Always short of breath, yet not qualified for Oxygen?
Posted , 12 users are following.
Hello gang,
I have COPD (30% lung capacity) and have been reading/posting on this site for some time now. Each day is a new challenge. What used to be simple, is now a seriously planned military operation. Shopping, bathing, household chores, etc. get broken down into small movements. Sound familiar?
Even short 3 to 5 step activities have me leaning on a counter or wall as I catch my breath. My Dr. tells me that my O2 level is too high for him to recommend Oxygen therapy. My question is if my O2 level is in the 90s (with activity), then why am I still out of breath?
I'm sure that it's not an airway restriction issue or a mucus issue, as I have a handle on those symptoms. I just can't grasp how O2 would not add to my quality of life. I know that exhaling CO2 is a priority and I do the in 2 and out 3 to 4 breathing method. It does help relieve the breathlessness quicker, but I can't help but feel that O2 would help me when I am active.
I just can't resolve what I'm told, with how I feel. I've yet to hear/read an explanation for COPD's shortness of breath that satisfies me. Treatments do deal with airway restriction and mucus issues, but they do not treat shortness of breath.
I understand that O2 therapy enters a patient into new medical issue areas, but used carefully would it not serve to do more good for more desperate people. I welcome a discussion on this issue and hopefully I'll finally get a better explanation that makes sense for me.
All my best
3 likes, 48 replies
amkoffee larry49033
Posted
I was just at my pulmonologist yesterday and I talked to him about this very exact thing. Actually it was the nurse that told me that she has seen oxygen saturation levels of 95 and 96 with people who had fluid on their lungs . the doctor explained that it only measures the oxygen at the surface of the skin not in deep . I'm not really explaining it as well as he did but it made me feel more validated that I'm running a 94-95 and feeling like I'm gasping for breath. personally I have put away my oxygen because I cannot stand to wear it any longer. I do still have it at the house and I'm waiting to see if I have to use it again in the next 3 months. If not I plan on returning it. as for you and oxygen have you had a sleep study done? it might be worth having one done if you have not. Your oxygen saturation maybe so low when you sleep that it is affecting your awake time. this is not the same thing as sleep apnea. it could be that too but in my case my oxygen dropped significantly when I was asleep. if you don't want to do a sleep study then at least try wearing a special oximeter at night that will watch your oxygen level while you sleep. this alone could answer some questions for you and your doctor.
aitarg35939 larry49033
Posted
Ditto what both Hypercat and Amkoffee said -- newest version here won't let me click the thumbs up button.
Do you get any exercise, Larry? The pool has been wonderful for helping me regain strength & stamina. where i live if i can pay i can access an indoor pool with in-water treadmill. can't do one on land but i can start at a low speed for 5-10 minutes & build up. They also have all sorts of equipment. i force myself to extend my breathing, especially in the hardest ab exercises.
See if you can inhale for a slow 2, hold 2, exhale 3-5. Try for that for up to 10 times, 3 times daily. on the exhale, force yourself to hold at least half a beat before inhaling. After a week or 2, try extending to 3-3 -&4-6 exhale. If you are able, keep extending that.
sorry but i've got no science to add
ladyjack51 larry49033
Posted
Hi Larry
I am also very short of breath but after many tests they found that a ventricle in my heart is only pumping at 25%...so i get very tired with any exertion. Also i retain C02 bc I'm a shallow breather and also I tend to breath more from my mouth and it falls open. I have very poor circulation all the time bc of lack of oxygen in my body. I just saying, yours could be secondary to your heart or another issue. God Bless You
ladyjack51
georgy0 ladyjack51
Posted
Hi,
This is exactly what I had initially suspected when I read Larry's message, that something else was going on, for his oxygen levels to feel so depleted, while actually being fairly good. Often, if the heart becomes involved, it does affect the breathlessness, as it was pointed out to me during my last admission to hospital. Sometimes, doctors don't have time to consider what else could be going on inside a person when they have such limited time during an appointment. In my case, another condition caused the problem to begin with in my heart, and was quite difficult to find. Fortunately, the doctor was convinced he knew this to be the reason, and that is why he kept searching. It is worthwhile asking to have more tests, of a different nature to those already done and found to be ok. You put it down in your message with a very good description, while all I could suggest was there could be another problem that is happening to coincide with the COPD. Well said to You!
ladyjack51 georgy0
Posted
Thank you Georgy0...what you said was fine. I just broke it down alittle more for him.
One time I replied similarly to this to someone and Lord have mercy..lolol..this guy jumped all over me saying how dare I scare this person like that etc, etc, etc. I didnt have to say a word back bc other people shut him up. I dont intend to scare anyone but dont come on here and ask questions if you are too scared to hear what people might say. I hope Larry realizes what we mean. Thanks again Georgy0
amkoffee ladyjack51
Posted
I remember that incident. I am one of the many that came to your defense. I'm glad it didn't stop you from responding to other questions. Have a great day!
ladyjack51 amkoffee
Posted
Thank you so much Amkoffee!!!
ladyjack51
larry49033 ladyjack51
Posted
I'm sorry if I upset you before, but I honestly can't recall all that was posted. For me it's water under the bridge and I've moved forward and beyond it. I wish you well and hope that your COPD ordeal and any additional medical issues are being treated without additional issues.
Breathing exercises have been mentioned by myself and by others as well. I use them to expel my CO2 as I find it necessary. Perhaps you should consult with your Dr. about O2 therapy. In your case it sounds to me that it my ease your symptoms and add to your quality of life.
