Unusual exercise-induced insomnia
Posted , 126 users are following.
TL;DR: I have exercise-induced insomnia for which no one has been able to explain or provide a solution.
I used to exercise regularly. I would wake up every weekday at 6am, bike to the gym, and exercise for about an hour before work. I would usually jog or do some other cardio for 20-30 minutes, then do weight training for the rest of the hour. I had help from a personal trainer, so I knew what I was doing.
I felt great, and I was in the best shape of my life. I kept this up for about 3 years, before something strange happened: I would wake up around 2 or 3am, unable to fall back asleep. I was 33 at the time, and I know sleep patterns can begin to change around this age.
At first, I noticed that I slept much deeper on days I didn't exercise (e.g. weekends). Then I began waking up in the middle of the night, but would usually go right back to sleep. It got worse. Eventually, I would wake about 4 hours after falling asleep with a feeling like an intense adrenaline rush or panic. It would last about an hour, and I would have poor, restless sleep the rest of the night.
I did not have trouble falling asleep. I was in bed at 9:30pm every night, then would read a bit with lights out by 10pm. I would fall asleep within 10 minutes.
When this started happening, I adjusted my routine. I worked out during lunch, or in the evening. No change.
I tried doing more or less cardio vs weight training. No change.
Today, if I exercise at any point during the day, I will only get four hours of good quality sleep.
I've been to several doctors, sleep specialists, and neurologists. I've had multiple take home sleep studies, as well as one on-site at a medical institution. The only thing they've been able to confirm is that I do indeed wake after 4 hours if I have exercised, but no one can tell me why. Many doctors don't even believe my story -- they think it must be psychological stress that I insist on tying to a physical cause.
I have found that walking, low-intensity biking, and hiking are all acceptable forms of exercise that do not trigger my insomnia. I can hike 10 miles and be fine. But if the hike is over very steep terrain, or if I were to jog for 10 minutes, then I have insomnia. So the intensity is definitely a factor.
The sleep studies did reveal that I have very mild sleep apnea. My doctors have told me that normally it would not warrant treatment, but it could be related. However, the usual recommendation for such a mild form is simlply "get more exercise".
My current pet theory is this: following a day of excerise, one's muscles will repair themselves during sleep, usually around 3 or 4 hours into the night. This process requires oxygen from the blood, so if my sleep apnea lowers my blood oxygen levels, then the repair process might cause it to dip below some threshold; my body panics, sending adrenaline through my body to wake me up to address whatever is happening. However, my sleep studies showed my blood oxygenation stayed over 90% the entire night.
I'm currently trying out a CPAP treatment. I'm still adjusting to it, but so far it hasn't made any difference. There's no real reason to think that it will, but I'm willing to try anything at this point.
When I tell this story, most doctors look at me like I have three heads, so I thought I would seek the collective wisdom of the Internet.
Cheers!
13 likes, 351 replies
lucas14544 mekin
Posted
I've been reading some studies about ammonia buildup when exercising rigourisly. Also eating a protein-rich dieet can result in ammonia buildup in the muscles. Which i do both...
The body converts ammonia to urea during the breakdown of protein for a muscle energy source, but during exercise the amount of ammonia produced in the metabolic processes outstrips the conversion system and the ammonia level builds up in the body. Ammonia is toxic, so the body reverts to the more primitive removal system through sweat. But what happens when you hardly sweat?
Symptoms:
Nausea, loss of appetite, back pain, muscle cramps are common physical symptoms caused by higher amount of ammonia in our bodies. Anxiety, insomnia, irritability, confusion and depression are just some of the mental symptoms of ammonia toxicity. Less recognized effects of ammonia toxicity are brain fog, low motivation, inability to focus,… all the symptoms people are complaining about nowadays but almost nobody talks about ammonia as cause of these problems.
Ammonia toxicity may cause serious physical changes in the brain which are long-term and even irreversible.[2]
The simple cure is to increase the carbohydrate in your diet a bit and maybe drink a little more water during the day to dilute the ammonia. I've also been reading about the amino acid "Ornithine" which removes excess ammonia and aid indirectly with insomnia by reducing stress and anxiety and the stress response.
