Problems diagnosed as Osteoarthritis CAN be cured in some cases.

I had similar tightness and through aggressive stretching and MFR ended up with sciatic type pain that lasted quite some time. So go carefully!! My guess is that when you've been locked down tight like this the nerves perhaps get shortened or 'stuck' to tight tissue and if you stretch too much too soon it can get irritated. You don't want that! Piriformis can press on the sciatic nerve so that's why I'm mentioning this.

For myofascial release I use a lacrosse ball for pretty much everything. You can get them cheaply off ebay. Lie one the floor, pop the ball under your hip and roll about until you find it. Just be careful not to irritate that sciatic nerve! If you feel any tingling or numb sensations down your leg BACK OFF!!!

One way to get a little stretch is rather than putting your ankle on your opposite knee just pop the outside edge of your foot onto a little bench. Even if it's something a foot or two high. Let your knee flop out to the side. So essentially the same as putting your foot on opposite knee, but from a standing position and using a chair or bench rather than your knee. Does that make sense? As it loosens off you can gradually start resting your foot on something higher. Also, in this position tilt your pelvis in various directions and move your hips backwards and forwards - just to really get in deep and mobilise everything.

But if it doesn't stretch out then I'd assume weak muscles - as in my case. Things like clamshell exercises, bridges, stepping up onto a bench, lunges - that kind of thing should strengthen it and (if weakness is your problem) then it'll gradually let go as it strengthens.

I do know what you're talking about with your suggestion to use the stool, but when I put the edge of the outside of my foot on a 1' ledge, while I'm sitting, my knee stays where it is, and I have to lean back or I'm in pain.  I don't think I clearly expressed how very limited my mobility is with external and internal rotation.  There is practically none before I can go no further and feel pain. 

I can't help but feel that stretching isn't what's needed here. With it locked down so tight my feeling is that the solution will turn out to be getting the inbalance sorted out.

Your spine/pelvis were very twisted. That has huge implications all through the body. Even if you get the spine/pelvis sorted out the issues elsewhere can hold on tight and refuse to let go. That's my experience at least.

OK - as far as stretching is concerned. If you want to go with that then honestly - whatever ROM you have that's the boundary you need to keep pushing against. Wiggle it around with whatever ROM you have and try and gradually increase it. That's the reality. If you think about it, if other muscles are stopping the piriformis from stretching then tight piriformis isn't your immediate problem - it isn't possible for it to stretch until you free up whatever is stopping you from stretching it!

My guess is that it's locked up tight for a reason though - an attempt at stabilisation because things elsewhere aren't working as they should. Your story sounds very similar to mine - a little more restricted than I ever was, but basically the same. Mine DID loosen off but it wasn't easy and it wasn't done through stretching.

My best advice is to keep working away looking for tight muscles to perform MFR on. Golden rule - don't chase the pain. Don't assume hat the problem is close to where you feel the symptoms. Pain and restriction can be a normal, healthy response to a problem elsewhere. In the shoulders, neck, obliques, psoas - or working down the leg to the lower leg, foot. Perhaps many of the problems are actually in your good hip and that's putting strain the hip where you're feeling the symptoms.

Similarly, keep looking for the lazy, underactive muscles. Neurokinetic therapy will help with that. But don't assume they're close to where you feel the symptoms. Usually they're somewhere else completely.

It's hugely difficult and it takes a lot of time - it did for me at least. Healthcare professionals can be very dangerous because they make bold, definate claims that are completely unfounded and it can set you off on entirely the wrong track, have you giving up completely, or settling for less than is possible. BUT trying someone different every so often (and not putting blind faith in them) can give you more clues.

I'm sorry I can't offer anything better. Other than the encouragement that whilst I was never quite as tight as you in IR and ER I wasn't that far off it and it can be resolved in some cases - I'm proof of that. Still not 100% but massively improved.

Look into the sling systems in the body:

Anterior Oblique System: External and internal oblique with the opposing leg’s adductors and intervening anterior abdominal fascia.

Posterior Oblique System: The lat and opposing glute maximus.

Deep Longitudinal System: Erectors, the innervating fascia and biceps femoris.

