for better or worse

well said carmel x

Hi Julie. A lot of people who have negative thinking or (so called) depression tend to dwell on other people and other events. I

It is their way of avoiding dealing with their own situations. And when they are dealing with others they can get it all wrong but still feel that they have got it right.

I used to know a lady who had a terrible marriage and always made the most stupid mistakes regarding that and her husband yet she was always THINKING she knew best about everyone else and their relationships. When you hears the so called advice she would have given them it made your hair stand on end because it was so ridiculous.

If she had spent 10% of the time she spent on thinking about their lives on her own life it might have had a better chance of working out.

T

hi carmel, i know i do it alot it helps depressed people cope and think to them selfs it could be worse. its only now im starting to think about my self after hitting rock bottom, we do need to put our selfs first , and try and surround our selfs with the possitive! because it can make depressed people worse and guilty x

Yes Julie. But the main reason some of the people who think about others and things that might happen or have happened overseas (a plane crash for example) is because they want to avoid sorting out their own things.

You know there are about a dozen different types of depression and 80% of people who claim they are depressed are not, they are simply fed up or unhappy or lacking in motivation. There is no such thing as depression that goes on forever if it is sorted out and it can be sorted out. Think of how wonderful that is compared to say being blind where the best that can happen is that you get a guide dog to hep you.There are no actual cures for that.

Some depressed people think about themselves far too much but usually in a "poor little me" obsessed and immature way and then they wonder why it is that other people dont want to spend time with them anymore.

I used to have a friend who would want to spend our whole time together going on about how sucidal she was. She would get "suicidal" over something like the postman being ten minutes late. In other words she wanted a perfect life. She had no worries at all. But she could never understand that other people would shun her and avoid her because of how defeated and boring and negative she always was.

did she! what advise would she give them? i can do understand that i think alot of people are guity of that thinking there helping when in fact there not. i have met many people like this who have tried to give me advise (wrong advice and hurt me in doing so. we have to listen to our selfs more. do they not realise what they are doing .x

thats very true! there crying out for help but need to think what there doing to others. how do u think they could stop this and sort it out. this is great advise carmel x

Hi Julie. They do it because they are interfering busy bodies and it makes them feel superior and important. Really it is very conceited to assume they can advise you with something worth following. You may have thought about your problem for months or years so how can they suddenly know all the answers in just a few minutes? Unless we are talking about a well qualified experienced sensible professional they will be out of their depth.

Hello again Julie. I had someone trying to give me unwanted advice last week. I was talking to them about something that made me unhappy. It is something which I am unable to do anything about otherwise believe me I would have.

But of course this person jumped in with that I should go on holiday because EVERYONE needs a holiday regularly and everyone needs to escape from their life regularly and EVERYONE needs a change of scene regularly. I said really. Well that has nothing to do with the problem. And if I had the money and the time and the interest in a holiday I would have sorted one out already. But I dont enjoy them and I dont have the money etc. They had completely changed the subject and were generalising and assuming that everyone had the same needs, money etc as them.

To be honest Julie if my life was such that I NEEDED to escape from it then I would change things in my life, not just run away from it for a week or two and then return to feeling miserable again.

hi carmel. u have given me food for thought my x mother in law was like that a lovely lady but suffered with depression but coped well with it. she was my boss and once said to me you live to work had a awfull effect on me as i was also looking for help at the time as she was my boss in a new job i ended up believing her as i repected her, i wouldnt do that now plus she was allways interfering in my life and my sons! dont get me wrong she was a great help in getting me back into work but she wasnt happy at home as her husband suffered with depression and she was on ADs x

Wel you know / knew her well, i have never met her. But have met a lot of people who are sort of similar to how she sounds. My grandmother said something to me when I was about 20. She said that people make too much of love and sex and both are not at all important. She did not love my granddad, they never had sex, so she thought I should know this and be the same. I told her to get stuffed.

You have to think for yourself and make your own decisions. Sometimes people know deepdown they hve made a mistake and they want you to follow them so that they are not the only one who is unhappy. It is a bit like them jumping into quick sand and as they gradually disappear - never to be seen again - they shout out at you that you should jump in too.

People have to earn respect. My grandmother was often criticising me and talking down to me and being all superior to me and talking as if the fact she was a lot older automatically meant she knew everything. She knew very little.

And in a lot of ways I was more experienced and qualified than her.

