venlafaxine withdrawal- please help!!

Linda

I am experiencing all of the side effects mentioned above. I makes me very angry that venlavatine is licensed in this country and that patients are not told about the side effects of withdrawl.

I agree with you that case should be brought against the manufactures and the government licening department. I'm going to start by infestigating the best way to start this process.

Take care.

Count me in, if this happens.

Got a severe sick bug at the beginning of this week and couldn't hold down any food or water until Thursday, so obviously meds weren't an option.

Where a normal person would now be recovering back into ordinary routines, I find myself absolutely floored with these horrible brain zap things, dizziness and headaches, suicidal thoughts, severe anxiety attacks...all because of my four days without 150mg venlafaxine. I rang my psychologist on Thursday who told me to get back on the meds immediately on 75 mg a day and now I am waiting to feel better. Thank god for this discussion which has enlightened me to what is going on in my head.

This drug is totally evil, I'm considering braving it on just the 75 mg even with these horrible withdrawal symptoms just to get myself one step closer to coming off it entirely. Definitely going to try the antihistamine route. 

I was on mirtazapine which was the best drug ever for me but unfortunately it made me gain around 2 stone.

IS THERE NO ANTI DEPRESSANT WHICH DOESN'T MAKE YOU FAT OR PHYSICALLY ILL?!

don't look at the drug as evil.  it is helping you.  our brains are out of sync and this drug is sorting things out.  stop worrying about getting off it and just look forward to feeling better.

i have come to appreciate venlafaxine since the terrible time i had when trying to come off it.  i am back on it and pleased to have more control of my emotions

I appreciate your advice and will of course talk to my doctor about it. However, I don't want to be on a drug that has this level of dependency surrounding it. The ultimate goal is, after all, to look to myself and only myself for happiness without having to respond to a physical need for an addictive drug.

I understand your reasoning.  I just thought thinking of it more positivley would be helpful.  For example, stitches help a wound to heal, so although not the nicest thing to have, they serve a good purpose.

Diabetics rely on insulin for the rest of their lives.  

I hope one day you will come off venlafaxine, but till then....

Isaiah 33:24 in the Bible makes the promise that one day no one will be sick.  Such positive thoughts from the Holy Bible help me.

The researchers have found an area of the brain that may need stimulation, but that area can be stimulated not using medications.  None of our insurance companies will pay for this treatment, yet.  Look up rTMS.

Meanwhile, people are tapering off way too fast for the simple reasons that a) the doctors are only educated about putting people on these drugs (and some take their patients up too high too fast at that!), not getting them off and b) the drugs are not made in increments that facilitate getting off more gently so the doctors work with the increments the pills come in.

Unfortunately, patients have to educate themselves about tapering and take matters in their own hands to go more conservatively than the doctors think is needed!

Are you in the US or UK?  If UK, I'm wondering if the procedure I mentioned is available there and if it's a do-able price.  It's $6000 here.  I'm hoping they do more trials in the future so I can get something done for me at no cost.  Currently they aren't doing anymore.

It's nice to communicate with someone who recently is on this board.  Most posts are from a year ago or so.  How are you doing?  I'm seeing my neurologist in a few weeks about back pain, etc.  He's, also, the only doctor locally who is licensed to do this procedure.  I'm going to ask him how things are going with insurance companies acceptance of the procedure.  I can keep you posted, if you're interested.  I didn't realize this was a UK forum.  I just googled and this came up.  Didn't realize how different things are meds-wise.  

I'm still having spelling/typing troubles-words and letters jumbled up, some words getting stuck in my head that I can't find when carrying on a conversation, the brain zaps come and go in "groups" that will last off and on for a couple of hours, then nothing for days.

I hope you are doing better.  Good luck with your journey. 

Patti

Yes, we have it in the states.  I don't think I need it for myself since I'm doing quite well, actually, but there was a time, about eight months ago when I was in protracted WD from Effexor, that I wished for a lobotomy, anything to not be "me" anymore.  WD does that to people, makes them so miserable that they feel they can't go on.  A common statement by folks in the throes is "I don't want to do, but I don't want to live like this."  Pretty much sums up WD, and I'm not talking the physical but the mental.

I also had trouble with spelling, typing, and reaching for words mid-sentence, though it isn't so bad now.  I was in such a bad way mentally with memory and concentration that I seriously thought I had ADHD and was tested for it!  That little fiasco led to a new p-doc who put me on Viibryd, another disaster!  I was on it a few weeks.  When I went up in dose per the doc's instructions, I had such freakishly scary anxiety and insomnia that I put myself of the lower dose again and then quit, and never went back to that doc! I'm sure that little adventure put my nervous system into more chaos because after that is when I began to have ongoing dread, panic, fear, insomnia with troubling thoughts, and depression like never before.  I think Viibryd made the Effexor WD worse, though it may have been heading that way on its own, never will know!

