How is it that in 2014 the only option to detect cervical cancer is by having a smear?

Posted , 11 users are following.

I have not had one for years as it is so painful and humiliating. The nurses at my GP's arent very patient or reassuring and all they can say is "relax". How is it possible to relax when is stranger is forcing something into your vagina? Its like legalised assault. I got a bee in my bonnet on the matter and found an article by a female GP about the CSA test, I also found this:

There's a new blood test - it's called the CSA Test (Cervical Specific Antigen) - it was patented in around 2004 - unlike the unreliable pap smear - this simple blood test is almost 100% accurate..

So if it was patented in 2004 why is it not available?  Men would not enjoy having a trowel shoved into their rectums so why do women have to suffer such pain and humiliation?

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  • Posted

    I think you are exaggerating.   For most people its uncomfortable and/or embarrassing.  But it is worth doing.  I havent heard about this other test.  Certainly if its more reliable and does away with the need for smear tests then I am all for it.  Some women find the smear test painful, but its a small minority. And it may be partly becuase yiu are tense. Please don't put people off doing something which can be lifesaving.       
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    • Posted

      I am not exaggerating and it is far from a small minority if you care to research the subject as I have. How can you not be tense with a virtual stranger forcing an object into your most intitmate area? I have not mentioned in my post telling women not to have a smear test so please read my post properly and research before making such sweeping statements.
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  • Posted

    because you are tense,..sorry about mistakes.
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  • Posted

    This is what patient.info says about it.                                                                   You will be asked to remove your clothing from the waist down. If you wear a loose skirt, you may only need to remove your knickers. You will be asked to lie on your back on the examination couch. You should bend your knees, put your ankles together, and let your knees fall open. A doctor or nurse will put an instrument called a speculum into your vagina. This gently opens the vagina and allows the cervix to be seen (at the top of the vagina). The doctor or nurse then uses a thin plastic stick with a small brush at the end to gently scrape some cells from the surface of the cervix. The cells that are obtained on the brush are sent away to be examined in the laboratory.

    Cervical screening tests are not painful, although some women find the speculum uncomfortable. It generally helps if you can relax - this makes the experience better for you and easier for the person taking the sample. The newer disposable plastic specula are also a lot less cold than the older metal ones!

    I will research the figures, but no one I know has ever had the feeling that something was being "forced" inside them.  You didnt mention telling women not to have a smear test, but you make it sound so frightening that anyone reading it would be scared stiff, they would probably tense up too and make the test more difficult.The speculum does not go in as far as a penis. there is nothing to fear.  

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    • Posted

      "I will research the figures, but no one I know has ever had the feeling that something was being "forced" inside them."

      I just wondered which figures you meant? Are any figures kept for painful smear tests?

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    • Posted

      you are kidding i am 61 and have many smear tests all were dreadful but the last one when the nurse assaulted me shows that women are not safe and are at the mercy of the nurse/doctor doing the test.

      in my research i have found hundreds of women who will never have a smear test again, and if hundreds actually complain then 100x more women stay quiet, but will never have a smear test again

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    • Posted

      Absolutely Shirley, dont blame you. Its all very well saying Im exaggerating but just because one person thinks its just a case of laying back and thinking of England/Canada/Australia many many women cant. It is like being assaulted, and it is having a foreign object forced into you. If those who dont believe still think its all blown up, Google painful smear tests and see for youselves. Sorry you were hurt Shirley.
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    • Posted

      Well done, Shirley for speaking up about this. I too had 2 tests forced on me when I was pregnant and again at a postnatal torture session, both clearly against my will, as is apparent from my medical notes, which I later viewed.

      The programme is a flagrant violation of human rights and the NHS should be in the European Court of Human Rights for carrying out these abusive procedures on women, many of whom have suffered years of coercion and bullying from doctors who are putting target hitting above the care of their patients. It is a national scandal and disgrace this continues. The cervical screening programme costs the taxpayer £175 million, and about half of this goes to GP's in cash bonuses to get 80% of their women patients to submit to this test. So much for informed consent.

      From my own personal experience this has permanently damaged many doctor/patient relationships for good. It has long been known that women who are not HPV positive cannot get cervical cancer, yet most are wrongly informed (deliberately so) by medical staff that they need this test, when really it is about the doctor wanting his cash bonus. A shocking misallocation of financial resources, when you consider that about 10 million people a year cannot even book a doctor's appointment.

