Endoscopy Fear

I had it with sedation last time I remember gagging, after that it was a huge blur and I lost around 15 minutes, where I have just no recollection.

My concern is all the man handling. that what scares and panics me

how bad is it without sedation. i dont want to go under.

It not a small pipe I can assure you of that

Just found out what a "manhandling" is... They reassured me at the St Thomas's hospital in London, that they'd never do that... I don't believe it anymore. I'm glad that I canceled my endoscopy this morning even though I'm in a lot of abdominal pain.

Elle, if your picture is anything to go by, you're quite young. In your case, you'll get an adequate dose of sedatives, so you definitely won't remember a thing about it. And that's the important thing. I realise there's a fine philosophical point in here somewhere, but does it really matter if you get held down as long as you don't remember anything about it? My own objection was that they manhandled me when I was fully conscious and therefore able to remember the whole thing. And then had the arrogance to inform me immediately afterwards that I was about to crash out and wouldn't remember a thing when I woke up! Obviously not true, or I wouldn't be writing this.

But to reiterate - I was 69 at the time of the procedure, so only received a tiny dose of sedation. If you're under 65 and you don't have any heart or breathing problems, you'll get the full dose. Also, my case was much more complicated than a straight down-and-up-again gastroscopy. My reply to Jimmy was meant for the over-65s in here, who doesn't say how old he is, not younger people like you.

As an ex-nurse, though, I have to say I agree with you in not believing what St. Thomas's are telling you. I have no specific knowledge of this hospital, just doctors and hospitals in general! I do feel they should be more honest.

Btw, I'm assuming that by "endoscopy" you mean a gastroscopy - a tube down into the stomach? A colonoscopy (other end!) and a bronchoscopy (down into the lungs) are also endoscopies.

If you're having a lot of abdominal pain you shouldn't ignore it, but try to find out what's causing it. If you're really too scared to go through with it, you could try insisting on a general anaesthetic. Another option would be a CT scan. You might need to change doctors but it's worth a try. Some are more flexible than others on things like this.

Most important - try a bit of self-help. Can you identify what it is you're doing or eating that makes the pain worse? I sometimes have an ulcer-type pain in my stomach when I'm stressed, so I know I have to chill out and be a bit careful about what I eat for a few weeks when that happens. (And stay off the wine, of course!) It's always worked so far.

Thank you for your kind reply lili! I'm 32 but my problem here is that I'm a bit more complex physically and the doctors dont tend to take this seriously (which is the reason why they cause damage to people).

I believe that I have a bit smaller stomach and when I it accumulate gases (when I’m on a bus or a car or just eat a bit more) it doesnt have space to expand much and starts pressing my lungs and heart which causes me to faint from the lack of oxygen. (Doctors NEVER assume that).

Then I can't lie on my left side as my heart starts struggling so I only sleep on my right side. Then I also have 10 years history of grand mall epilepsy, I have a blood pressure 90/60 which my body is comfortably adjusted to and I feel great when it's that low. When it gets 120/90 - I get muscle spasms, start vomiting and feel like my head will explode.

Another problem is that I have a really bad reaction on diazepam, valerian, nurofen and all other painkillers for the same reason – low blood pressure. I also can't take sleeping pills or birth controls (because of the epilepsy).

I don’t drink alcohol, coffee, fizzy drinks for the same reason. Also doctors never measure the sedation according your weight or blood pressure and I’m only 46kg.

I have a friend who was overdosed with sedatives and nearly died because her blood pressure went too low.

I’m also very aware of my body and if someone holds me down when I’m trying to give a signal that something is not right – it will most probably kill me as they wont stop to check on me and if I start having seizures from a lack of oxygen, due to the air in my stomach – the endoscope will rip me up internally and I’ll be dead before they take it out.

The biggest problem is that they said all these things are IMPOSSIBLE to happen which made it clear to me that they are not competent to handle any complications and they will blame it all on the patient if any damage is caused. So I just couldn't entrust them with my health and had to cancel it.

But I'm going to my gp on Monday to ask for an appointment with another gastroenterologist and get a second opinion.