I wish I could tell people that it took X amount of time to come out of WD, but I can't.  I ended up reinstating 37.5 mg Effexor XR after a failed run with mirtazapine (helped me sleep, but otherwise totally apathetic and unable to function).  Reinstatement worked immediately, and now I am tapering off of both, though focusing on the mirt because it caused me to gain weight :-(

You should know that Effexor is an SNRI - selective norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor. What this means is, it's working off of a separate neurotransmitter that traditional anti-depressants. Technically, it's not really an anti-depressant. 

It is worth noting, the chemical compound of Effexor is identical to the compound of MDMA - the illegal club drug that is, basically, the purer form of Ecstacy. It's in the amphetamine/stimulant club, and long term use is damaging, as it is with any medication. 

What's troubling here is the amount of patients who experience terrible side-effects: self-destructive/addictive behaviors, such as alcoholism, gambling, sexual promiscuity (outside what they'd do normally), shaking, mania, personality changes, sleeplessness, and weight-gain. I've seen quotes citing as much as 40% of the prescribed population experiencing these effects. 

Then there's the withdrawal. 

It's positively shameful that doctors are not advising their patients of the risks involved, period, and even more so that these doctors are prescribing it freely without any knowledge of the dangers. There is a high risk of seizure associated with cold-turkey withdrawal - in fact, brain zaps may even be low-level seizure activity, and should be reported immediately. 

My S/O is currently on Effexor (150XL twice daily), and he was NOT told when to take it, nor the risks. XL should be taken every 12 hours - he takes it at 7 am and then at 4 pm. So when his night dose hits, he gets extremely manic - he's wild, impulsive, loud, and his pupils are so dilated, his eyes turn black. Plus he craves alcohol and ciggarettes like you couldn't believe. 

We're getting him into an outpatient center, tomorrow, where he can finally get the medication management he SHOULD have gotten these past 5 years with a bottomless script of Effexor. Honestly, the cost-benefit analysis of this medication is dubious at best. He has anxiety and has struggled with OCD in the past. Has a therapist worked with him to help him learn self-soothing and coping mechanisms that are healthy? NO. Has that damn quack PCP in Oregon who prescribed this crap, and joked about going ahead and DRINKING with it being ok (it's NOT!!!) been held for review by the medical board? Hell no. Meanwhile, my S/O has paid the price with multiple problems that only occurred while on Effexor, and never existed prior to it. 

Careful with this stuff, and any other psychotropic. It's only meant to help you relieve the initial symptoms of the psychological or emotional crisis that you're struggling through (depression, anxiety, etc) while you get REAL help from a trained professional, and then they wean you off in about 6 months. NO medication of this nature is supposed to be for the rest of your life - that is the pharmaceutical industry making customers of you! They don't want you cured - they just want your money, and will exploit you any way they can to get it. 

Always question everything. Good luck to you all and take good care of yourselves <3>

Wow, what a horrible story with your SO!  You are so right about everything your wrote, and he is lucky to have you looking out for him.  

You are right about Effexor being an SNRI which blocks the re-uptake of norepinephrine, but it also blocks the re-uptake of serotonin, working on both neuroreceptors, so it is also an SSRI. Aside from a fairly short period of time, I have been on the extended release version so haven't had those issues that your SO has had.  He sounds to be very sensitive, making it much harder on him.  When I was on the immediate release version but only taking once a day, I didn't have problems, but that may be because I had weaned myself down to a pretty low dose at that time.

I was recalling a period of time when I first went on Effexor 12 years ago and was on a pretty high dose that I actually stole from somebody!  I had a friend who was a bad influence and together we stole some building materials, long story, but I NEVER would have thought to do such a thing otherwise, and I think it was Effexor's disinhibiting affect that you spoke of.  I am ashamed to recall that time!

I am now on 29 mg, having micro-tapered to that level from 37.5 mg, which I reinstated to after 10 months of nightmarish protracted withdrawal.

What frightens me on this forum is how many people are eager to take the meds first and foremost for situational emotional difficulties without ever considering CBT and other non-drug alternatives to help one cope with life's stresses. I started Prozac back in the early '90's after it had been hyped as the Happy Pill, thinking it would cure me.  Back then, no one was talking about CBT therapy.  I'd been to many therapists over the years but never found one that actually helped me budge my dysfunctional thought processes that caused my suffering.  And that's the problem, we are told to go to therapy, but no one tells you what to look for in a therapist/therapy!  Even my most recent therapist was more of the talk therapy type.  She did introduce me to a program called EBT, which is based on neuroplasticity and rewiring circuits, but she herself just fell into talk-therapy mode.

I am also shocked by how many people pipe up on this forum encouraging people to push through very troubling side effects, including disturbing thoughts and suicidal ideation, saying it is part of the healing process and that it will get better (often months out!). 

I believe they just want to feel better about the fact that they are using the drugs chronically.  Peter Breggin talks about psych med spellbinding, where we don't even realize that our personalities are changing for the worse due to the drugs, that we are having side effects that we just think are due to aging and such, when really it's the meds! It's the old frog in a pot of hot water analogy.