Lateral System: Glute medius and minimus and the opposing adductors of the thigh

These are muscles connected by fascia. Try doing some stretches that stretch each of these units - that can help free up your whole body in ways that more isolated stretches don't work. I think if you google these terms you should find some stretches.

I think what tends to happen is you get an injury of some kind that significantly weakens one muscle.   What then happens is that surrounding muscles become very tight, eg the back of the leg, and others tend to overwork and become very tense eg down back.

It seems to me it is all too easy to start treating the symptoms like tight muscles instead of the cause. I have found stretches don't really help, my experience is you become fitter with the same problems !!!

The real issue I have found is the tight muscles cause no end of further bone problems like spurs on the heel, shoulder and elsewhere.

So I am looking at Extra Corporeal Shockwave Therapy to treat the tight muscles and spurs. Some reports look quite promising but so far I have managed to get it as it is hard come by and expensive - about £200/session.

I do feel something has improved in the past week because I'm off the Celebrex and only taking otc meds as needed.  Pain is much reduced, and I don't feel out of whack like I did.  I rarely hear any cracking from my back when I bend down anymore, but still hear it once in a while, and still have what I think may be snapping hip because I hear cracking from the hip sometimes when I bend. 

i only recently started doing mild stretching again and I when I do them, it alleviates any pain I have, versus when I tried stretching previously and would wake up so wracked with pain I could barely move.

Ageing Cockney Viking, I think you hit on one of my problems, which is weakened muscles. For three years while trying to figure this out I've had to pull myself up by my arms because using my legs alone was too painful.  Once I figure out which ones are weak, I'll start working on strengthening those.

You mentioned bone spurs.  When I went to the doctor three years ago I had one on my hip.  When I went back a couple weeks ago I had several.  I'm ignoring that fact because I think the real issue for me is the other stuff.  I still feel a pull in the groin and pain in the piriformis muscle when I extend that leg forward while walking, so things are still knotted and need to be relaxed.  Then, whatever pain I'm left with after doing all the right things to untwist and strengthen and stretch, I'll figure is pain from the bone spurs and OA.

So, Susan, I'm a little confused.  Do you think the next step for me would be reading the book and identifying the muscles that are weak and then working on strengthening those? 

Due to my years of karate practice I had a big twist running down my spine. If you imagine how a boxer stands with one leg forwards and his whole spine twisted clockwise? Well, that's what I did for 20 years and my body kind of 'stuck' in that twisted back position (in the same way that someone with a desk job ends up with rounded shoulders after many years).

Consequently, when I walked (with pelvis rotated back on the right) my thigh/hip had to internally rotate in relation to my pelvis in order to point foot and knee forwards. In that position my glutes couldn't fire (glutes are antagnoists to hip internal rotators) so they got weak. With the internal rotators of the hip (TFL mainly) locked down tight holding my hip in internal rotation that caused an external rotation of my tibia (lower leg). With a tight TFL clinging on for dear life and weak, lazy glutes you can't extend your hip. Because the glutes are overstretched (because you're jammed in IR), weak and atrophied due to the fact that they can't fire - they lock down tight and refuse to stretch. The nervous system won't let a muscle lengthen into a position that it's not strong enough to support you in. So now you can't flex your hip either. Essentially a complete (or near complete) loss if internal & external rotation, flexion, extension, adduction and abduction. At my worst I had close to zero actual hip movement. All of the movement came through moving at the pelvis.

The 'good' leg was obviously doing the opposite - slightly in external rotation. Feet are affected by the torsion in tibia and femur. I developed a bunion on left big toe and right little toe. The problem rippled up to my shoulders giving me severe impingement in both shoulders. Neck became so stiff I couldn't turn my head to either side. My whole spine becaome rigid and imobile. I had elbow and forearm pain and at night I'd be woken by numbness and tingling in my hands.

Virtually all symptoms are gone now. I can do handstands, pullups. I run, I lift heavy weights. I'm not 100% moving normally like a young athlete, but getting there! But it's a HUGELY complex puzzle to solve. Easy when you find the right combination but there are so many permutations.

Now if you have as little hip movement as you say then you too are moving at the pelvis. Regardless of what the root cause is. Which means all the wrong muscles are working. With an overly mobile pelvis muscles are guaranteed to lock down tight. So whatever way you look at this I think you do need to retrain your body so that the right muscles are doing the right job. And that is SO difficult.