Wow Elle you hae some challenges there and if you cant get the ressurance you need then your right to say "no way"

I also feel so but they probably did curse me a lot this morning when I cancelled lol. Honestly I'd have trusted them if they showed up more confident and considerable to my concerns, instead of shouting at me and insisting that I'm talking nonsense. Unfortunatelly doctors think they are gods and know your body better than yourself. Fact

Your are right they some surgeon do play god. and if they cant reassure you and instead bully you then that is not care in any shape or form

Amen to both the above comments. And I know what I'm talking about...

But do look at what is triggering your attacks of abdominal pain, Elle. It should be possible to identify the cause and deal with it. I firmly believe in self-help and live my life largely outside of the medical "system" apart from seeing a dentist, getting blood pressure and eye pressure checked and blood tests from time to time. My endoscopy experience was the exception, of course - but then it's not that easy getting a denture out of your own throat!

I'm glad that you are that honest Lily! I hope some day all nurses are like you!

However I tried really hard to find out what is causing it but couldn't. I isolated the foods, stopped the gluten for a while, nothing.

The pain comes after I eat, when I don't eat, when I'm sleeping, when I'm running, when I'm nervous or when I'm calm. It's like a stabbing and it's pulsing. It lasts usually for 30-40 minutes and then it's gone.

It starts from the liver exactly at the point of the gall bladder; I first thought it was the hepatic flexure but it's a 2-3 centimeters to the left so that should be the gall blader, according to anathomy pictures. Then it moves to the left between the bottom line of the stomach and the transverse mesocolon but not sure which one as they overlap. Then sometimes I'd fel the pain in the left part of my ribcage at the bag - where the kidney is. Then the pain usually starts traveling on zig zag down the sides of my abdomen but never in the middle. And if I apply pressure with fingers on the spot of the pancreas - I have a very sharp pain. That's the picture basically. And this has been going on for more than 2 years now.

Unlikely to be liver or gallbladder, then! Pain in either of these - especially the latter - is usually felt in the right shoulder blade or even the tip of the shoulder itself. Kidney pain is rarely felt over the kidney itself either. The same goes for a lot of other abdominal organs. Wiring of the nerves in this area is a bit inadequate, so some sensory nerves have to do duty for others.

By all means have your MRI but if everything comes back negative, I'd strongly suggest you simply stop worrying about yourself, accept this pain and learn to live with it. Sounds odd, but this is often how the body works. Not many doctors will tell you that - after all, they depend on people being ill to make a living - but it's often how it works out in real life.

The interaction between mind and body is very complex. And "psychosomatic' doesn't mean the same as "imaginary". That's a mistake a lot of people make. Psychosomatic conditions can cause a range of verifiable signs, including serious abnormalities on blood tests etc. For that matter, you can even die of a psychosomatic condition!

But you don't have to. You're still young enough to heal yourself. Have all the investigations that are prescribed for you, even the dreaded gastroscopy if you can bear it (though you shouldn't need one if you can get an abdominal MRI). If something is found, get it treated. If nothing significant shows up - which often happens in cases like yours - then just accept it and start trusting your body.

I'm not really talking as a former nurse here - though more nurses than doctors would be likely to agree with me. I'm talking from personal experience. I had all kinds of mystery illnesses when I was young. Then I got wise to what my mind was doing to my body. I'm 71 now and have the constitution of an ox!

Yes, Im aware of the complexity of the nervous system. And yet, all nurses laugh at me when I tell them that if I they insert a needle in the inside of my elbow and start withrawing blood - I feel it as if the needle is stuck in my head, behind my ear lol. No one believes me.

I also know that the stress is what triggers the explosion of abnormalities and symptoms but if a certain type of stress lasts for too long - then an illness occurs.

Unfortunatelly I'm a very complex a mind and my brain works on many levels at the same time. According to my EEG record my brain is incapable of producing proper Alpha waves for some reason. So I can't really get to the point of relaxation. I just have to keep myself busy to avoid anxiety and stress.

I'm also very conscious about any drugs, I question and make a research about every word a doctor says to me. Let's hope I get lucky with the MRI, if not, I'll ask a friend of mine who is a doctor to come and be present during the gastroscopy and assist me with the procedure so no one lays a finger on me.