I wish I had figured this all out a lot sooner, now 20 years out from starting these.  None of my health care providers EVER questioned why I was still on the meds, just filling the scripts indefinitely!  I was completely spellbound!

In essence, he knows he's getting high off his meds, and he can't help himself. That's an addiction. 

I too was on anti-depressants in the 90's, for depression, and I was also on ADD meds - like Dexedrine. It was awful. I was on Wellbutrin in my 20's, and I had the same kinds of cravings and bad behavior he's struggling with. When I took myself off it all, began eating right, and exercising? It all went away, and I've never struggled since. He also tells me that, before Effexor, he was just a social drinker. I believe it, too. He wants so badly to get back under control, it's heartbreaking.

Fortunately, I am a trained counselor, specializing in addiction. I am hoping the center he's going to tomorrow will recognize his behaviors for what they are, and get him into the right treatment. The EBT therapy is AWESOME - and hard to find, as it is still in study/trial phases. Plus, since the DSM V is so owned by the pharmaceutical industry, how quickly do you think they're going to relinquish the hold medications have over the theraputic community and standards of practice?

This is why I encourage people to inform themselves, and most of all, NEVER JUST ACCEPT A DOCTOR'S WORD. You're not just a patient, you're a customer - fight for your self, advocate for what you REALLY want, and research, research, research. 

Betsy, good on ya that you're taking the brave stand!!

I'm confused, is your SO on the extended release version?  It is supposed to be taken once a day, and the immediate release twice a day.  Has he always been this way on this drug?  How long has he been on it?  I'm wondering if his reaction is some kind of tolerance withdrawal symptom!  So, the goal is to get him off by taking him to the rehab?

Have you been to the forum Surviving Antidepressants?  It would be interesting to see what folks say there about your SO's reaction.  I worry about what they'll do in rehab because so often they will try to add other drugs to quell withdrawal, and then the whole scenario gets a whole lot messier.  I was in protraced withdrawal from Effexor last year, didn't realize it, and was put on Viibryd briefly with horrific results, and then mirtazapine which helped me sleep but couldn't touch the WD symptoms, so now I'm on mirt AND Effexor!  Now that I know what was happening, I am in the process of tapering both, but not cutting simultaneously, too distressing to the nervous system!

Sounds like your SO isn't yet an active participant in his recovery, or at least he is messed up enough by the drug as to not be entirely rational.  I've seen other people join SA on behalf of a loved one.  Hope to see you there!

He is on XL (extended release), which I agree was misprescribed by a QUACK of an internalist (not a theraputic specialist) 5 years ago in Oregon, where he used to live. Since then, he's been carte blanche prescribed by overworked residents at other health care centers, who simply repeat the prescription, without interview or question. Frankly, when I was on Dexedrine, I had a doctor whom I could call - for years - at any time, and she'd call in a new script for me, without having seen me for years. Frightening. No, he should not be on a second dose - at all. He wants to go down to a 37.5 mg at night, and taper. 

The trouble is, this has been the only truly effective medication in treating his OCD, which was moderate to severe. He tells me stories of not being able to touch doorknobs, counting obsessively. He's been on SSRI's, they were awful to him. This medication eased his symptoms the first day. 

You may be right about tolerance withdrawal, his medication hasn't been adjusted ONCE, nor has he seen a therapist for monitoring EVER, which is illegal in the US for controlled substances (and if you need a script, it's a controlled substance, period. You're supposed to see an APRN or Psychiatrist every 3-6 months, by law). 

It sounds like he has always had this reaction to the drug, probably because he's been dosed too high. Our goal is to get him tapered down to a manageable dose, to start, let him adjust and help him with other coping mechanisms for his anxiety. For example, he wants to try yoga with me, which is one of the BEST treatments for depression and anxiety. It's worked wonders for me!! and he's walking too, every day, another great trick I've learned that helps with my issues. He's definitely invested, he's just never been exposed to support and alternatives before. To make matters worse, his family has been utterly unsupportive and downright destructive. That's why I'm encouraging he try therapy, and he's nervous but committed, and I couldn't be prouder I tell him every day that he's doing a brave thing, and he won't regret it. 

Also, I will be advocating for him, as he needs, if he needs, as I am his only family in the city where we live, so I'm his next-of-kin, so to speak. 

Anyway, nice to find such feedback!! I'll check out that other site too, thanks again!

I have a connection buddy through EBT who is manic-depressive, and has avoided the treadmill of drugs.  Through EBT he is finally learning to recognize his patterns and head things off before they escalate using the tools.  When it comes to bi-polar and OCD, or even schizophrenia, everyone seems to say "yup, need drugs for that," but he is an example of how bi-polar can be controlled using CBT.  It blows my mind how much he has evolved since I first met him just nine months ago!

Good luck - I think your guy is on his way!