refused pip

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my son has been refused pip. even though he has lots of heath problem since he was young and is admitted to hospital 3-4 times a year. the problem now is he still classed has disabled. he is 20 now and is poorly most of the time. pip does not consided this and base it on when you are well. so do you stop being disabled.

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12 Replies

  • Posted

    Hi

    As Nad said we need to know a little more if we are to help you. Many claimants make the mistake of believing PIP is awarded simply because you suffer with a medical condition.

    It is possible to be very ill and still not receive the benefit; there are regular posters on here who like your son have fallen short due to the system used to determine the level of disability.

    There are ‘descriptors’ which are an attempted catch all for those who require extra help because of how their disability affects them. It covers everything from meals, washing/dressing, monitoring a health condition, budgeting decisions and mental health.

    You have to score 8 points for standard, 12 points for enhanced care, 8 points for standard and 12 points for enhanced Mobility. In theory there are plenty of points up for grabs, but reality matching them to your specific disability can be a challenge.

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  • Posted

    Need a letter of the notes taking during the interview did you have a audio taped done ? which would help with the appeal getting pip now will be harder as DWP want too stop ppl getting it as there are now having offices to try and prersuade the judge to turn people doen 

    Have a look at the website Benefits and work its has all the info on PIP's speak to CAB 

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  • Posted

    hi he has been getting DLA since he was a child due to chonic asthma/ alligies/ growth and ezcema. he has now has chronic fatigue asthma and chronic ezcema which he been admitted to hospital with 3-4 times a year . he spends 2 to 3 weeks in bed and has depression and anxiety. i have sent them all hospital evidence that i have. but they have told me when they phoned me back for talk about why he was refused and to have the claim looked at again , that they only look at his good days and not his bad days.  so basically if he his bed ridden for 3 weeks and then needs  help to go  the toilet  as long he can sit on the toilet they dont count that and the same for bathing. so it does not good. he is on jobseekers but has only been paid once since october 2015 dur being sanctioned becourse of his illnes. so we are worried.
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    • Posted

      Hi again thanks for getting back and giving more information.

      The DWP are breaking their own rules if they are only looking at your son’s good days. The 50% rule should apply.  This is taken from their own handbook.

      Time periods, fluctuations and descriptor choices

      “The impact of most health conditions and disabilities can fluctuate. Taking a view of ability over a longer period of time helps to iron out fluctuations and presents a more coherent picture of disabling effects. The descriptor choice should be based on consideration of a 12-month period. This should correlate with the Qualifying Period and Prospective Test for the benefit – so in the 3 months before the assessment and in the 9 months after.

      A scoring descriptor can apply to claimants in an activity where their impairment(s) affect(s) their ability to complete an activity, at some stage of the day, on more than 50% of days in the 12-month period. ”

      There is no provision for looking only at the good days. What should happen is if he is able to carry out a descriptor (e.g. prepare a meal) for more days than he can’t then yes he would score zero.

      However, if he is spending most of his time in bed due to severe depression then it is hard to understand how he is preparing food (again as an example) more than 50% of the time?

      If I were you I would definitely appeal on grounds that the assessment has not taken into consideration the full impact of your son’s physical and mental impairments on his ability to perform tasks more than 50% of the days over a 12 months period.

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    • Posted

      thank you anthony

      he told me unlike the dla that he was on was based on bad days and pip is based on good days. the pip seemed how my son was at the interview. he had just come out of hospital so was pumped full of striods and antibiotics.  i did say that that seemed unfair. the review was done over the phone and he told me it would take 4 to 16 weeks to hear back again but i only have 4 weeks to submit extra hospital information. he also  did not tell me it was 50% of the days over 12 months.  thank you for your help i will appeal again if we fail this second one.

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    • Posted

      I don't want to put a down on this butthe 50% rule is very subjective and wide open to interpretation.

      Medical evidence to support the claim on it's own is one thing, but I for the life of me cannot see how anybody can argue over the 50% rule if the DWP dig their heels in.

      I suppose a diary covering a 12 month period might help and considering that the onus is clearly on the claimant to prove their claim during the MR and tribunal appeal processes what evidence you do submit will have to pass the test 'on the balance of probabilities'.

      I have good, bad and indifferent days, but if anybody actually asked me to prove on the balance of probabilities that my bad days exceeded 183 days across the year I could not do it - and neither could any of my health professional that look after me.

      I see having that to prove is one massive hill for you to climb.

       

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    • Posted

      Les nothing about taking on the DWP is easy, that is quite obvious and I fully agree.

      However, in this case the poster has stated that her son’s PIP was turned down on the grounds that they only look at his ‘good days’ and have not applied the 50% rule.

      If that is true then clearly the DWP are not abiding by their rules and that should form the basis of the appeal.

      In this case it seems mental health and severe depression form a main part of the problem so intervention is the key. If the poster has to intervene to prompt or assist her son more than 50% of the time then the PIP descriptors will apply.

      Balance of Probabilities is not the same as beyond reasonable doubt. A diary, signed affidavits, supporting medical evidence plus a ‘creditable’ explanation can be enough to get a claimant over the 50% threshold which tips the balance of probabilities in their favour.

      I would always encourage claimants to try in this case but of course warn them that they will be facing a difficult task and nothing is guaranteed.

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    • Posted

      Hi

      Thanks, I do know the difference in arguing under civil law V criminal law.

      The way I read the OP's opinion is that the DWP have considered the 50% rule and come down in favour that his good days exceed his bad ones. So yes they are looking at the majority of days only which are good ones.

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  • Posted

    i would advise you go with himn to dr's and ask them to give you detailed info of all his conditions all they do is a print out over the years. So it doesnt cost anything just time
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    • Posted

      Conditions do not give you points for PIP.

      The claimant has to show with evidence what difficuties they have because of the conditions and to fit those difficulties to the various PIP descriptors to gain enough points - min of 8 for care/mobility

      If I listed down all of my ailments 

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    • Posted

      If I listed down all of my ailments most people would think that I am not far from being boxed up and planted 6' down. As it is most of those conditions do in fact cause me great difficultiy in every day life, but very few can actually be said to fit the descriptors.
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