Why the hurry with the TURP?

Hi Howie,

Thanks for such a comprehensive reply.

I haven't discounted the turp but I suppose I've discounted having it too soon. I'd prefer to try the drug route before thinking about other options, which for me look like a turp or nothing.

I had a kidney stone back in 2008 but nothing more until now. it was only because of the bladder stone that the BPH was discovered so I hadn't considered the symptoms worthy of going to my GP and though enlarged my prostate may be it doesn't cause me any too bothersome problems. I read on one website (Harvard) that BPH doesn't necessarily cause problems for all men. I've never really been questioned about this. Yes I have to get up a couple of times a night but otherwise not much of a problem apart if course from the stone. I've read that not eating meat & dairy, etc. helps reduce the chances of getting another stone and I no longer eat them anyway.

Whether these things are true I can't be sure but my daughter is a dietitian and says doctors (generally) are clueless about nutrition. So I was wondering if anyone else had a bladder stone, did it recur and did they end up having a turp anyway? Meanwhile once again thank you for taking the trouble to reply.

Hi everyone

I had bladderstones removed 3 years ago and had Urolift done at same time. I did have BPH

and that was most likely cause of the stones. Recovery was pretty easy. Sore for a few weeks but no big issues. Flow was really great at first. Not as good after 3 years but still adequate. So far no new stones. Ive had 2 ultrasounds to check for them. I understand that this may have been a temporary fix but so far so good. Fortunately I havent had to take any meds yet for the BPH . Im almost 74.

Tom C

There are several TURP versions ask them which one they do.

I need to get familiar with these various procedures like Urolift, 3 years doesn't sound very long though. I'd hoped these were 1 off procedures. Good to know your bladder stones haven't returned though.

They haven't mentioned this to me. I had a standard NHS leaflet listing the options which in practice boil down to just 3, do nothing, take meds, have a turp. As I say I think I need to do some research.

They are one off for some men. A friend had GL in 2004 and has not needed another. Another friend like me also needed a repeat.

Another option which I have chosen is Clean Intermittent Catheterization (CIC) which admittedly isn't for everyone but gets the job done while exploring options and avoiding intrusive surgeries with irreversible side effects. Some here have rehabbed their bladders through CIC and now void naturally without surgical intervention, which is my goal.

Patrick,

C.I.C is a good option as a temporary measure but, if you tolerate the procedure without ill effects, why not adopt this as your final goal? There are a few simple but easy rules to follow. I am well into my 4th year of successful C.I.C. and would be happy to share my experiences, without obligation. If interested just send me a Private Message and we can take it from there.

In the meantime I wish you all the best!

alan86734.

There may come a time when you cant get a catheter past your prostate. When I was going for a heart valve replacement I asked them if it was all right to come as I had a prostate infection. They said it was OK but in the theatre they could not get the catheter in and had to use a supra pubic one.

Alan,

I am most interested in your experience and will be happy to send you a message. I'm sure others here could benefit from your experience as well so I encourage you to share here on the forum.

Yes, I am fortunate that I adapted well to CIC and will keep it as an option for a long-term answer to avoid more intrusive remedies with little chance of success and possible irreversible side effects.

Our common condition has SO many options which should be considered before making a decision. Bottom line, it is up to us individually to make a decision on our care based on careful research and recommendations from our trusted health care providers. Don't get talked into a procedure that may not be the best for you.

Patrick

Hi, Derek,

Thank you for your comment. As most of us here acknowledge, many factors come into play as we compose our respective decisions. My prostate has remained remarkably stable over the years. I am using Fr-16 straight hydrophilic catheters and, so far, they just slide in effortlessly.

I'm approaching 91 years old now, and hoping that my prostate will continue to behave itself for the duration!

I wish you the very best, alan86734.

Hi, Derek,

My reply to this post came out as a separate post!!!

alan86734.

My suggestion of using PMs was to appease Moderators. I got thrown off "Patient" some time ago and I missed many posts before I managed to get myself reinstated again.

alan86734.

What makes you think that well established procedures done by reputable and experienced urologists are not sucessful ?

The Uro who did my GL in 2004 had a 92 year old patient with a prostate of nearly 100 grms. He did GL as he described it as a very gentle procedure.

When I has my second procedure in 2013 the surgeon suggested that I take Avodart to prevent future growth. I asked if he thought it had enough time to regrow to need further surgery. He glanced at his screen and said perhaps not. I was 79 at the time.

Hi, Patrick,

I've just read your PM. I see that you are not a complete "newbie", which answers most of my concerns. I would like to know where you are located so that I have an idea of your time zones. I live in Vermont, Northeastern United States. I will get back to you tomorrow.

Warm regards, Alan.

OK, whatever you feel comfortable with...

I was referring to my own personal condition after my urologist advised that chance of success for a procedure was 20-30% at best due to my bladder condition. I am hoping to rehab my bladder with CIC before considering any procedure.

Hi Alan,

I am located in Palm Harbor, Florida, same time zone as you.

Is your bladder condition due to having left surgery too late or for some other reason ?