When I was a child she bought me a typewriter for christmas. She said that if I worked very hard and practiced and was very lucky I would be able to get a job as a typist one day. I had no interest in being a typist and was aghast at her idea that men get good jobs and women do badly paid boring jobs. Within ten years of that conversation I was running my own business with a lot of staff. Why listen to people who put you down? They are either diong it to rain on your parade or because they feel inadequate themselves.

i get that carmel but a holiday can be good just for the rest. but no not everyone as the money to do this ! alot of people have said to me are you going away this year do u good! but impossible i dont think they mean any harm , but saying to you you need a holiday regulary isnt possible 

LOL. Julie. I dont need holidays. I work just a few hours a week when it suits me and I only do work that I love doing. I have plenty of time to relax and do what I want. I live in a lovely house where I have all of the comforts I want. It is much nicer than most hotels. I have no reason to want to be anywhere else and I dont need a rest. If I wanted to I could totally retire and not work at all. I love my lifestyle. It makes far more sense to me to have a lifestyle I enjoy every dayh of the year than to make do with one and just do what I want now and then when I have a holiday. I live with my four tiny dogs and would miss them far too much to go. I also NEED to be here to run the businesses even though it is just a few hours a week and to take care of the gardens. I would not want to come back to find my businesses have gone to rack and ruin and my plants have all died either. I have not had a holiday for about 35 years. Even if you gave me the money to go away on a holiday and offered to come in and take care of the dogs and the gardens and business I would say no thanks I do not want to go. You see we are all different and all have different commitments, lifestyles, needs, wishes and finances. Someone who needs a holiday or wants them would not go without them for 35 years. Financially when I do have cash tgo spare I would much rather spend it on more plants for the garden or something tangible that I can keep. This was my point.

hi again :-) thats so true my mother made some awfull mistakes in her life but seemed to want me to follow her but i changed that and went my own way .. how do we deal with people like this. great advise carmel this is the stage im at at the moment stepping back and thinking about what makes me happy not what makes everyone happy my sister told me she as my step dad staying with her i would love to be involved but due to the fact he hurt me once , through the things your talking about he would advise me in the past but wrong advise as he was not happy in his own life. dont they realise there doing it?

understandable! i wouldnt mind a holiday through had a terrible year and just hit 50 arhh LOL 

So long as you dont do it too. If they are making mistakes and then trying to advise others they are immaturem big headed and naive. So let them be immature, big headed and naive but make sure you dont follow suit.

Would you go to a person who is fat, eats burgers and smokes a lot for advice on health? NO. Would you listen just because they are much older than you? No. Why does the fact they are related to make it different? They are still unintelligent, naive or lacking in knowledge.

I have had pepole who have never had a proper job let alone run a business trying to give me unasked for advice on how to run a business. This is just as ridiculous.

If a person cannot get it right themselves they n they do not know and cannot advise others.

When I told my grand mother that I was not going to just be a bored badly paid typist she thought I had delusions of grandeur and tried to shoot me down in flames. Yet if I had been a man she would hve expected me to end up running a business.

Up to you Julie. I am 57. To me if you are happy it comes from peace of mind and being happy in your surroundings and having no problems etc. I don't need to travel to a different country to get that. I am more in control here anyway. Here if a client needs my help I can help them straight away. I enjoy it and it pays thb bills so why not. I would be bored just laying around on a beach or walking around the shops all of the time. And being away from my four lovely little dogs would be like going away without my lovely children. Where do yhou live?

some great points there! its about choices and we have to make the choices that are right for us! and surround your self with professional people such as if ur looking for ways to be healthy ask somone who as experiences in that subject . im in manchester carmel england and your self? x

Essex Julie. By the sea. It is really nice. Manchester is a big place isnt it?

love to live by the sea . no wonder u dont need a holiday how beautifull i love the sea side :-) yes im near manchester city centre! yes its a big place

I would not say you need to surround yourself with professinal people. If you are bright and capable why would you need them at all? But avoid those who are incompetent, big headed, interfering, depressed, stupid etc at all costs. You can always consult a life coach if you want a professional person to help you. But one should be enough. And it is a lot more expensive than holidays.

I am in Essex by the sea, I love being here. But to me my location does not matter. All that matters is that I can do what I want when I want. I am not answerable to a boss or job or husband or family and do not let clients dictate to me either. This house could be on top of a mountain in China or Norway or Scotland it would make n o difference because it is the house, gardens, dogs and all of the things here that give me that pleasure. It is nice to go down to the sea sometiems but it is rare I bother.