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    • Posted

      I just noticed this post. The next Mrs D said this." it is far from a small minority if you care to research the subject as I have" .  I have copied it from her post. i assumed there were figures if she was claiming to know this. however I dont have enough time at the minute to research it.
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    • Posted

      what really shocked me about the assualt  by the nurse  doing my smear test, is when  i complained to the police, they told me although they know that this sort of thing happens often they can take no action because i had signed the form giving permission for my smear test, so you have it in a nutshell you are not safe and at the mercy of the nurse/doctor.

       

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    • Posted

      I'm glad you went to the police, I am surprised that they think because you signed a form that entitles them to asault you. You signed a form to have a smear, a meical procedure not to be assaulted in the process. As we are often told by the media and medical profession they do not hurt they are merely "uncomfortable". So if you went to the dentist and had a tooth extraction and signed a form, does that give the dentist the right to shove a drill from B&Q in your mouth and start drilling at it?
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    • Posted

      LET THIS BE A WARNING TO ALL WOMEN WHO PUT THEMSELVES AT THE MERCY OF N.H.S STAFF

      truth is stranger than fiction and this shows the general public have no rights how they are treated  when it comes to the n.h.s and all other regulating bodies who are supposed to be on the side of the public.  

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    • Posted

      What is this form they get you to sign? My last smear was in 1997 and there were no forms at all then. They didn't even ask for your consent. My GP would put aside whatever it was I had come for, until after the smear. I tried to change doctors, but others in the catchment area, also demanded smearing all new female patients. A total violation.
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    • Posted

      i dont think i have always been asked to sign a form before having a smear test but my surgery shelly manor has certainly done so in the last 8-10 years, perhaps many women complained about the nurse when they were given a smear test so they covered themselves by asking us to sign away human rights i should have read the form but i can now assume it exonerates the nurse from anything that may happen during the smear. i thought all surgeries asked you to sign a form when having a procedure, i also had to sign before having my ears syringed to agree if they perforated my eardrums which they did they were not responsable.but the  nurse told me this verbally before askiing me to sign the form. same nurse who according to my gp has worked in the surgery for 20 years which apparently makes her whiter than white

      tell that to the family victims of dr shipman. ,

       

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    • Posted

      Have you reported this woman to PALS or your local PCT? Or even the nurses register who's name I cant remember. How many other women has she assaulted, and what if she is one of these "dodgy" people that you dont find out about until too late? How about writing to the practice manager, and letting them know you have complained to PALS and the PCT. I reported my mums district nurses to an organisation, who of course I cant remember either, but I will look up the emails and let you know.
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    • Posted

      this incident happened 2 years ago. the nurse inserted the speclum opening it up till i screamed she then continued opening up my cervix despite my even lounder screams she then left me on the couch with speclum inserted went to her desk fiddled around i dont know how long she was away but my screams were piercing this was torture i did not have any idea when it would end and could not stop till she eventually removed the speclum, at the time i was so shocked i could not speak, when leaving the surgery all the receptionist had grins on their faces i was totally devastated.

      when i finally was able to speak about it 2 months later i phoned the police, then contacted the practice manager useless, then p.a.l.s useless again, then n.h.s england even more usless i had already wasted a year, finally i contacted p.h.s.o the health ombudsman what did they do they asked the practice manager to interview the nurse which now was 18 months down the line who says she could not recall me having any discomfort during the smear test and as she had wrote nothing on my records the p.h.s.o desided the nurse had nothing to answer they believed her but the practice manager was found to be lacking keeping accurate reports about my complaint and had not registered  complaints i had made two years ago. i had complained to my gp soon after the incident she even offered councelling, on two furthur occasions during the next year i saw my gp i just could not come to terms with what had happened and needed some sort of help the councelling she had offered had a 6-9 month waiting list. when my gp  was questioned about my talks with her  she said she had no recollection about our discussions and said she would have mentioned  them on my medical records if these discussion had happened. when i saw my gp who i had trusted for 17 years she looked me straight in the eye and denied ever having these discussions with me. i have done everything possible to have my voice heard i just wish i could have spoken immediately before leaving the practice if i had called the police then they would have come to the surgery and it may have had a different outcome.

       

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    • Posted

      I cant believe what I just read. If I were you I would go back to the police, this is now definately assault, or more like ABH. There is a free law forum run by solicitors so ask on there. Its called the  law  forum  dot    co   dot   uk.

      This is truly horrific.

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    • Posted

      i told the police everything i have said on my last post, the police said they would have to make enquires and would call me back. when they called me back they said " we know this sort of thing happens but you agreed to have a smear test " i am considering contacting the police again as they will have the transcript from the first complaint.

      after 2 years i am still very very angry since the attack i am unable to have intimate relations and any intimate examinations are out of the questions.THE NAME IS IMPRINTED ON MY BRAIN I WILL NEVER FORGIVE HER.

      these feelings may seem extreem to anyone who has not suffered in this medieval and barbaric way but i am spitting feathers and will do alll in my power to get justice i am not finished yet.