What do you guys think?
laura98152 lucas14544
Posted
Hi Lucas, I believe I commented on one of your earlier posts, but I'm curious if you ever had any success with this ammonia theory. Did you ever try ornithine? Or have you had any success with anything else? Thank you for any updates.
RohanS mekin
Edited
Hello mekin and everyone else,
I have this exact same problem as well - so frustrating. I believe I can shed a little light on it.
A couple of years ago I developed overtraining syndrome. I had had symptoms on and off for a few years as I came to the end of my Australian Rules football career (amateur - don't get excited) and I retired to karate. Overtraining syndrome is when you damage your symptom in a permanent/semi-permanent way, as result of your body not being able to recover from the training load.
I had a lot of treatment, it took 2 years to overcome and will never entirely go away.
Basically what happens is, in the case of high intensity athletes (martial arts football players, lifting etc) your sympathetic nervous system gets over stimulated. During my OTS, if I did even a fairly mild workout, I would likely get heart pounding and palpitations. After about 2 to 3 hours after finishing the workout, my heart rate would go from slightly elevated to over 100 bpm, whilst sitting quietly on a sofa watching TV. I would also feel incredibly wired, like I had just drunk 10 cups of coffee or something. Needless to say, sleeping in such a condition was nearly impossible. I would also wake up bathed in sweat.
Your SNS (Sympathetic Nervous system) is part of your ANS (autonomic nervous system) and is involved in getting you alert, ready to fight or flee, it suppresses your immune system increases your heart rate and sweat production, and gets your organs ready for doing stuff. Your PNS (para-symathetic) is involved in calming you down, repairing organs and muscles etc.
In my case, what happened was, I was trained too many times beyond my bodies ability cope, triggering a 'survival mode' response. You have 3 basic modes of metabolism - your everyday metabolism, metabolic processes when you exercise or are active, and extreme processes when your under very great stress, such as in an injury, a fight, or you push beyond what your body THINKS it can cope with. Your body is an adaptive mechanism, so it remembers how it responded to survive the last encounter. So if I trained in a way that made it think it was being pushed it would reach for the extreme response inappropriately soon. That meant my training was becoming counter-productive. Because I wasn't seeing the results, I assumed I was either soft physically or mentally - either way, train harder.
The most effective treatment I had for this was GET - graded exercise therapy. It took a lot of patience. You had to exercise very regularly but not to any great intensity. If you over stimulate your SNS, it won't come back down and for me it could trigger days of fatigue, nausea, irritability, brain fog, and of course insomnia.
I just want to stop and remark how difficult emotionally I have found all this. It's extremely confronting, and I bitterly bitterly resent it. It has made me lose confidence in my body and constantly worry about whether I am over doing things. It has also coincided with osteoarthritis (feet, hands and knees). I travel to Kilimanjaro in 1 week doing the longest trail. I am almost as fit as I've ever been but I worried about my body letting me down. Again.
Someone asked regarding blood sugar level: during my OTS I started getting post-prandial hypoglycemia. It's actually not true hypoglycemia, but your brain thinks you are hypo because it is unable to regulate insulin properly (OTS really fries your endocrine system). So I WAS testing my blood sugar levels. Yes my blood sugar level got low, and it woke me up with intense and unnatural hunger, but it wasn't low enough to be graded as true hypoglycemia.
The solution is to really cut back on carbs and eliminate sugar altogether. Eat as much healthy fat and protein as you can at a meal. Anything that can broken down easily to glucose spikes your blood sugar, causing your brain to inaccurately produce too much insulin. This mismatch causes catecholomines to be released (part of your SNS axis) one of which is epinephrine - adrenaline. And we know what that does to us physiologically. In fact, if your spike your BS and your belly is still full, your brain can misinterpret the signals as (quite often) depression. You then dwell on what might be making you depressed and then - hey presto! - you're depressed.