LOL. I hardly ever go down there! The reason I dont need a holiday is because I love my work, I make sure I am in charge of it and only do a few hours a week, I dont have a husband etc to escape from etc. and I love my home, dogs and gardens and hobbies and would miss them too much.

A lot of people say wow arent you lucky you live by the sea. But luck does not come into it. I was able to move away from a horrible area because I worked and saved.

LOL i meant diet tips. i went to slimming world lost alot of weight and with out that support would be harder . the worlds full of people like that in your above post how do u avoid them lol my sister doesnt suffer with depression and intruced me to a man at the wrong time in my life i had been abused by a man and she thought me meeting this guy as he lived near me would help me..it didnt he was nuts! i mean nuts lol

have u ever suffered with depression carmel?

LOL. So you know not to listen to anything your sister says. WHY would anyone need diet tips? I am overweight but I eat very healthily and am graduallylosing weight. I dont need advice. It is common sense to eat less, eat healthier and exercise more. You can do it yourelf by writing in your diary or swapping notes with a friend who is doing something similar. Why waste money going to one of those places? And you have to look at why you are overweight too. If it is through comfort eating then you need to sort that out or nothing will work.

As for someone abusing us. Well the truth is that people can only abuse us if we let them. If we are strong and make the right choices we dont allow abusive people into our lives and we dont let them hurt us.

Yes. and it was awful and is all sorted now. I had no support or help from anyone and had to do it myself. Am not willing to go into details in a public forum though Julie.

i had a under active throid thats why i gained weight. i understand u cant allow people to abuse you , my drink was spiked so i had no control over the abuse

of course 

Hi Julie. Of course every situation is different. Am not saying it was your fault someone spiked your drink. But how you handlel the rest after is down to you. You can let it get to you or not. Other people have had things just as bad or worse happen. What about the people who were "arrested" and taken to concentration camps where they were beaten, starved, raped and forced to work long hours and live in horrid conditions for years? Some of them are depressed after and others are full of gratitude for having escaped and make the most of their lives.

hi carmel. what happened to them people was terrible god knows what it did to them as people . probley knocked every bit of fight left in them! they would of been deeply in depression while they were in them camps! when i went through what i did do last year my self worth was nil . ur full of self blame guilt .u feel dirty and its a hard thing to get through specialy when my family werent supportive. i seeked councilling and help from professionals in this kind of abuse and with that i have become a stronger person and getting my life back together! i hope he gets whats coming to him but in the same way he was a very sick man

Hi Julie. First of all dont take what a guy does to get sex personally. To a guy who is after sex you are just a piece of meat, an object. He could have gone to a masage parlour or brothel and paid and he would have had no feeling for those people. But he was arrogant and did not want to pay so he did this instead. It could have been a Susan or a Sheila or a Mary. No different to him. A blow up doll might have been an alternative.

Secondly, those people in the concentration camps were all different. The ones who were negative and bad copers would not have lasted long. They would have been dead well before the war ended or they were rescued. The positive ones who were logical thinkers are the ones who come out of it NOT being depressed and thanking their lucky stars.

i agree, the guy was suppose to be a friend he violated me as a friend then drugged me to get what he wanted as i didnt fancy him! so it was double vilation.. sick sick man. and hes probley out there still doing it but i saved 4 ladies from that monster! thank god he couldnt have full sex ! he had a massive problem down below lol ..its made me stronger! im a surviver! and the people in the camps who came out of it all are also survivers and u also sound like a survivor :-) lovely to meet you x

Lovely to meet you too Julie. But remember. You cannot change what happened to you. You can control how you react to it. If you keep thinking about it then he has won.

You are only a survivor when you are happy and carefree.

hi carmel. very true i never think about it , but sometimes talking about it helps! he wont win im a million times better person he could ever be! in the last year i have worked hard in healing arnt been easy but when i walk around i think im a surviour! there was times i wanted to hunt that man down and run him over lol but were would that of got me in prison lol hes not happy to after do things like that he did it with somone else before me i later found out! i reported it to the police that was as bad as what happened! but i did it so he couldnt do it again but probley is..i can actually talk about it and doesnt bother me..thats a surviour x

Fair enough. If wont go into details here Julie but worse things have happened to me and it would have finished many people off. But because I

am me I am happy despite it all and it does not make me angry or upset no matter what.

i have been also through alot more than this! long story but we survived! :-)

Well you are 50 and I am 57 so unless we had lived in a cave away from civilisation all our lives things will have happened. It is how we deal with it that counts. Be happy and enjoy the good things and ignore the bad things.

