Nerve pain behind knee?

Hi, thanks for your reply... I don't get any tingling/numbness and I had a nerve conduction test on my whole leg a little while ago which was fine so, it doesn't seem to be a problem like that, the problem doesn't seem to want to be found which is frustrating...

When my nerve problems started, I got pain only first of all like you describe. As the years progressed, the numbness and tingling followed. My latest nerve injury was caused by a blood test and it was misdiagnosed as a haematoma because of the extensive bruising I had. However, I knew deep down it was more than that because of the intense pain I was in. I suspected a nerve problem because it felt like the sensations in my other arm which I fell on years before. My doctor later confirmed that the blood test had caused permanent neuropathy.

Do you remember if you pulled a muscle or banged your knee? It could be something like that which you may have forgotten about.If nothing is showing up, maybe leave it at that because it is a good sign that the scans are clear. Sometimes, you have to learn to live with aches and pains when there is no proven cause.

Hmm... that's interesting I suppose, it's been about 2 years since this started, and I've only has a small amount of tingling/numbness in my little toe recently, but I have been sitting cross legged a lot, so I put it down to that. I've never pulled a muscle/tendon/ligament in that leg, I probably would have banged it at some point like everyone will every now and again but nothing bad enough to remember. This started almost instantly after starting a new job working on my feet, where I had previously been working in offices sat down, so this might have been an issue a long while before I noticed because I was sat down most of the time, and I suppose a couple of weeks on my feet made it start properly. I've been off work for a long while now because of this but the issue hasn't gone down like it would if it was a tendon/muscle thing.

So, your problem was actually damage to nerves that resulted from a blood test, so those nerves/that pathway is forever damaged? That's quite unlucky, was it a nerve conduction test that confirmed the nerve damage? or something similar? My nerve conduction test came back with everything being fine, so I'd assume the nerves would have shown up if damaged on that test, but I'm not too sure about that.

I'll be having a brain scan soon because evrything else was fine, and that will probably come back fine too which will be annoying, surely there must be a way of finding out why an otherwise perfectly healthy 23 year old has to take fairly strong painkillers just to go outside, I know life isn't fair, but that just sucks 😮

My doctor diagnosed permanent neuropathy based in my symptoms alone. My arm often feels like I am getting the blood test multiple times a day. Five years on from the mistake, I am now getting numbness and tingling as well.My body still thinks it's injured and the pain receptors are constantly stuck on the on position.

CTs and MRIs can show nerve damage. Since you have had tingling and some numbness, this could be the start of neuropathy which often starts in your extremities such as your feet and hands. It can be random and slight at first and then it can become more persistent and painful over time.

Well, I hope yours is manageable and doesn't affect you too much... That doesn't sound good if it will stay for me, I'll be on painkillers forever, there doesn't seem to be anybody who has a clue what the issue is so I suppose that's the reality I should get used to.

Well, thank you for your time 😃

Hi Zaidelle,

You have youth on your side and therefore every chance of making a good recovery from this. Yes, sometimes medical tests find nothing...or nothing much which they think is of significance. This doesn't make your problem unreal....and it is good to keep mindful of how you are looking after your own body too... and become aware of changes to posture, your health regime, exercise, nutrition and mental health as far as you are able...because if they can't help you maybe you might eventually help yourself.

I have a 3 years + problem which has never been properly diagnosed. It began with a foot injury although I had a history of some lumbar back pain. I had initially lots of foot pain and then also back pain. I haven't been able to use my foot properly. Initially I had a pronounced outer calf muscles on this leg, a high arch on the same foot. My leg was just a little banana shaped (!)- bending outwards in appearance and both feet including the other "good"foot (which had a too much pronating arch) were on a sideways slant including my legs. This was taking it's toll on my back and the nerves have been clearly supressed. I have had muscle weakness, burning and pain in differing amounts.

Most importantly I have never/will never give up on this body(and mind) of mine. I also have been able to cycle, do aqua aerobics and Clinical Pilates(which is mostly floor based). Standing and walking have always been my biggest problems. Over time now this is evolving and I have become aware of how squashed downwards the problem leg and foot has been with an external rotation as well. Anyway, I am beginning to now engage new muscles in my calf and back of thigh. It is a very gradual thing and I still get pain most days but I have essentially become aware of muscles which have been asleep which are awakening (sometimes painfully). What began with muscle weakness in my toes seems to have shifted moreso into ankle, calf, knee.