Good question and one I can't answer. During an ER visit after a fall from my bike last September, CT scans found a "massively distended bladder" and 5300 mls of bloody urine was drained with a Foley. I was sent home with a Foley and referred to a urologist. Up until then, I was urinating normally (if a bit slow which I assumed was normal due to my age of 70) but after my bladder was drained I was unable to void naturally and failed the urodynamics test with the urologist. I was advised this had been happening for years (who knew?) and the culprit was my enlarged prostate.

So yes, I guess you could say I was late with surgery to treat my BPH but I was unaware that I was retaining urine as I was voiding naturally on a regular basis and had no other symptoms. The ER staff could not believe I was not in excruciating pain after draining 5300 mls. I wasn't, apparently due to nerve damage from the distended bladder.

So now while the urologist says there may be a procedure down the road ("...no use in expanding the pipe until the pump is working..."), I am researching options while hopefully rehabbing my bladder with CIC which others here in similar situations have done successfully, avoiding more intrusive surgery on the way.

Fortunately, I have adapted well to CIC and am considering it as a long-term solution, depending on how well my bladder rehab progresses.

Patrick

My late father in law had a similar experience to you. He had a fall in the street when he was 80 and was taken to A&E. Like you he was retaining over five litres and they fitted a catheter. My wife had commented on his swollen tummy that he put down to constipation.

Drugs did nit work and his health was not good enough for an operation so they fitted a stent. That was OK for a while but it eventually became blocked with granulated tissue and had to be removed and replaced with a permanent catheter by which time he had moved into a care home.

Yes, I thought I had just gained a few pounds...but walked out of the ER at least 10 lbs. lighter after 5+ litres were drained. My abdomen was noticeably flatter!

Hadn't heard of a stent being used...how did that work?

Patrick

From Wiki.

There are two types of prostatic stent: temporary and permanent.

Although a permanent prostatic stent is not a medical treatment, it falls under the classification of a surgical procedure. Placement of a permanent prostatic stent is carried out as an outpatient treatment under local, topical or spinal anesthesia and usually takes about 15–30 minutes.

A temporary prostatic stent can be inserted in a similar manner to a Foley catheter, requiring only topical anesthesia.

Thanks, I will add this to my list of questions to discuss on my next uro appt.

I see that like me you are a member of the AF and Arrhyhthmias Forums.

With continuous Afib, count me in too!

alan86734.

Yup, diagnosed January 2018 and managing well with Dofetillide and Pradaxa. Aren't the Golden Years great?

Misery enjoys company, eh? 8)

Mine is permanent now. Went into AF after aortic valve replacement. Second cardioversion put me back into NSR for 15 months . Then I had a colonoscopy where the probe stimulated my vegas nerve and my BP went down to 40/29 and heart rate 30 (bpm. That caused a panic in the room and they pumped drugs into me, Next day I found that I was in AF. Another cardioversion and another 15 months in NSR. Then I had a DRE in 2015 that also stimulated my vagus nerve. BP dropped again but not so dramatically and back into AF. This time permanent as they tell me that the size of my right atrium means that another cardioversion will not work. If I have an ablation that may reduce the size of my atrium ... no thanks.

I didn't like being on warfarin so had an Amplatzer amulet fitted (£10K )and also have a pacemaker that I'm convinced is faulty as my heart rate has dropped to

41 bpm. Pacemaker clinic say impossible but on 19th Feb paramedic and A&E monitors showed it. Back to pacemaker clinic on Thursday. My doctor had another patient like that and a lead had become loose.

They were when I retired at 59 in 1994 but I ran out of luck about five years ago after having been prescribed cipro and Fluoroquinolones for prostate infection at time of valve replacement and later. It can lay dormant for years until something else triggers it. In my case the antibiotic CLARITHROMYCIN and the cardiac drug

Bisopprolol (2015) each later triggered a wider range of symptoms.

Derek, I"m really sorry to hear of your problems. By comparison my bypass surgery and valve replacement were a child's play!

Warm regards and best wishes for your improving health, alan86734.

So far mine is paroxysmal knock on wood and has always been asymptomatic. It was discovered during a routine new patient appointment with my current PCP, who sent me to the ER where I was admitted and released after a cardioversion returned me to NSR...until my new PCP prescribed FLOMAX a few months later which put me back into AFib.

Like you, I had an interesting adventure with an attempt to undergo a colonoscopy that resulted in an ambulance ride to the ER. I had been in and out of AFib for several days before my scheduled colonoscopy but my Gastro and EP both gave the green light to proceed, taking me off Eliquis the night before the procedure. While being prepped, my HR spiked at 160-180, so the colonoscopy was aborted and I was transported to the ER where I was again admitted. The doctor there explained that it is not uncommon for the colonoscopy prep procedure (UGH!) to flush out vital minerals and cause dehydration which results in the Tachycardia that aborted the colonoscopy.

The good news is I started Dofetilide (generic Tikosyn) while in the hospital which returned me to NSR where I have remained since knock on wood.

Like you, I have avoided an ablation, but unlike you, my AFib is not persistent or permanent. If it was, I might consider the procedure and am curious why you would not?

Patrick