just want your opinion?

I attend an addictions clinic around every two weeks and a womens alcohol group. If i being really honest the group helps for compnay but thats about it, its similar to AA but not quite that full on, we just talk about how things are basically. The addictions clinic is ok but not sure if its really helping to be honest. But still going to go.

I just felt so hurt that on that day of all days he had to even tell me that was the reason why...sorry i would have been so happy to have seen something in the post. He texted me to say that i was just feeling sorry for myself and that i deserved it. I honestly dont know what to do at times. 

He doesnt quite get how alone i am right now. Maybe it does sound like i always feel sorry for myself but right now other than this forum and talking to him/kids on the phone thats it. Its now been 7 weeks since they left... God it has to be better than this eh?! Cant get much worse.

How are things going with you? Hope you are well. It might have seemed like a strange discussion i just wanted to ask as i do question myself so much right now.

 

I think your right if im being honest. If it had been the other way around and he had a problem i would never have encouraged not sending card etc... and i wouldnt have went out of my way to point this out. Just wanted to make sure i wasnt going mad. I need to go and buy some plates

Very hard time right now and i can not say enough how much the support on here means to me.... We all have our journeys and this one is clearly mine, just want it to move on. Obviously its only me that can make that happen, i do get that. Thanks as always Sharon. 

As much as you have a right to your feelings and emotions and desire to move on, he also has a right to his feelings and emotions.  These can't just be swept under the carpet because you don't wish to feel them.  He is justified to feel anger and hurt and disappointment, hence why he needs support too.  You both need to face these uncomfortable situations head on and acknowledge each others feelings and hurt.

These need to be worked through, and you can't just wish him to want to move on.  Moving forwards happens when both people are able to do so, and if that is difficult for you to do together, then there is no shame in having a third party help you channel the emotional side of this more constructively.

I have in the past suggested that he also sought some kind of help, he wont entertain it. I totally agree with what you have said. I am just worried that rather than being a little more positive towards my daughter about the situation that it yet again all comes down to the past rather than moving forward. You have to understand its an unusual situation in the sence that if i was even just living closer to them i would be able to see her and let her know that i am moving on etc love her, do things together etc... right now she is miles away and its not that easy to just jump on a ferry and see them anytime i/we like. I do know what you mean though. I am just not sure if having conversations like that with her is that healthy for any of us. Surely we should all be just trying to move forward? 

Thanks for the reply, what you say is true as always Joanna

It's a very sad situation yes.  I am sure that when 100% of people get married, they would never imagine a situation where kids would be used as pawns in divorces, but it still happens.  Kids are taken by one partner, influenced, and then access denied.  Emotional responses are mostly not as rational as we would like them to be.

If things are not progressing forwards as weeks/months progress, then you have planted the seed for support in his mind, and at least you can refer back to the fact because in the end, he might need to.  Hopefully, the two of you can work it out together, but sometimes the hurt is just too deep (on one, or both sides).

Until then, I feel you are going to have to try deal with the situation the best you can.  Be sensitive to his feelings, allow him to 'air' what he needs to air because nothing is likely to move forwards until he has got all of this out of him. 

It's not rational, it's not the way it should be in an ideal world - but it is what it is.  Your role is not to clash with him, but to allow him to try and get all this hurt and anger out. 

Please don't think I am siding with him, because I am not siding with any of you.  I just wished to get across the fact that two people are badly hurting and are justified in their hurt.  And until the hurt settles, progress is going to be bumpy at best.

Thank you as always, i think what you have said is true. It is hard for both of us. You have many words of wisdom x

Joanna

I only skimmed through this post of yours and the previous one. Now I've read through them and agree absolutely with what you say regarding partners' feelings and emotions. I know we definitely needed a third party, as to start with the conversation soon became heated and resorted to mud slinging!!

?I love the bit "moving forwards happens when both people are able to do so xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx there's no shame in having a third party help you channel the emotional side of this more constructively"

You are so right when you point out the feelings and needs of the non drinker. In my case there were faults on both sides, mine mostly. To make a relationship like this work, you have to accept the non drinkers' rights which can't be swept under the carpet and pretend everything is fine.