I'm not sure how much I will improve but I am determined to maintain or improve any strength I have. I am also not giving up on medical help...even though I have often felt they have as good as given up on me. I have an interview for a Pain Management Course coming up now(after a long wait) which has the aim of reducing medications (although I take none at present) and honing in on the power of the mind in controlling pain. This appeals to me but it is, first and foremost, my responsibility to correct any posture problems/habits as far as possible that I can. Have you stopped crossing your legs? I think you probably have. Good luck.

Hello there, thanks for your reply. I just wrote a long message back and accidentally closed my tab and lost it, so this might omit a couple of things 😕

My lifestyle certainly has room for improvement, and I'm trying to rectify that at the moment, I've just started full body weight training, and cycling/running every other day, and cut a few things out of my diet and replaced them with healthier options. So perhaps that might make a difference in some way.

Whilst I'll never completely give up on medical help, any consultations or tests will be met with very low expectations on my side, but I will keep going for 2nd/3rd/nth opinions on the matter in the hope that someone can piece the puzzle together. Yours and pippa58442's comments mentioned some sort of trauma to the area which resulted in the prolonged issue, I don't seem to have had any noticeable trauma so perhaps that might make a difference?

I was given a choice to go to one of those pain management places instead of going onto the painkillers, but I didn't think it would do enough for me. Perhaps in my youthful naivety I thought it would just be people telling me to think about something else when I felt pain, or something as trivial as that. I'm sure there's a lot more to it than that but I just don't want to be in pain, and I didn't think I would be in that position after going to those appointments and putting it into practice.

And yes, I still cross my legs a little bit, but I always have done since I was very little, I'm not sure how important it would be o stop completely but I'll make a mindful effort to not to it as much, I'm sure I'll regret it when I'm old and grey and my legs fall off 😃

Yes...just stop crossing your legs. Small things can have a big impact...or even a little impact -either way it will be worth it. I used to cross my legs. Maybe it is because I have naturally high arched feet at rest so the foot surface available to me while sitting was insufficient to stabilise my legs in a parallel position.

I experienced another significant pain problem which went on and on 22 years ago. This was a pelvic pain which I now appreciate had everything to do with my lower back and maybe the scewed stance of my legs (although I really don't know at what point that began..although it is all the same side -back, foot, knee, leg) and I attended a Pain Management course then same sort of thing. It was marvelous.It made me feel so much less alone with my pain being in a group of others, many also with undiagnosed pain. It was great at making me think about things in a different way and with pain one's mind is proven to be the strongest tool, used well, to combat pain. Changing one's mindset helps. I didn't get immediately pain free after the course but it led me to eventually start returning to life and some work and it went away eventually. I did get some return of it much later but it was transient and manageable. One of my management things was to "walk it off". After injuring my foot (which seemed to initially get better) I believe this might have been the final straw in my poor posture. I may have begun to avoid the pain and as a result the more scewed legs and compressed nerves. I don't know if any of this is true but health professionals haven't taken sufficient interest really so far...maybe because I walk in on two feet. To a large extent the postural thing is no longer visible but the muscles pull..or is it the tendons(?) in that leg and calf. Everything is now pulling where it should have been used properly.

You don't need to be on painkillers forever; I don't take any painkillers. I simply accept the fact that the pain is permanent and I will have bad flare ups and periods of remission. This is how I manage the pain. Last year, I was pain free for quite a few weeks despite continuous wet weather which always sets it off. I knew that at some point the pain would come back, so I tried to make the most of the unexpected long respite I was experiencing. Distraction techniques can work. I noticed that my IBS improved when I was doing things that I enjoyed such going out with friends. You don't need a course to be able to do this. It can be done at home.

