Flu and Pneumonia Shots

Thanks to all for your input. I guess i'll be getting flu shot in October. I think I 'll wait a bit for the pneumonia shot. Don't like all this stuff being injected into my system all at once. The last time I had the pneumonia shot, I couldn't lift my arm for 3 weeks. It was awful.

Really? You are worried about lifting your arm? How about worrying about your family lifting your coffin!? Seriously, as someone posted above...the flu can kill you! I too had a sore arm after flu vaccine one year. Haven't had a sore arm in any I have had since then. A sore arm is nothing compared to being on a ventilator, having central line access, nasogastric tube, multiple drugs to keep you alive! Vaccines save lives!! 

My husband missed his flu shot a few years ago because he had bronchitis when it was due - he forgot to go back. He caught flu and spent the best part of 2 weeks in bed. Then he developed pneumonia which took 6 months to clear completely and meant him needing 2 CT scans - to be sure it wasn't anything worse. Since he only has one and a rather useless bit of his lungs it matters. He won't be missing the flu shot again!

Having done my homework - I see it is now recommended that people over 65 with chronic conditions get both types of pneumococcal vaccine.

BUT NOT AT THE SAME TIME: 

PCV13 should be given first and PPSV23 at a later visit.

He'd had the 5-year one before but then was given the one-off and told he needn't bother again. I think we may revisit this with the GP!

Please let me know what you find out.  Our doctor, who is of course new to us, and especially my husband, told hubby he needn't get a further pneumonia shot.  He used to get a bout of pneumonia at least once a year, usually May, before the shot, and never since then, several years now.  Has allergies, sinus trouble and asthma.  She made no mention of the fact that there are now two vaccinations for the disease and given his lifelong history I think he should be getting them both.  I'm a bit puzzled about this as she's keen on vaccines and makes sure to ask about flu vaccination, and even if tetanus booster is up to date.   

There are two kinds of pneumonia vaccines.  I don't know if either of them need to be repeated.  

But if they don't do drastic things "to keep you alive" is pneumonia not called the old man's friend?  I remember having flu many years ago, haven't had it since, and at the time all I wanted to do was lie in bed and sleep.  I thought it wouldn't be a bad way to die.  At least it wasn't painful.  But one of my sons made me go to the doctor and get treated, so I've lived to see many more days.  Now I'm ever so much older and there's not much point to being alive.

Come on Anhaga - I suspect there are a few people at least who'd rather have you alive. And if you feel like that - you need help. I'm not a lot younger than you and I'm looking forward to at least another 20 years...

Anhaga - last sentence!  Do you really feal like that?  I thought you were doing so well!  You often advise people to keep active and eat well.  Or have I misunderstood you?

Yes, pretty much.  The only help I need would be to live in a community where I could run into friends and acquaintances on a regular basis instead of having to work on setting a time or date.  There was an item on the radio this morning about social isolation being at a crisis level amongst seniors in a number of countries.  They talked about a silver line or something in the UK which is basically a help line for isolated seniors to call in for a chat with a friendly voice.  Unfortunately the Canadian expert interviewed made rather light of the situation here.  Over twenty years ago I had a job as a census representative which involved among other things calling at every dwelling in an area.  I found two groups of people wanted to be sociable with me.  One was the poorer people living in flats who would invite me in to see the new kittens, that sort of thing; the other group was the old women who desperately wanted to have me stay and have a cup of tea with them (I couldn't).  As children and young teens my friends and I used to go calling on the old women in our neighbourhood, and for years, until they died off one by one, I'd send them Christmas cards and small gifts.  I still make a point to keep in touch with my dwindling number even more aged relatives by post.  We used to shovel the driveways of old people on our street when we moved here.  For some reason I fantasized that this was the way old people were cared for in a community.  But the world has changed.  

One point made in the interview re social isolation is that this can only be dealt with through friendships, families do not alleviate this feeling.

I'd love it if we could get cohousing here.  Lots of people want it, but we have never been able to get the critical mass which could get a project up and running.  

What bothers me about the flu shot is that people I know who had the shot, got the flu and then they were told it was because it was a different strain.