I fully admit how selfish I was, even when we were talking about trying to make it work. He had a lot of anger, hurt and disappointment. The marriage guidance was my husbands suggestion and I was horrified at the thought ( another example, me, me, me!) He needed to say exactly how he felt, what he wanted. He was hurt understandably and he needed to say exactly how he felt without walking over egg shells for fear of setting me off, which would have been another excuse to try and justify another binge.

?If I had to choose one word to sum up how we made our relationship work, it's a no brainer really TALK, TALK, AND TALK - actually that's four words!

Morning vicky - good post as always.  Going a little off topic but not sure where to place this post.  You asked a couple of days ago if anyone has any suggestiions for insomnia.  Did you see the programme on TV last night about lack of sleep.

The four suggestions to help were:

Kiwi fruit

Lavender bath

Mindfulness (which I do and works for an hour or so)

Prebiotic (not Probiotic)

Out on top came Prebiotic by a long way.

I won't go into further detail in case you saw it; obvs I am sourcing Prebiotic today!!!

 

Talking is underated, I think!

Plus us women are pretty good at it, and I don't want to come across as sexist because I most definitely am not sexist, but in my experience of relationships, men don't tend to be quite as good at exploring emotions and talking as we are.  Both parties often just need a little help.

With addiction issues, a lot of hurt is deep down as you know.  And it takes time for a partner to get used to the idea of not having to tread on eggshells anymore for fear of causing an issue that might lead to a relapse.

When I support people through TSM, there are often times when I am listening to the partner equally as much as the drinker.  And in my experience, when the tank of emotional pressure has eventually been emptied, then things are ready to progress.  And you know what?  In some cases that starts by chatting with a partner about something very silly!  It might be something such as an interest they have that they have 'forgotten' about because for the past number of years everything has been so geared about drinking/not drinking.  It's all about connecting with a person as an individual in the beginning, helping them remember that they are so much more than a partner of an addict.  Then, as they open up slowly with me and remember who they are/were, it becomes a much smaller step to opening up with their partner again (eventually).

It doesn't always work as you would hope because sometimes the hurt is just too deep and the line has been passed. Ironically, my own relationship never worked out, though we tried so hard to work it out.  It certainly wasn't through lack of trying. But that was extra muddied because we were both addicts....  when i was doing well, he wasn't... and when he was, I wasn't....   Just too much water under the bridge unfortunately.

Hey Vickylou,

There is a lot of work to be done right now with my partner and myself. I can relate to the times you mention that you and your other half rowed and then to make yourself feel better you went off and bought more drink. Now that we are not living together for the time being we have done a lot of talking on the phone. Not too many rows there have been a few, obviously monday being one of them. I couldnt bear the thought of not being with him. As much as we do wind eachother up at times, we can be so good. After monday, we didnt speak for a few days but on wed spoke to eachother more calmly and listened to eachother as well. Long way to go as i know there a lot of work to be done for us as a couple and as a family. Very hard but so hope we get there. Contacting gp today to discuss meds. Thank you so much for your support over the last few days xxx 

Hi gwen

Is that the programme about stress and how it can affect all sorts of bodily functions?! If so, have recorded it to watch tonight, killing time before going to airport.

I've often had probiotics, like tiny yogurt drinks, but never heard of prebiotics until you just mentioned it. Just googled quickly, seems all to do with fibre, regular bowel movements and stools (thanks Gwen, perhaps give brekkie a miss haha)

Couldnt immediately see what it did for insomnia, but then read further about needing a healthy body before a healthy mind. Which makes sense, cos you can't really sleep well if your body isn't running properly.

Thanks for the info, will watch it and get back to you

Yea that is right about the healthy body is needed before the healthy mind.

No it was not about stress, though it was mentioned.  I will PM you what is it is called and what channel - best not put it on here in case I get bopped lol.

Must dash - off for my brekkie of Bran ha ha ha

Hi Sharon 

Is this the same Sharon I was chatting to the other day?!!

wow what a difference, well done. So much more positive and open to anything that may or may not help.

It doesn't matter how long it takes, the fact that you're talking and he's listening and vice versa is half the battle.