What was your perspective on the pain to begin with? I had 7 months of it then I couldn't do it anymore so the doctor signed me off work, and now I hesitate to go anywhere because I know it'll hurt after half an hour and it'll keep me up at night. I simply can't deal with that, and I don't think I'd be able to come to terms with it and decide I have to deal with it because when it's there, it is the only thing I can think about because of it's magnitude. Were you like this at any point, and have let's say transcended it's impact?

Hm, this has got me thinking about my back. I went to an osteopath and my back was fine, although I have an anterior pelvic tilt, which I suppose could be doing something which would be undetected by human or MRI, so I'll look at sorting that out.

When you say it went away eventually, do you think that the issue was resolved over time, or that your, lets say subconscious state of mind changed how your brain dealt with it and eventually shut off the pain signals?

I think overall strength might be important for me, I'm not convinced that will solve the issue, but there's something in me telling me to sort my body out... Make everything stronger, exercise everything so that if there are muscles doing nothing and wasting away, then other parts f my body won't have to pick up the slack and move in unnatural ways to compensate, which might be the issue. Given that an MRI is done lying down, with loose muscles, I suspect that if the above were the root of the issue, then making sure every muscle is doing it's job might solve it. So this will be a priority of mine in the future. So thanks for giving me more of a reason to get up and strengthen up.

Hi Zaidelle,

I also always had an anterior pelvic tilt (although it is quite common).Strangely enough this tilt never affected me when I was younger. I got pregnant for the first(and only) time at 36 and had a very uncomfortable pregnancy but pregnancy,itself will accentuate any pelvic tilt. I had a continual sort of nervy bladder irritation but no infection was ever detected. I I gave birth 10 weeks early. After our premature son was born all of this bladder irritation immediately disappeared. The first chronic pain thing I talked about appeared at the age of 40, 4 years later, and was very similar to that I had experienced in pregnancy. My bladder was irritated. Only much later did I learn the connection with the lumbar spine and the bladder and this was after I had been on the pain management course for it. I do recognise that I have a stiff patch one side in the lumbar/sacral region. Pilates is good for this sort of thing particularly variations on the Bridge exercise.

You are so right about needing to exercise everything. I think I have a chronic imbalance, some bits too short and tight and other bits not properly engaging within the same leg. I cycle and have tried to somewhat compensate for the lack of much walking by doing this instead but I do get to fretting about this, in itself, using the same muscle groups and avoiding others maybe whilst cycling? This is why I do the aqua aerobics(even though it didn't initially appeal) and swimming (which used to make me worse) but I'm tolerating it now, despite the(nice) exhaustion it gives me. Anything at all you can do which is different will use different muscles. As for walking(and standing) I try not to stop doing it now even if it is only 10 minute or 20 minutes with breaks (This seems right for me at least, and as long as it doesn't put me in too much pain whilst doing it).One of the things which works for me with walking is doing it with a distraction...such as retail shopping...anything you like to do. Walking for walking sake(as I used to do) makes me focus and focussing can amplify things sometimes, for me at least.

Finally, in answer to - Was it my subconcious mind which changed the state of that chronic pain when I was 40? I think it was both. No symptom in the body is disconnected to the brain because we are all one. So, put more simply, and in my case -I took the courage to get on with my life despite the pain after the pain management course, knowing that distraction, gentle exercise, massage...anything which temporarily closes the "pain gateway" (which always originates in the head) was effective. Then, because I then got more mobile as well and I closed this pain gate from time to time I then began to have some pain free half days, then the occasional full day...until it was gone. I'm not saying it was quick. One physio told me that it would take me as long to get out of this as it had done getting into it.That was about right.

What exactly do you mean by saying your bladder was irritated? I find it both quite interesting and frustrating that a simple thing in the spin, or any nerve anywhere can cause such an issue, just from one little thing being offset. I wish my doctor or anybody I've seen so far could have mentioned that... I will definitely do some googling to find out how to correct the tilt, if it's possible. I might also do some googling on the tilt itself to see if it has a substantial link to neuropathic pain, because it isn't normal.

My main issue with the pain thing is I currently work at Mcdonalds part time whilst studying full time (although I've been off for a year now...) so working for 20 minutes and then having a break wouldn't work. you could say I could get an office job to avoid it, but that isn't solving the problem. I just want to be able to go out without pain being in the front of my mind ahead of whatever I happen to be doing. I should look into the pain management courses, and see if that will help, though I would be content with painkillers.