There's a 5-year shot; the other one is a one-time only.

Last year I understand that there was only 20% effectiveness for the flu shot,  They have to make an educated guess at which strains are likely to be effective in a given year, and sometimes they just guess wrong.  I believe there is research ongoing to find a flu shot which will work more universally against most if not all strains.

Are there no Senior Citizen Clubs in your area?  Libraries?  They often provide as an outlet for seniors looking to mingle with other seniors.

I used to work in the library.  This week I'm getting together with several former coworkers.  It's taken several weeks and numerous emails to organize this - and really all I wanted was lunch with one or two at a time, to spread the joy!  I go to any library programs which interest me, and they are getting quite good at catering to the older folk.  I volunteer at various places.  I take classes but what I want to do (draw) is hard to come by.  No, I'm not holed up in my house not trying, although it may seem like it.  Today I walked, did some errands, and am home for a while before going out to learn how to be a volunteer with the Canadian National Institute for the Blind.  But it would be nicer for me if a friend was also doing the same thing.  Have always been a bit of a square peg in a round hole which makes things a lot more difficult, but that's really nothing new.  Just harder to meet like minded people now.  One of the things older people say, especially those who've been widowed, is they miss having someone to do nothing with.  I think in olden times, if you lived long enough, you could hang out on a bench under the village tree and be part of the life of the village.

Have you checked your neighborhood schools?  Ours offer classes; art, knitting, exercising, writing, dancing, etc.

Thank you for your suggestions,  We used to have a fantastic continuing education department.  Long before the concept of "senior" ever entered my mind, through classes offered through this school board program I learned to watercolour, smock, stencil, needlepoint (tapestry), studied Chinese brushwork, did calligraphy, went to a workshop on reflexology.  My husband did woodworking.  But this department was closed to save money quite a few years ago.  There's nothing equivalent available today.  Classes at the local art college which I used to sign up for quite regularly are now prohibitively expensive. I've signed up to make my own furoshiki at a Craft Council workshop in November, if they get enough students, and have taken classes in felting and painting on silk there.  Our city Parks and Recreation department offers programs related to physical activity, which is where I study Tai Chi, and another local organization offers a free lesson in Nordic walking, which is what got me started with that.  I also, although I've no voice to speak of, joined a community choir which I absolutely love.

I'm part of a small writers' group, which I actually started years ago, which meets fortnightly, and that's the best, but every two weeks can often be the only real conversation I have with anyone for months on end.  But all of this, along with the volunteering, is busy work, to keep my mind off the fact that there really is no purpose.

Oh, but there is a purpose.  Volunteering is a wonderful outlet; not only for you but for those you are helping.  I have a friend, much older than I (a very active 85) who volunteers at the local hospital.  She is with people all day long and she loves it.  She does it 3 times a week.  Also, I don't know of what faith you are, but the church is also a wonderful place to meet people, and they are always needing volunteers.  YOU HAVE A PURPOSE!

?

Well, the powers that be better tell me what that purpose is pdq because time is awasting here and I've been trying on activities for size, both the making or doing things kind and the volunteering kind, forever.  I'd better go now and get some productive chores done here.  Thank you for your kind words.

That is possible - but it usually protects you from IRO 50% of the strains floating around and many people feel it helps your immune system kick back against the others. 

Every llittle helps...

From the little reading I have done it seems both of these pneumococcal vaccines cover pneumococcal...one covers 13 strains and the other 23 strains. Pneumococcal is not flu. That is why two vaccines are recommended to over 65yr olds. Pnuemococcol is covered in childhood vaccines. Unfortunately, the anti vax movement is influencing scared, gullible people and vaccine rates are dropping. I saw my first case of pneumococcal disease last week....hadn't seen it since the late 90's. This child was very sick and needed life support for several days. So sad these preventable diseases are coming back. Have your flu shot. Have the pneumococcal shot. Oh...and let me tell you...tetanus is a hideous disease.....cared for a child with that several years ago! Horrendous! Vaccines save lives!