LOL and made us who we are :-) x

But that is my whole point Julie. Someone who needs transquillisers or anti depressants or sleeping pills etc has allowed it to spoil their lives. Never let bad things make you who you are and change you for the worst.

You should not need drugs or professionals to prop you up. That means you are not really surviving just existing. How would you cope without them and are you truly happy? Unlikely.

Surviving is not just about being alive after whatever it is about having true peace of mind and being happy despite it. Not thinking about it or getting angry or needing medication because of it.

hi carmel somethings a little help is all we need to see the the woods for the trees! im on ADs and not a a shamed of it! more people are on them that we can know . they say 1 in 3 people are on ADs and no one should be ashamed of it..if u have a head ache u take a pill . im on meds for an under active throid and will have to keep taking these ..thats life but we smile and get on with it and survive x

I know about anti depressants Julie. It is not 1 in 3 who are on them. You will find it is about one in three who has taken them at some time in their life, which is different.

Taking pills for a thyroid problem is different isnt it.

You need those. But people who take drugs or drink or tatake valiums or sleeping pills just to get by are not happy survivors.

i have been to groups and everyone at these groups are on ADs or sleeping tablets! i dont drink . maybe im weak then if im taking ADs . and one day i will be off them but till then i taking the little bit of help i need! ADs dont work unless you work with them

i will say im not weak far from it brought two sons up single handed and there a credit to me! i did a great job 

Did not want to upset you or worry you Julie. Of course a lot of people at these groups take things - they are the sort of people who need to lean on other people and things, that is why they are in the group in the first place.

It is a bit like saying a lot of people who go to pubs drink alcohol. You are not weak.

true put if i go pub which i dont. i would drink a coke :-) im joining some groups soon cant wait to be around people who understand. anxiety isnt nice :-( i lost my job well walked out as it was a awfull place to work for ! everyone was unhappy there and took it out on each other, plus went back to early after what happened to me . forced into it by staff then no support when i got there i went back 3 days after what happened! i worked hard to be cook and was getting better and better till they employed a lazy cook who wanted every thing her way and got it so left me on sink half the time which i hated and carried her. so been a tough year and need the support from the groups. there to help me build my conferdence back x

Well that is all up to you. There is no wrong or right to it so long as you are at peace and happy. I personally would not want to be with people who are depressed and anxious. It can become sort of self defeating where you just get it off of each other and talk about nothing else every time. And if they try to advise you how can they know when they are not sorted themselves?

You know when people have drug problems they are warned to stay away from others with drug problems because othewrise it becomes their life style. Likewise people who spend all of their time with lazy unemployed people usually end up unemployed and lazy. So please Julie dont let being anxious or depressed or talking to people about it be your lifestyle. Remember that you are also a mother, a lady, a person who can laugh and relax, a person who should be enjoying normal things in life such as a hobby. Not just an anxious or depressed person thinking about or talking about that.

hi carmel very good advise and i agree! being round depressed people doesnt help me! when i went to a depression group all they did was laugh but stopped going as felt it wasnt working for me there! but the groups im joining are for helping me build my conferdence up . well being courses such as healthy eating and how to manage money better and ill make friends there hopefully there possitive people . i know what u mean through i have been aware of the fact i do talk to depressed people on sites and try cheering them up. when i need cheering up x

Confidence building, how to take care of money and all that are great. But I would never sit in a group - not as a patient - with depressed or anxious people - they just make each other worse.

i know. wasnt like that at the depression group it was all laughter but i didnt like it didnt feel i got much out of it. i want to be more confident not sit in a room talking about depression and anxiety which they did do at times and i wanted to have a giggle and make friends

That is my point. If yhou are depressed and you make friends with depreSsed people they are no good for you. They make you more depressed or give you daft advice. How many of them work and have a happy life? Very few or none. They are needy people. Why not go to a normal club if you just want to giggle and make friends? Then you can mix with people who are not bogged down with worries or problems or lack of confidence etc

i dont work and dont have many friends as moved to a new area and after what happened and the lack of support off my family wasnt in a good place! plus work was a night mare and i burnt the candles at both ends. plus stood on my feet 10 /12 hours aday on a cold floor killed me and had no engry when got home! if u have any tips on good groups were people laugh and be them selfs id like to know. didnt encounter and daft advise at the depression group just wasnt for me 