My guess is, if you are having these symptoms without having to go through full overtraining, or developing chronic fatigue, then your SNS is over-stimulated as result of the combination factors that can cause it to be aroused - stress, exercise, diet, inflammation. Biochemically much the same thing happens in all of these, and they are cumulative.
I hope that gives you some idea of what might be going on with you. I don't profess to be an expert, or have definitive answers - I am still struggling with the EXACT same things you guys are still. I know what I can do to manage it - it's just deeply frustrating and I resent it. If anyone is interested, I kept records of my blood sugar levels and of my HR during the worst of the OTS which I would be happy to make available.
lucas14544 RohanS
Posted
But I hardly even eat sugar or things that spike my sugar levels. I mostly eat clean, high in fat and protein. How are you doing right now?
RohanS lucas14544
Posted
Hi Lucas,
Some one was asking earlier regarding relationship to blood sugar level and these issues. While blood sugar, being pre-diabetic can effect the SNS axis, it's certainly not necessary.
Currently my diet as A+. Like you, virtually no sugar, low carb high fat and protein. So what this has meant is that I don't get "hangry", I have less in the way of bowel disturbance (lets call it...) and it's improved my mood generally. However, if I train in a way that overstimulates my SNS I will very likely have pounding and insomnia, no matter how well I eat. I've been struggling with it this week as I have been training up for my climb, which is why I came across this thread.
It's incredibly frustrating. I have been looking into sleeping aids. I have some stronger anti-histamine aids for the trip, and also Valerian root pills which did seem to help me last night. I slept for about an hour and a half and then boom...awake....really tired and sleepy but unable to actually sleep.
I also have problems with Hyperhidrosis - also part of the SNS axis. It's just something I live with but I'm hoping to get something to keep it at bay for the trip. Sweat in such extreme climates can be dangerous.
Broadly speaking I am pretty fit, in moderately good health. I eat really well, drink modestly, and I train a lot...but keeping this insomnia/fatigue reaction to exercise in check is very very challenging.
lucas14544 RohanS
Posted
I understand your problems. I think the best exercise for this problem is to rest. But what if you can hardly sleep? I also used anti-histamines occasionally, but i always feel zoned out and lethargic the next day.
I also use glyice 3g before which works quite well some times (except on training days). For more information: https://supplementsinreview.com/sleep/glycine-sleep/
I've been looking ages for supplements which can aid my recovery or sleep, because it's making me nuts! I'm starting to release now that i've to cut back on sports once more. And first stabilize my sleep.
Let me hear if you had any improvements or problems and i hope we can all learn from each other and help one another!
RohanS lucas14544
Posted
Glycine....Ok....nice find. I'll look into that myself. I reckon the Valerian root pills helped me the once I have taken them.
Yeah if you are over-training your sleep disturbances are probably your "canary in the coal mine". You probably should give yourself a few days of lots of stretching instead of work outs and really really good meals and top quality sleep, then get back to it by starting gradually and then building up the intensity. Bit of luck you might be able to go quite a way without triggering bad sleep. All easier said than done.
Likewise good to know there are others out there....and thanks for the glycine tip. Much appreciated.
lucas14544 RohanS
Posted
No problem. We need to prioritize sleep... I think the chronic overloading of bodies has resulted in a decrease in recuperating with physical stress. We can only recuperate when we sleep better and deeper.
I'm also using ornithine and magnesium citrate atm (every day). I don't use glycine everyday, because it makes me wake up in the night. But if too well rested too fall asleep again. So I need to dose again lol. I will report back what helps best for these symptoms.
erica92142 RohanS
Posted
I know that I am a little late to reply, but i just wanted to say thank you for this response. I am a 35 year old female who has been suffering from insomnia, muscle pain and over training symptoms for the past 2 years. It makes weight loss very difficult and can feel like a one step forward, two step back process.