As I've said to others, consulting an expert is risky as so few have the skills to unravel this kind of complexity and many will bluff sending you a way with a bunch of incorrect information that will lead you down the wrong path. But if you can afford it then I think it's worth getting a consultation with someone - maybe set a limit of three sessions. Tell them that up front and see how much you can learn from them? If you pm me and tell me what area you live in I can look up all the types of practitioner that I think might be good with this kind of thing. See if I can locate anyone that I think is worth taking a chance with? But it is a bit of a shot in the dark.

You see, things just lock down tight and it takes a bit of good knowledge, luck or sheer dogged determination to find the combination that unlocks the puzzle and lets things start moving in the right direction.

But the short answer I guess is yes - see if you can identify weak muscles, strong muscles. See, the problem is that when you try to do a given exercise in your current state you'll use all the wrong muscles to do it. So rather than correcting the problem the exercise is designed to correct you'll actually re-enforce the problem. Clam shells for example are supposed to activate and strengthen the glutes - yet I used my rectus femoris (entirely the wrong muscle) to do them for years because my firing patterns were so screwed up.

Based on what I read she does a one hour consultation minimum and then works hard to get to the root of the problem, which will resolve the result of the problem.  I feel like I've wasted so much time and money and should be further along if it was just the misaligned back/spine/pelvis and trigger points.  I think she may find other things are off, too, as you said, and that some muscles have weakened to the point where they're not even being used anymore. 

Thank God I finally entered some phrase that led me here.  I've been doing searches for three years trying to find guidance and every doctor I've been to has concentrated on whatever their thing is, whether it's OA requiring hip replacement or needing manipulation of the back, spine and pelvis.  It calls to mind the old saying, "If you only have a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail." (Abraham Maslow)  I need someone who sees and understand the whole picture, and I'm hoping this PT I found is the one to do that!

I've seen lots of good physios and they got it badly wrong. Insisted no further range of motion was possible and I've proved that not to be the case. So take all the help they give you but don't be quick to believe them if they tell you certain things aren't possible. But you're bound to get lots of really useful information about what's tight, what's weak and what's not moving as it should. Get them to tell you everything they find and take notes. Because if they don't get the solution that you want you'll at least find the diagnostic info hugely helpful in the future.

The other option that could be hugely promising is if you have a Functional Patterns trained person near you. Although I expect the standard will vary from individual to individual. But if you could find a good FP person then I think that's the best possible chance of fixing imbalances.

Good luck!!

I found Susan from her first post, and remember that "Ahh.." moment. She has been hugely helpful, and definitely a light in the wilderness of the medical profession. I am not cured...I have hip OA, but have control over the associated pain that came from overcompensating for the hip. It was that pain..groin. knee, back that I learned to control. Movement is the key but don't over-do the stretching.

However, the main reason I'm commenting (after all, Susan is team leader here!) is your remark about Jane Fonda. So active, so vigorous, and I couldn't keep up with her routines. 

Saw her in interview just a couple of months ago and, guess what? She's had both hips replaced. I was stunned. But so many of the folks on this page were extremely active.

As Aging Cockney Viking says, it's likely we injured (or repeatedly injured) ourselves in the same place over the years, had to adjust our posture and gait to accommodate the pain of that injury, and never changed back, even when the injury healed. Like the wheels on our car, we need realigning...

Good luck. 

You'll no doubt see the answers I've written to others. It's HUGELY complicated trying to figure these things out. I know beyond all doubt that these things are curable or at least massively treatable - so huge improvement possible through physical therapy. At the very least people should be working to stop a damaged joint taking out the rest of the body!!! But the training just isn't there. Or perhaps more accurately we don't yet have reliable methods for diagnosing and treating these problems in a timely and affordable way.

So DIY is the only viable option that I see. Because we are the only ones willing and able to put a huge amount of work into trial and error.

In hindsight I'd set aside a little budget for physios etc and make the decision to consult one every so often when I get stuck. Just to see if they can shed any more light on the problem. REALLY do my homework and find the best possible people to see. And to be INCREADIBLY insistant that I'm NOT handing over control to them and I only want their opiniion on what's wrong and their ideas on how they'd go about addressing it. Because whilst every one of them is very confident and convincing they NEVER deliver and often do more harm than good. I would just use them to help educate me.