You have made my day (which to other people may seem odd),  "contacting gp today to discuss meds". That is exactly the point I was trying to get across to you, he can see that you want to stop, yes you know it will be hard, but you have to start somewhere and you yourself have done it. So well done.

When I read your very first post, something, somewhere seemed to click, a bit deja vue. It was like reading about myself. So I do understand and there's absolutely no sides, I can look objectively from your side and his side.

Please don't think I'm telling you what to do, I'm not different things for different people. At my lowest I was convinced I'd lost everything, there was no point going on or trying as there was nothing to fight for.

?Yes there's plenty to fight for and you're gonna go for it, just as I did eventually. Just small steps, very slowly, but please if you think of this being your last chance DO NOT DRINK AT ALL. You will want a drink, probably more than ever, no ifs or buts you can't. No telling yourself, I'll just have one, he won't know and I'm very stressed. Just one then I'll sleep better and be much better tomorrow. Yes you'll say all that to yourself. Bottom line you can't. He probably wouldn't know, but you would. Is that anyway to start to rebuild your relationship, dishonest? It won't work if you do that, guilt will get you before you've even started.

?If that sounds hard, GOOD, GOOD  it was meant to.

ive sent you a pm

Hey again, There can be under no circumtances ANY DRINK WHATSOEVER when i go to Scotland. It has to be a total fresh start with no lies. I know that now is the time for me to make this happen on my own, so that when im there i am in a completly different place in terms of what is going on in my head. I know what you mean about being at lowest point, i have had so many, many low moments since they left. I never thought it was possible to feel that bad. The beginning of the week with birthday etc was very hard and to be honest i know i had just had enough. There are no words to describe it to be honest.

The thing is also i think that any drinker knows that they begin to hate it themselves in the end. I do hate drink, alcohol.

But what struck me yesterday with your posts is that there was so many similarites. And you were right about the meds, i have nothing to lose. Like i said i pretty much feel like i have tried all else...The rows and history that goes with drinking is so hard on the person that drinks and on every single person around them.

 Dont get me wrong about my partner, we have a lot of work to do but it honestly has to move on from here. No more ''ill just have one'' etc... i know in myself that will never work and all the trust will be gone again. It will take time to build this up anyway from everyones point of view. There will always be doubts until i prove them wrong and prove it to myself. No your post didnt sound hard, just honest and from the heart as always. xxx

Hi Sharon.....please please get the meds before you go to Scotland! I am on Naltrexone, still early days. I find they really do stop the cravings....so much easier to resist. If you do go The Sinclair Method route please be aware that it define.tly helps but it is still up to you to MINDFULLY DRINK.....if you ever do. There is really good information on the C3Europe website which your partner could read. It sounds to me as if you need to give up the drink; discussions surrounding the methods available could be something you talk through with your GP, ARC support AND your partner.

Wishing you all the very best! Keep posting! X

Thank you Sharon, how are you finding the Naltrexone is going? I know its early days but just wondering... dont think the sinclair method is for me to be honest. Seeing GP on monday i hope, they had nothing available for today. God nothing is ever easy is it.... anyway i hope you are well and keep in touch. I would be interested to know how its going with you. xxx

Too many Sharon's! Lol!

this reply is to the Sharon who suggested getting meds before Scotland. Very good suggestion and I totally agree.

To the Sharon whose going to Scotland, you appear to have knocked TSM on the head before discussing that decision with anyone, not even your partner.

?"I don't think TSM is for me to be honest"

?Without being rude or upsetting you, what exactly is for you. From where I'm sitting, you've got few options.

Yes ok you've made an appointment to discuss meds, but that seems rather pointless if you've  already dismissed one option. Why do you think it's not for you?

So you're left with campral, which in an earlier post wasn't for you either! I have to agree with the other Sharon about giving up alcohol. Very few people (Robin being the exception ), can give up alcohol completely without some form of medication. Your brain, for want of a better word, needs resetting and the best way to achieve that is with meds.