Back in 2013 I made some lifestyle changes and got into the best shape of my life. I trained daily with high school athletes (I worked at a high school at the time) frequently performed Crossfit workouts, ran 4-6 miles daily, etc. Occasionally I would wake up in the middle of the night with panic attacks and sweats, but I would just assume that it was from the low carb paleo diet that I was on. After 2016, however, my life did a 180 and I found working out more and more difficult to find the time for. I put on a few pounds, which would cause me to freak out and eat more to comfort myself, which would lead to more weight gain. In total I put on about 20 lbs.
I received a gym membership for a Christmas present and hit the gym in Jan. 2018. I couldnt wait to get back into my regular circuits of weight lifting, jump roping and sprints. Much to my dismay I found my self suffering from over training symptoms frequently. Even just trying to do everyday stuff like my job or grocery shopping could cause muscle pain (mostly in my legs), inflammation, insomnia, loss of appetite and then sudden extreme hunger. Things are better now, but I still can't settle into a workout routine because I don't really know my limits. Walking, yoga and light weights seem to be ok, but any jumping with cause the same nighttime pain and insomnia.
This is the most trying time of my life and I have to put most of my mental focus on staying positive, especially when every Dr. I have visited provides little answers for me. This thread is helping me cope a little and see that I'm not completely alone in this. Thank you
bruno56842 erica92142
Posted
Hello Erica,
This is interesting. My insomnia started in a very similar fashion as yours. I was also in the best shape of my life, had lost a bunch of weight and was doing low carb diet. Do you have muscle spasms during the night as well? I think that is my most "evident" sympton.
I'm now a long time (like more than 1 year) without regurlaly exercising. The only thing I'm doing is surfing when the waves are good (which is like twice a month). I feel like my symptoms are improving. Last weekened I went to the Alps and did 3 days straight of snowboarding, and my insomnia didnt hit hard at all. Just some difficult to get to sleep, nothing to strong. Maybe this time without exercising is helping.
Good luck to everyone
RohanS erica92142
Edited
Hi Erica,
I completely sympathise with your situation. I especially understand how frustrating and upsetting it is...I have to admit I got quite low during the worst of my overtraining. I still regularly have symptoms and I am now a little apprehensive about exercise or anything stressful enough to bring them on.
Likewise, I found Doctors were able to diagnose the overtraining - if you went to a specialist sports doctor which I did, and they sort of helped me recover, but it was the chronic fatigue doctors that helped most of all.
Could I strongly recommend you getting tested for chronic fatigue?
The reason is, they are able to work out if you have had the predisposing factors - most especially a specific type of glandular fever. It should show up in your blood, but only they would know to look for it. If you have had it, it means you "primed" for overtraining (over training is virtually identical to chronic fatigue phsyiologically).
They would also be able to give you guidance. TBH it was the chronic fatigue doctors on the NHS that had the greatest impact in helping me recover. But I'm afraid it IS something we are going to have to manage for the rest of our lives - the damage is generally permanent.
Bruno said: "Maybe this time without exercising is helping."
Indeed....unfortunately exercise is a stressor. We need stress and the stress of exercise in order to thrive, but it's still a stress. Exercise damages us - it's why people who lived tough physical lives died early. It's the RECOVERY from exercise that is good for us, as your body tries to adapt to the stress. But if it is more than the body can cope with then, it goes into survival mode and into a catabolic state where it robs us of anything "non-essential". In our case, the trigger for those metabolic processes is much sooner.
But you can get money in the bank. The longer you go without triggering this metabolic process, the longer it takes to be triggered - meaning you can exercise like you normally could.....for a while. And that is what the Doctors suggest. They suggest graded exercise therapy, which means you exercise little and often and build it up. Which is boring, but it does work.
WRT muscle spasms - yeah. I have terrible problems with cramps. I don't need to have exercised either. My feet, calves, intercostal muscles, hamstrings, neck muscles. It's a right nuisance.
laura98152 erica92142
Posted
Hi Erica,
I am curious if you ever found any relief from your OTS. I suffer from exercise-induced insomnia also and am at a complete loss. Have you gotten any clues or been able to find any remedies? It has gotten progressively worse for me and is taking a huge toll on my life and health. Thank you so much for any reply.