Anyway, there's a lot of things I should look at, and the idea that I am going to have to deal with it is getting close to taking over the idea of finding a solution, because I don't think any doctor can give me one. I have had a lot going on in the last year or two, a lot of bad luck, so I just have a firm stance of 'I'm not ok with this, this isn't fair, I want it sorting, nobody has any idea what's wrong, aaarrrgghhh'... but I suppose I should try to change that.

In answer to some of your questions...the bladder irritation firstly. When I developed this chronic pain symptom 22 years ago I kept feeling like my bladder needed emptying even though there wasn't much to empty each time. I was told that emptying too much leads to more irritation so I spent some years trying to hold on for longer. I suffered no incontinence. This holding on developed and evolved into burning pain in the groin area on some days. No-one gave me a diagnosis despite 2 cystoscopies to look into the bladder. Nothing was found. Only later did I learn that the nerves in the sacrum near the spine can directly affect your bladder in different ways and can, in emergency situations block the nerves for emptying the bladder.

My back MRI says I have central protruding discs at S1 (top of the sacrum) and L5 (the one above). Neither of these are apparently bad enough for operation but "could be causing chemical reaction" to the nerve roots in that area. Independently have found out that the Piriformis muscle which joins hip, to sacrum(I think!!) can become inflamed and press upon the sciatic nerve...which can then affect anywhere in your leg. I don't still know if that is the culprit for me.

About being out of work- this gives one lots of time to think (too much) and to focus.That is bad for pain...and conversely distraction is good. In a way anything is better than nothing...any distraction. This could be study and or anything which absorbs you. In my first chronic pain episode I went back to a very hard job part time which allowed me no time to think. That was good for the pain in the end.

If it is nerve pain there are generally 3 options..One is an old fashioned anti-depressant which in small doses can minimise the pain. I did take that. No good for me and didn't like the side effects. The other two are nerve pain meds which others on this site will guard you against. They are addictive for some and also don't work for some and give some unpleasant side affects as I understand. For some people they work but that would be for you to discuss with your doctor although nothing is magic.

I know you want it sorting. Within reason though we have to try to not let it take over our life. Mentally minimising neurological pain means the physical symptoms become less noticeable.

Now I need to go and pay attention to these words I write myself! Once again- you are young. You have every chance of a recovery from this. You can keep attached to the GP. Ask for physio or the Pain management course. (I actually found mine fun!...a happy memory in a distressed time).

Well, you've given me a lot to think about, thank you so much for your insight. I'll be looking into a lot of things in the next few days, if I ever happen to sort the problem I might let you know by replying here.

Once again, thanks so much, I haven't spoken to anybody who has experienced similar problems, nor have I had it explained to me that it could be many things causing the problem, tilt/muscle weakness etc. so this is very useful information,

Once again, thanks, and all the best 😃

You too Zaidelle, all the best.

PS. Please don't go thinking you have bladder irritation if this isn't your symptom. This just serves to demonstrate how the spinal nerves can affect many things.

Initially, I had continuous, daily pain for two months immediately after the blood test. During that time I was more upset that there was no cure, that such a simple procedure could go so wrong, and that a medical professional could have made such as mess of it.My other arm has a nerve injury because of falling on my elbow and I have had pain from that for over twenty years so I have grown used to long term pain. However, I was less upset about that being permanent because it was an accident caused by me and not done by someone else who should have known better.

Over time, I have noticed that heat gives temporary relief of varying duration. In Italy, the pain goes away for three months because of the intense sunlight. In Britain, I have to use other means of getting heat such as putting my arm under the duvet at night, holding a hot mug of coffee on the injured part of my arm or a hot shower. This is the best I can do and there are plenty of enjoyable distractions in my life such as writing poetry, photography, drawing and sci fi. I feel there are so many good things in my life that make hours of pain bearable. Doctors can't help except offering me toxic medications which I am sure will cause me more problems, so I have to deal with the situation I've got evennif it's not ideal. Obviously, if a non drug cure could be found, I would certainly investigate that.