In the end, each of us is looking for any way possible to gain a better quality of life moving forward.
All the best
ladyjack51 larry49033
Posted
Hi Larry
I am also very short of breath but after many tests they found that a ventricle in my heart is only pumping at 25%...so i get very tired with any exertion. Also i retain C02 bc I'm a shallow breather and also I tend to breath more from my mouth and it falls open. I have very poor circulation all the time bc of lack of oxygen in my body. I just saying, yours could be secondary to your heart or another issue. God Bless You
ladyjack51
campbell74456 larry49033
Posted
Hello Larry, I wouldn't presume to offer any sort of medical advice or comment but I'm wondering if you should perhaps pursue this with your doctor/consultant a little more. I don't know what my lung capacity is but my SAT's are generally quite a bit lower than yours, usually around 86/87 on a good day and I was prescribed ambulatory oxygen some years ago following lung reduction. Afterwards I attended a six week rehabilitation course (effectively exercise classes) and it was early on that one of the nurses saw I was struggling for breath sometimes and ordered oxygen for me. I've been using it ever since, mainly exercising or gardening but occasionally during this period of a high pollen count I sometimes have to use it when I play bowls. Perhaps another word.......................!
larry49033
Posted
Thanks to all for your most interesting comments.
As for my heart, it has always beat faster with activity. Also my Dr. and I have discussed this point.
As for exercise, I get all that I can handle with just doing the daily chores. I'm breathless with the 5 step trip from the Kitchen to the couch.
Also, I know and do the breathing exercises.
My original question remains. Apart from the bronkitis and the associated mucus problems, why does emphysema make us struggle to breath? Why is it that one can show an O2 level of 90 or better (that says there enough O2), while at the same time that same person is sucking wind to supply themselves with enough O2? It is a contradiction in logic.
I'm not saying to put all COPD patients on O2 therapy, but could not the careful and prudent use of O2 help relieve many people of their daily suffering. I fully understand the danger of tipping the scale in the wrong direction also. That is why training and use protocols would need to be tailored for each patient. I think that it is known that O2 would indeed help many, but the Insurance/Service Providers are unwilling to pay for it. They set up conditions that only the near dead can qualify for and withhold paying beyond their set levels.
What is emphysema? What is it doing to our breathing? Is it the reason that many COPD patients are always out of breath? Can Oxygen Therapy help ease emphysema symptoms?
All my best
georgy0 larry49033
Posted
The BLF, (British Lung Foundation) covers loads of information, video's, suggestions, PLUS they will answer Personal Questions, which you can ask via phone or EMAIL. There are resources you can follow through their Links, and the information is Genuine, not people guessing. I live in the UK which makes it a bit easier to find this site, but if you try to find it, I am sure they will give you all of the information you wish to know.
Hope this will help you.
hypercat larry49033
Posted
Emphysema causes damage at the bottom of the lungs called the aveloi. This is where oxygen and carbon dioxide exchange gases and damage can cause build up of this carbon dioxide in your blood stream.
There is obviously enough oxygen in your body so this is why your sats are high. If carbon monoxide remains trapped in your aveloi then it prevents the full exchange of gases. If you use oxygen this will only increase it. The answer is to learn some exercises to help release this gas from your lungs. Then you will be able to breathe better. However coz these are damaged you can improve the situation but not cure it.
amkoffee hypercat
Posted
Is there a test that can be used to check for this overload of carbon dioxide without having a sleep study done?
larry49033 hypercat
Posted
Exhaling CO2 is the key breathing better with COPD. No one is disputing that fact, However many are on O2 as a therapy and not as a constant 24/7 thing. O2 users report that it greatly improves their quality of life.
Exhaling CO2 and inhaling an air supply with additional O2 , on a limited schedule, does not sound dangerous. Healthy athletes are regularly seen gulping O2 through face masks on the sidelines following a long run or physically draining efforts. So I don't believe that prudent/limited O2 use is the issue, but that too many would abuse the privilege and do more harm than good. After all self discipline so often is the scale tipping issue in our lives. Often it is the weakness that those with weight problems and smokers and other treatable conditions can (if honest) point at as just why their health problems continue.
That said, self discipline can be a great health asset. Exercise (for those physically able) stems from choosing to live healthier lives. People in their 70s and even 80s running in races or regular participants at local health centers/ gymnasiums.
My point is that I believe that the health care community does not want to allow more to access O2 through their health care coverage because people don't have the self discipline to use it properly. Also they do not want to pay the cost it would generate.
Last, I've heard that testing a patients O2 saturation level may be very different in a blood test as opposed to the skin test taken with the equipment that is clipped to a finger tip. I've heard that the skin test as a rule reads higher than a blood test does. Are we sacrificing our health for convenience.
All my best
hypercat larry49033
Posted
Well I am no expert but am on the BLF and have heard numerous times about this issue. My information is taken from very knowledgeable people.
We will just have to agree to differ I'm afraid.
hypercat amkoffee
Posted
I have no idea so the best thing is to ask a medical professional. I hope you are well my friend. x
aitarg35939 larry49033
Posted
Interestingly, in this century there have been studies that show that the ability to lose weight is tied to the ability to fully exhale CO2 from the body. This explains why people such as Himself lose no weight tho their calorie intake drops by 500+ calories daily, IMHO. He was overweight but not morbidly obese or anywhere near that. He, too, repulsed all suggestions that movement &/or breathing exercises could help him.
Tis a choice, alright.