Best of luck with finding a solution. Physical therapy MUST have potential to help everyone significantly. Simply because regardless of the root cause of the problem the body compenstates and adapts around the problem by lockign down muscles, forming trigger points, adapting fascia and so on. In every case a certain amount of restriction and pain will be due to manageable soft tissue causes. Our best chance is to pool ideas and resources.

The lady had a knackered back and feet like many dancers and just could not see the relationship between her injuries and condition.

My point is some exercise can and does make these things worse - and if you mention this to a doctor or physio, you may be given treatment for dementia.  It may be a good idea to introduce one exercise at a time and record the difference it makes. Quite often I find an exercise improves one limb and adversely affects another.

Hope you find relief soon - it sucks to have such debilitating pain.

Love

BUT it's just SO difficult to do and there are no professionals with the training, experience and skill to get consistent and reliable results. You could go to a health professional of any description chiro, physio, osteo etc and get lucky - happen to stumble acrosss someoen that's seen a problem like yours and knows how to fix it. OR you could spend a small fortune working through dozens of them and end up worse off than ever. That's the reality I think.

When you have pain and you haven't put a lot of years researching these things yourself it's a tall order to make inroads yourself. Trigger point therapy / myofascial release is really the one that's easy for everyone to do themselves and it costs nothing. Always that's worth putting a big effort into. A couple of hours a day isn't too much if you could manage it and there's a good chance of it helping a lot. Try and tackle every muscle in the body - not just where you feel the pain. You don't need to do every muscle every day, but in the course of a week cover all the bases. It could eliminate the pain; it could give you huge clues as to what's really wrong. I think it'd be crazy to go for surgery without first at least trying this. Surgeons will ALWAYS recommend surgery because it's all they know.

The other thing that I'd try prior to agreeing to surgery is to see some kind of specialist in soft tissue/imbalances. It's a shot in the dark. You need to be careful that they don't just see you as easy money. But if you can afford it then it seems to me something you need to at least try? Where are you - in the UK? If you PM me where I can dig around and see if there's any of the type of therapists that I think might be able to help near you? But it wouldn't be a recommendation as such - just my best guess based on what I know.

My husband had cancer and later died around the time I had my accident so I had no time or interest to think of the surgery and my own recovery. It didn't heal well. I have always known my posture has changed since then and as time goes on... a little more than 10 years, it has had affected other parts of my body and causing degeneration on my lower spine at L5-S1 level, which traveled down to my hip joint and lower leg. I have started to stand tall and sit straight after I followed your posts. I am also using tennis balls to work on my hip joints. I do stretches too. It has helped some but I don't know if I am doing things correctly.

I live in U.S. One person I found near me do have a certificate from the institute you mentioned. I will have to call to check if he takes my health insurance. I live alone now and can't/don't want another open back surgery because I can't afford the months away from work with no help. Also if my back didn't heal properly after the first surgery, I can't trust that it would now that I am much older.

I know I have to do a lot of self healing but what else should I be doing? My back muscles get sore after my tennis ball treatment. Is it normal?

Thank you so much for being here.

Jocelyn

I would go and see someone - is it someone from the Postural Restoration Institute that's near you?

Someone needs to take a look at you first hand to make sure there aren't any problems that suggest you really should go down the surgery route.

I'm not sure why your back muscles would get sore after the tennis ball treatment. Stretches are more likely to be problematic - could it be the stretches causing the problem? MFR is going to give the best results - stretching is less necessary.

I think I've mentioned before the Power of Posture book (available as pdf) from Functional Patterns? That can give a more comprehensive guide to sorting out your posture.

I'm just a little cautious when it comes to recommending anything as spines are obviously a little bit more tricky than hips. More to go wrong. And as you've had big problems already...

I'd go see someone. Someone reputable. I can't remember whether you've checked with your doctor? It's tricky, because you should to be safe, but by the same token doctors have a reputation for going straight for the surgery option unnecessarily.

But do go and see someone that's got a good background of relevant knowledge and soft tissue / biomechanical skills.