      Emis Moderator comment: I have edited this and another post to remove an individual's name and other details as we cannot allow comments like this in the forums.

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    • Posted

      You might wish to leave a response on your surgery's ratings page on NHS Choices

      www.nhs.uk/Services/GP/ReviewsAndRatings

      Enter your postcode to find your local surgery. You can rate your surgery here by giving them a number of stars out of 5 and write a brief report about your experiences. I've noticed that your surgery has had good reviews and that the practice manager actually replies to posts patients have made. My own surgery is among the worst and none of the reviews are ever replied to at my surgery.

      Another place you might want to vent your feelings at is:

      patientopinion.org.uk

      They actually contact your surgery about your treatment, and something might be done about it if it is made public.

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    • Posted

      hi informed i wrote my story on n.h.s choises last year and they refused to publish it i have tried again and will keep my fingers crossed

      i have also left responces on my surgery ratings page and suprise suprise they did not publish that either they can pick and chose what they want to post it is true the  practice manager does reply i suspect liike many rated n.h.s bodies a lot of these responces are written by staff to keep it looking good.

      i have had two years to try everything i can to bring the most dreadful experience a women can suffer to light and it is not easy there are people who at all costs will try to silence you.

      i have written my story on every conceivable website.

      but any other suggestions are welcome

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    • Posted

      I am sorry this has happened to you, and I agree with you that any bad experiences from smear tests are blocked by people who have a vested interest in silencing any dissent from the screening programme. They keep peddling the mantra that it is quick, easy and painless.

      I have never agreed or given consent to having a smear test and yet 3 were forced on me during the 1990, when I had seen my GP about other issues. Pregnancy and the postnatal assessment are the times they corner women into having it done, as I found out to my cost. I had been very forthright in my views with my GP, and she had even written in my medical notes that I was "adamant she does not want a smear" and is "vehemently opposed to the screening programme". 6 months later when I had gone to see her about how my childbirth tear was healing the speculum was forced in again, causing me as much pain as when I gave birth. All totally without asking me or even warning me that she was going to give me a smear. She knew I wouldn't agree, and had decided to assault me in order to get her target levels up, and get that cash bonus. If I had been caused so much pain from an assault in the street, I would have been able to take action against my attacker, but these doctors are immune from any charges being brought against them. You can only claim it was a rape, or penetration without consent if it was sexually motivated and the perpetrator did it for sexual gratification. If a doctor says they are doing it for a medical purpose, there is nothing you can do about it, they can cause you all the pain they want. The cervical screening programme is an open door for assaults on women.

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    • Posted

      to follow on

      i emailed my pratice manager for more info regarding the nurse who assaulted me during a smear test, he refused, i reminded him that i can get the info from another source, he then informed me that this nurse no longer works at shelly manor, i then replied just because this nurse no longer works for shelly manor does not immune her or the practice from legal action, as i am appealing to the p.h.s.o on the grounds i have evidence that i did not think  would be taken as proof.

      he thinks this problem  is going away and does not want to take any responsability for his actions by being complicit with the nurse and my gp in a cover up. after two years i am still spitting feathers and just cannot get over not only the assault but the sheer disrespect of shelly manor and my gp

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    • Posted

      If you are taking legal action then let your soliciots do all the ground work! Just tell then her name and where she worked, the assault took place on their premices so they will have to accept it. Good luck with your claim against her. 
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    • Posted

       firstly i will bring to the publics attension by telling my story on every website possible so people gets to know the process and what the health care trusts, p.a.l.s,  p.h.s.o .ombudsman, nmu and g.m.c will do to cover up and protect all wrong doing by nhs staff. if and when i take legal advice it will be very  quickly sorted but without trace, public non the wiser, i am not in it for financial gain.
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    • Posted