Well the groups where you are will be different to the groups where I

am Julie. Must be lots of groups in Manchester. Do some research and try some out. But if you go there and talk about being anxious or depressed or having a sad past people will lose interest. They go there to relax and have a good time and make frends. They might be wanting to escape for a few hours from a gruelling full time job or a difficult husband and have their own things but they wont go on about them.

hi carmel what groups were u going to and what happened there? 

i understand that people dont want to talk about depression and anxiety . i like you and your advise x

Hi Julie. We are in very different situations. You have kids. I dont. I dont have any family. I am very fussy about who I am friends with and have just TWO friends in total.

I like my own company and am always pottering about or busy. I would rather read a book or be working than with boring people or doing pointless things.

I did try groups in the "hope" of maybe meeting someone who could become my third or fourth friend. T

part two - but the people at the clubs were either losers or very young mums or very old and wanting me to go and do their housework or help them with things or bore me with detials of their operations and medication. Staying at home and working was more fun and more point to it... and, of course, paid.

Thankfully I have met someone now who I like who I hope becomes a third friend. A very nice man. Will have to see how that goes Julie.

haha yes boring people many of them about :-) what groups did u go to? 

I tried all of the local groups Julie. I am 57. A l ot of the people at the groups were 80 plus. And their idea of friendship was me pushing them around in their wheelchair or hoovering their house.

hay a new man  were did u meet him? i wouldnt mind meeting a nice man been single along atime gets lonely. just jumping in the shower be right back 

no chance! your only young sod that lol

i joined a walking group all they did was moan about there health all alot older than me lol not for me lol

LOL. If I wanted to wheel old ladies around in wheelchairs or clean their houses Julie Id get a job as a paid cleaner or carer not do it for free. But why would I bother when I have plenty of things to do for myself like my own house and garden and running my business - which pays far better than cleaning or caring.

Exactly. And it was the same as painting, singing, card games and everything else. Many of them have large families who cannot be bothered to help them and they try to lastch on to me and expect me to become their CINDERELLA. Yet would not even phone or send you a christmas card otherwise.

lol i was a care worker for 13 years. draining work some were lovely through and each christmas they sent me cards and choc i was all they had bless them.. but no more done that wore the t-shirt. wish i had my own business 

If you want something make it happen. Wishes dont make things happen. You hae to save up money or learn things or pass exams or a mixture and there is alot of hard work. nd a lot of people with their own business earn less than those who have no responsbilities and work for someone else with holiday and sick pay. But my point is that I studied and passed exams and invested money so that I could have my own business. If I had wanted to go around to old ladies and cut their toe nails I would not have bothered.

eww cutting old ladies toe nails nooo! thats what my sister does for a living but its her own business! i wish i could save being on benefits isnt good. once i get my conferdence back ill be back at work! i am getting better and starting to trust people again been a tough road but im actually really looking forward to getting out there more. im a friendly caring lady not perfect who is? lol

It is very difficult to run a business of any sort, not sure it is for you. Am quite sure your sister would not go and cut those old ladies toe nails for free either. You can pay someone from age concern to go over and clean or do chores so when they ask me to do it they are just trying to save money.

no she wouldnt! lol my sister as a business mind not me! who asked you to clean old peoples houses you know what gets me some old people are bitter and think we owe them we dont some are lovely and i wouldnt have a problem helping them out for pay lol

My point is this. We all have choices when it comes to work. And I chose the hard one where I had to study and learn and pass exams. I also had to invest a lot of time and money. The idea being that I would be able to earn a good wage and do something interesting. Not make do or earn peanuts. So why would I then do boring jobs or work for nothing? As well as neglecting my own business and my own housework and gardening to do those things for the old ladies just so that they dont have to pay age concern or someone.

wonder what work i shall do ! if they paid me well id do there house work lol

LOL. Think the average cleaner gets £10 an hour.

i wish not here they dont. if they did id be there LOL

Isnt it better tahn sitting around bored and maybe having some money coming in is better than no money?

oh god cant wait till im back working

Great to look forward to it but more important to do what is needed to make it happen.

yes get my confidence back i was bullied in last job saying that all the girls were but i was a cook not a pot washer, that new cooks fault i did try to talk to manager but she said u have your hours, i worked had to be cook and took them out of a mess doing so also told i would get cooks rate after 3 months did i NO! so yes scares me a bit but ill do it, some were im not under so much stress 