MichelleS15 laura98152
Posted
hi laura,
i am suffering from insomnia too. use to sleep like a baby but my body has been through a lot with over training and taking a medication for mild hypo (which i am
not sure i even had). it has been a true nightmare and i am with you when you say it is wrecking your life. i have been dealing with this for 5 months. sometimes i dont even know how i am still
functioning. know you are not alone and i do hope that with time things will
get better for both of us.
gregory63366 RohanS
Edited
exact, I mean EXACT same symptoms here. 47yo former college scholarship athlete. Very happy to see other people with the same issue. I can relate to the level of frustration this has caused and I fully concur with the theory of excessive cortisol production and easy over-training. So happy to have found this. I am here to talk to anyone and chat about our mutual experiences with this.
james36561 gregory63366
Edited
I no longer believe cortisol is the root cause of this problem. I've tested my cortisol (blood and saliva) multiple times and it appears to fit normal ranges - and drugs that lower cortisol don't seem to be curative of my insomnia or the other symptoms I feel following exercise.
My current theory is that these problems are caused by glutamate-dominated brains, or some form of nervous system dysregulation. I've been able to exacerbate my insomnia by consuming supplements and foods that are known to increase glutamate (note, exercise also increases glutamate), and I do find some level of relief when I avoid the consumption of glutamate elevators.
gregory63366 james36561
Posted
I have no clue as to why the moderators deleted my last comment, I did not send a link or anything like that.
I do think you may be onto something with regards to glutamate. I will research that today in my free time.
I just wanted to point out to you and to the group the study published in 2022 on the use of AEO, Anhydrous Enol-Oxaloacetate. It was a double-blind meta study that showed significant improvements in CFS/ME patients and on Long-Covid patients with PEM, Post Exertional Myalgia.
gregory63366
Posted
Also James, for the second time in three weeks I am getting hives after exercise. Very small minor breakouts on my stomach area. I notice this symptom mentioned by a couple people here which would indicate a histamine reaction to exercise. I plan on talking to my doctor about this.
james36561 gregory63366
Posted
I'll look into AEO - thanks for the heads-up.
I also develop itchy skin following exercise. Initially I thought it was a consequence of the sweat that exercise creates but suspect there is a deeper set of issues causing this too.
I'm currently essentially avoiding all supplements (I have a cupboard full lol) except for Vit D - over the course of many years of testing I think supplements had the effect of worsening my symptoms (or had no effect at all). What a tricky beast this puzzle is to solve!
james36561
Posted
Re AEO - note the connection with glutamate:
Oxaloacetate reduces glutamate levels by breaking it down (to α-ketoglutarate).
gregory63366 james36561
Edited
Thanks for the reply James. In a way I kind of hope that you and I are wrong about the glutamate angle. Excess glutamate in the brain is associated with several ugly neurological conditions that you and I don't want any part of.
That being said, I am going to look into the angle that another poster went, which is cholinesterase inhibitors which inhibit the enzyme acetylcholinesterase from breaking down the neurotransmitter acetylcholine. I will let you know how this research goes.
james36561 gregory63366
Posted
Good idea to try Huperzine A - I certainly felt the impact of it when I trialled it but ultimately didn't notice any benefits to sleep etc. Your experience may differ so good to give it a go.
gregory63366 james36561
Edited
I won't be able to get Huperzine-A unfortunately here in the U.S. without a doctor's prescription so back to the drawing board I guess.
I too have stopped all supplements and have switched to a more balanced diet with many a few extra helpings of fruit in the day.
The only symptom that is staying constant is the nighttime insomnia on days that I lift weights. This can be simply push-ups, three sets of ten very easy, and that night i will wake up early, sweaty, hot and then try and return to sleep, which is always broken and not restful.
If I walk the dog for 25 minutes lightly, no problem those evenings.
The mystery continues. Sending you a PM James.