Sorry you feel so down Anhaga.  It IS difficult to talk to family, you don't want   them to worry and they are so busy dashing here there and everywhere.  When we were young we were so exhausted after work we were just pleased to 'switch' off - we learnt how to relax.  Now we have time enough, and the exhaustion is due to illness but that 'learnng to relax' has never left us.😊

You, too, seem to pack as much as possile into life (perhaps too much)???

Anhaga, can you please private message me.  I have no little envelopes under peoples names so can't send messages, but I can receive them and then answer them more thoroughly.  Mad!! My website keeps kcking me off!

Regards from Constance.

I'm talking about 2 different pneumonia vaccines - the flu shot is a third and totally different entity. 

As I understand it, the PPV23 works well in healthy adults:

"Most healthy adults develop a good antibody response to a single dose of PPV by the third week following immunisation. Antibody response may be reduced in those with immunological impairment and those with an absent or dysfunctional spleen. Children younger than two years of age show poor antibody responses to immunisation with PPV."

Children under 2 who have an incompletely developed immune response and patients with any degree of compromised immune system are more likely to develop immunity due to the conjugate version of the vaccine:

"The antibody response in young children can be improved by conjugating the polysaccharide to proteins such as CRM197. The conjugated vaccine is known to be immunogenic in children from two months of age. Data on immunogenicity comes from four studies using the UK childhood immunisation schedule of a primary course of two doses, at least two months apart, and a third dose in the second year of life. In a study conducted in the UK comparing the seven valent (Prevenar® and thirteen valent (Prevenar13® PCV, the functional antibody responses were comparable for all serotypes common to both vaccines (Wyeth, 2010). Studies have also shown good functional antibody responses to the additional six serotypes in the thirteen valent PCV (Prevenar13®." 

Using both in adults over 65 covers more bases - always a good approach.

You don't need to tell me about the importance of vaccines of any sort - or the stupidity of the anti-vaccination squad. Or the evil-ness of Andrew Wakefield's lies about MMR. 

Anhaga, I think you have been a real friend for so many of us on this forum with your pragmatic, well-informed views and advice and, most importantly, your optimistic and 'can do' approach.

Now you're saying that you feel that there is no one there for you - and that is so sad. I agree with you that family are not as helpful as friends are when you get older. I'm not sure what you can do about this but you've you've spoken about something that touches us all - I'm sure we've ALL stood in our kitchens on a morning feelig really low and thinking 'is this how my life is supposed to be? Because it's crap.'  

But you know this feeling and questioning of life is what makes us human. The fact that, ultimately, we are all alone is scary and we all run from it and busy ourselves with other things to take our minds off it for a while. But it keeps returning . . .  

You say 'there really is no purpose' for you - well, for you and the rest of us! Philosophers have been engaged with this fundamental question for over 2,000 years. And there IS no answer to the question 'how do I live my life in a way that has purpose and meaniing to me?' There are many notable inspiring lives lived throughout history but for most of us it can be just getting through each day as best we can, being kind to others (all of whom share our plight), and, hopefully, connecting to music, art and nature. .  .

Finallly, you could attend a Philosophy course as an adult eventing class in your university?  Your intelligence, honesty and ability to question would both make you an asset to the class, and, overall, would be of huge benefit to yourself. 

Big hug,  J

PS. Low mood is normal and usually transient. BUT if it lasts for more than 2 weeks, do have a chat with your doctor.

 

Thank you, Juno, for your words.  I probably misled people a bit.  I have got family, I was referring to a radio program which discussed the problem of social isolation and this program pointed out that family is not what solves that issue.  It's great to have family around, and although I have a very small family on this continent they are pretty nice people.  And as for the lack of a sense of purpose, this is a condition of being human I think.  One can spend most of a lifetime being busy, productive, whatever, but in a way this is just holding back the darkness.  It's important to face that darkness.  Does it conceal demons or treasures?  And in the end we are all alone are we not?  As Peter Pan said, "To die will be an awfully big adventure"

All of which came from a discussion about whether to get vaccinated or not, and my feeling that pneumonia or flu might be a whole lot better than some other death-dealing diseases.🐉

Or as (I thnk it was WoodyAllen?) said "I don't mind dying, I just don't want to be there when it happens".😏