If you want to get your life back with your partner, making a decision without even discussing it with him, is IMO, not the actions of someone who says they're willing to try anything

 

Hey, I just meant that tapering off scares me a bit i suppose as i know it can not happen at all when im in scotland and dont want to drink full stop to be honest. All i can do is not rule anything out, i agree. At the end of the day i havent really (apart from here) talked to anyone about it. Plan is to see the doctor on monday and take it from there. Weigh up all options if they are offered and work with that i feel is going to make the future better. I am going to yalk about this with him over the weekend and after i have spoken to the GP. Bit more research over the weekend so i can explain it to him and then once i see the GP, go with it from there. Again as always i appreciate your honesty. Really did not mean my previous post to be dismissive, i think it does come down to weighing all options up at the time.

sorry that should have obviously been ''talk''. lol sorry, typing too fast x

I probably did my normal thing and jumped straight in.  I took it that you'd dismissed TSM before weighing up your options.i

I agree that stopping is the best route and if you can access Campral then great. Whatever route you take discuss all options with your partner once you have talked with the professionals about the options on offer. Joanna gives great information on the C3Europe website and suggests what to take along with you to the appointments. Do as much research as you can over the weekend and take notes to refer to when in the appointment. These would also be useful to show to your partner. Hope next week proves a step in the right direction re help with medication etc! X💕

Think I know where you are coming from and get it.  Very hard for you right now and your head must be mashed.  Some tough talking going on here, but it is being out of sincere care and concern.  You are on your own and that is blxxxy hard and respect to you for handling thus far. 

I think the next step is for Monday and talking it out with your gp.  You know the meds route by now - one is to be able to have a drink, but not want anymore, and the other is no can do - don't want it - don't care for it!

Let us see what your doc comes up with hun - all docs are different and some sometimes surprise you.  Until then hugs to you.

It's quite an odd feeling whichever option you choose. I remember coming back from the chemist with my campral, thinking I'll never be able to drink again. The first week was strange as all I seemed to think about was alcohol. After about 5 days the cravings were less and less. My sleep improved almost straight away, maybe cos I wasn't trying to work out how to get a drink the next day.

I suggested giving my debit/credit cards to my husband and cut off all means of obtaining money. I'd done that the year before when I tried to give up without any back up plans and no meds. Not a method I'd suggest. Whatever you decide to do, keep posting and talking.

 

Tough talking for a reason Gwen. I'd hate Sharon to end up alone. When I was at my lowest I don't know how I found the strength to fight back.

Being cruel to be kind

Yes, really keen to see what happens on monday. All i can do is be honest. I have a feeling though he is going to tell me to see my addcitions clinic again first, however it may well be that they are not medically trained so maybe the doc can help.  I needed to hear a lot of what was said yesterday, even though i knew it all deep down, sometimes you need to hear it. To spur you on so to speak. Thank you all for the support xx

Thanks for yesterday Vicky Lou, needed the tough talking. 

Basically want to stop for good and never ever go back to it. xx

Hi sharon

I feel I ought to apologise for basically having a go at you. The reason I came across as hard, is because it's like how my life was, what i so nearly lost, and how it affected my family.

Maybe if someone had told me how I could end up, in a grotty bed sit somewhere, with alcohol on tap, I'd have done something sooner.

Theres no point in sugar coating, saying "there, there, poor you, you're having a rough time" that's no help at all. All that does is give you an excuse to drink and feel sorry for yourself..

So you didn't get a birthday card, so what, it's a bit of card with silly words, it doesn't mean anything. As I've said before, actions speak louder than words.

Dont let alcohol break your family, it nearly did mine

Good luck for tomorrow, try and get something sorted. RHGB and Joanna are the best people to help over your meeting.

sorry internet not good, am in spain

your experience is a sign to us all Vickylou and what to do and what no to do...not stereotyping but this is called "life"....Just think that you now have access to your grandchildren!! Robin

Oh shut up - u are in Spain - poor u lol absolutely agree with ur post x

Lovely weather Gwen, and a villa to die for. Fantastic private pool outside my bedroom!  I'll shut up now shall I?

Sounds just perfick - what a way to chill

Hi  Gwennie

It was really an interesting programme wasnt it , got to get those good guys fed with them prebiotics lol. A reply I sent you the other day was deleted by the moderator. It was re an app I have been using to help get to sleep. Its taken a bit of perseverance but its working a treat now. Will pm the name xx

Yes please x