resolves itself in time, leaving no apparent evidence of long lasting damage, that its only right to ask the question whether there was any damage in the first place. Their description suggests there was damage to begin with, but where does that 'damage' go ? If it just healed by itself it would still leave evidence and vulnerabilities for the future. This doesn't seem to happen. It is possible that if Rotator Cuff damage was there prior to the FS setting in, but unnoticeable, then it might become highlighted with the onset of FS. I don't know.

However, FS is usually initiated with some physical movement, in my case simply reaching behind to get something from back seat in car. It doesn't result from an actual accident, where some damage to the shoulder would obviously set something off. So, what is the cause of the rotator cuff damage ? Simple movements don't create this sort of damage. Also a lot of people tend to get FS in both shoulders at different times. What are the chances that they would have the same rotator cuff damage in both shoulders....minimal ! And if the FS is a result of damage, why doesn't it get worse if that damage isn't corrected ?

For me, there are too many reasons pointing to no actual problem with shoulder itself. There may well be such a thing as rotator cuff damage, but I doubt that it has anything to do with the most likely cause of FS. I've had cervical spondylosis (neck nerve problems) for many years and I've come to see FS as a typical recurring side symptom of that C/S condition. I've had FS 3 times. I've never had any interventions (injections or surgery), it hasn't recurred for over 10 years, and today my shoulder feels perfectly normal.

My sympathies to anyone who is experiencing FS at the moment, but I will say be wary of over exercising and interventions which might leave damage. If I was going to be cynical I might say that those who advise serious interventions might be inclined to describe the condition in a way which justifies their opinion.

Gerry

Just something I wanted to share, when I first went to my doctors about my FS the first question he asked me was " had I been tested for diabetes" he then sent me off for the test, he says that FS is the first sign you may have diabetes. Just thought it was worth mentioning. Glad to say I'm feeling a lot better but still dread my other side becoming a FS as I'm starting to get the symptoms, fingers crossed it won't develop but from what I hear if its going to develop into a FS there is nothing you can do to stop it

PS.......Just an afterthought. Let them produce the evidence before they advise therapies which might have more permanent repercussions. I wouldn't want to make choices based on educated guesswork.

G

I reply to Summer alex. FS doesn't occur regardless. You may have a vulnerability to it, but if you're careful with your movements, particularly reaching overhead or to the rear, it may never happen. We're probably most vulnerable during the winter months when the neck can be a bit stiffer from the cold, or perhaps when we have a flu or a cold, because everything is that little bit more strained and liable to be irritated.

Gerry - ok, you are not a GP... With all respect, still waiting for you to produce evidence (link, website etc) to back up your statement that FS "Mostly results from a trapped or threatened trapped nerve in the cervical spine (the neck)"

thanks!