      Hello Shirley, I hope you are well.  Yesterday I had one of the most horrific experiences of my life.  I am 60 and a mother of a 30 year old Son.   I have had many smear tests before, so was not worried at all..... I went into the surgery at 9.30 am and waited until nearly 10am to be seen.... I had been in bed for 4 days with a bad dose of the flu....so was feeling really bad and weak... I told the nurse this, as I entered her room...she was very polite and kind and felt relaxed with her......she could see and tell instantly that I was a vulnerable person... I am hard of hearing, very short sighted, and I have a tiny build, I weight 7 stones and 5 ft 3ins.   Her name was Maria, but I had never met her before.. I have been going to that surgery and have the same doctor for over 20 years.   Anyway, she told me to take my underwear off and lay on the bed.... I waited ages for her.... I was relaxed as I knew what was coming..... but to my horror... before I knew it..... she plunged/forced the cold sharp instrument inside me..... I screamed, and cried out in pain... she just carried on.....I was in agony, it was the worst pain I had ever had in my life.......I was sobbing... and she said... its best like this... straight in...... I am still in shock......and I am still sore inside...... now... because I was poorly, I asked to see the doctor while I was there... he gave me some medicine and antibiotics... I didnt mention anything to him..... when i got home, I told my son, and he was very upset and also in shock, that this could happen......I have written to nhs england, but dont hold out much hope.... Luckily, after much research on line... I have found you Shirley.....and now I am wondering if there are any other women who have been so badly assaulted like I was yesterday.... the nurse was obviously a sadistic witch, with no compassion or empathy.... and wonder if she has done this many times...... people need to know whats going on and stop abusers like her, get away with their henious crimes..... yesterday, I felt I was raped and I cant get it out of my head.
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    • Posted

      Mary, I'm so sorry you were treated so callously, I do wonder about some of the people who work in this area. I'd make a complaint to the actual surgery as well. (in writing) Anne Mackie talks about choice in cervical and breast cancer screening but I don't see much respect for these things at the surgery level.

      I don't want to upset you, but it was probably all for nothing anyway, you're very likely to be HPV- which means you can't benefit from smear tests. About 95% of women aged 30 to 60 are HPV- and you can self-test for HPV, easily and with no pain. 

      There are far better ways to deal with the small risk of cervical cancer, if we actually cared about women.

      Once again, so sorry you were put through hell, hope you're feeling better soon. After menopause, smear testing can be very painful, intolerable for some, but the cruel thing is most older women are HPV- and cannot benefit from them anyway. We put most women through this uncomfortable and embarrassing test for nothing...only about 5% of women aged 30 to 60 are HPV+...these are the only women who should be offered a smear test. (the new Dutch program)

      I don't have smear tests, I've never had one, I didn't like the numbers initially knowing the cancer was fairly rare and seeing so many women having unnecessary biopsies and treatments. I was content with my near zero risk of cc, now I know HPV- women are not at risk and cannot benefit.

      The UK will eventually move to HPV primary testing but women will have to fight for HPV self-testing (or pay for it themselves)

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    • Posted

      Hello eliz52, thanks for your mssage.  Yes, I agree with everything you say, and I already know that I am HPV  as I had a smear last year as well... I didnt have any problem with the testing.   I cant stop thinking about what the right thing to do is.... Of course I need to report this nurse, as she could be hurting a lot of people and getting away with it.... its a difficult situation, as the nhs protect their own....I am nothing to them... but I need my docotr and the surgery...I dont want to be blaklisted.. my mum is also a patient there, and we have been for over 20 years.  The more I think about it, the more I am positive that I was assaulted, violated, abused.....she saw me as a vulnerable person, and took advantage.... she obvioulsy loves to inflict physical pain on people.... she should be stopped..... I am thinking of reporting her to the police......as I believe a crime has been comitted.....and as you say.... all for nothing.... never again  will I put myself in such a vulnerable position..  What I am hoping,  is that other people come forward, if they have been at her mercy, there is strength in numbers and we will be heard.......once again thankyou for your time and advice, mary
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    • Posted

      Dear Mary,

      So sorry to hear about what happened to you. As you will see from one of my above posts, I had a large metal speculum rammed into me 6 weeks after I had given birth with an unstitched 2nd degree tear in the 1990's and this also caused me extreme pain. It is terrible that this sort of assault is still going on. In the 1990's, I was simply told it had to be done. It was a violent assault that affects me badly even today.

      Nowadays, there are a number of things you can do:

      Make a complaint to your practice manager at the surgery.

      Complain to Healthwatch and tell them what has happened. They are supposed to take action on any complaints in the NHS and should get back to you.

      Go on to Patient Opinion website and give an account of your experience. They investigate all accounts and will contact your surgery and ask them to respond publicly in reply to your complaint.

      If you believe this nurse had malicious intent then it is a case for the police.

      I opted out of screening in 2003 after I discovered every woman had a legal right to do so. You simply write to your GP telling them that you do not want to receive any more recall letters and no longer wish to participate in the programme, and since then I have had no trouble from them, but I have also had no redress from the assault that was inflicted on me all those years ago.

      I definitely think you should complain.

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