Understand. Good luck with it.

thank you

ok

Hi Julie, some of your posts make me feel so sad inside. Do you really believe we owe our elderly nothing? I agree there are some elderly out there with attitudes and maybe bitter but that's mostly for good reason? They have lived a lot longer than you an I, been through wars, suffered rationings, went hungry to feed their children, used the bath as a washing machine or if wealthy something you probably haven't heard of "twin tub" used an old mangle to help dry clothes, woke up everymornig to make a coal fire so it would be warm for the children when they woke, and nappy changing was nothing like it is now my dear, kids of today couldn't handle it? They have there washing machines and driers, dish washers laptops oh and diapers which theyjust dump in with the trash etc etc. Believe me they have reasons to be bitter when they find themselves scared to leave their homes, see on television how some elderly are being treated, even some care homes arnt safe for them and you don't think they deserve your respect or help as you put it unless they pay you? That's so sad angel. We will all be old sooner or later if live long enough, I wonder if you will feel the same then? I doubt it angel, there is a word flying around out there called karma? You want to look it up hun, your life could be more rewarding, there's more to life than manicures and looking good.I wish you well in your lifes desires and hope all your dreams come true.

Very good point Carmel? The 2nd world war saw the worst of mankind and what cruelty one race can inflict on another? If it wasn't for our elderly the ones of us that would actually be here today would now be speaking German and life itself would be so different.

hi night owl 2 no of course i dont feel that way about the old im sorry it upset you . i worked with the old for 13 years some are lovely , i use to look after people who were in the 90s and a lady who was 103 lovely lady bless her she had a tough life. what u seen was a confo between me and carmel please read back to what she put also . i worked in care seen alot of abuse to the fact i have reported companies for the lack of care for the elderley. most elderley people have faught for us and have a lot of repect for them. im sorry if i upset you i didnt mean to . julie

Hi Night Owl. I agree with you about how a lot of old people have suffered terrible problems. But with many that was not bravery it was forced on them. I have personally met many old ladies who have been very demanding . I met one a few months ago - she is not a friend - she is just a lady I met ONCE - and she thinks she is entitled to ring me and DEMAND I rush around her place to do her housework or gardening or shopping or help her with this or that when she snaps her fingers. She has even admitted to me that she hates having to spend money on this and if I rushed around there whenever she wants it would save her a lot. A lot of people she has met wont talk to her now because she tried this with them. Because she is lonely I allow her to phone me for a chat sometimes but no way will I go there. Beca\use I know that to her it is just a way to get lots of chores and jobs done for free. Anyway she is far too old for me and we have nothing in common. But she always talks as if everyone on the planet should be at her beck and ca\ll. Recently a light bulb went in her bathroom and she was phoning her landlord at midnight expecting him to rush over at midnight to change it. She did manage to get a mug to go over and do things for her for free - and then she rang me to complain that after they had done THREE HOURS of unpaid work for her she had given them a cup of tea and a biscuit and they had not offered to pay for it!

Sadly I have met a lot of old ladies like this. They seem to assume that because I dont have a husband to take care or, or kids, that I should want to become their UNPAID carer or cleaner. And I am sure they would not expect a man to do that. They would understand he has his own chores to do and his own business to run. Some of these ladies re not used tgo a woman being a professional or business owner and dont understand or care that if I go around there to do things I am neglecting my own businesses and losing money and even if they paid me to do the cleaning or chores I would lose far more by not being here. In a way they are asking me to pay a lot of money for the privilege of diong their chores for them to save them money.

I help one old lady I know becauwe she never expects it or asks for it or sees it as some sort of God given right. And she does everything she can to help herself first and is not just asking me to do things so that she can save money for other things. I always find out with her that she has tried and tried and has not asked anyone for help and then I offer. When I know she is struggling with money I invite her over gor a good home cooked meal.

Good morning Julie. Hope you are ok today. Have just been shopping and must get down to work and seeing clients now.

morning have a good day

Hi Julie, awww, how nice are you, you never upset me hun, it just saddened me, I doubt very much that you could upset anyone purposefully. I did read some of the posts between you and Carmel but after a while I felt as though I was eavesdropping so stopped, Lol. You're a very nice lady and I,m glad you replied to my post, I draw strengh from peoples remarks be they good or bad, no harm in criticisms and they sometimes lead us to view our own faults, thank you hun, I meant no offence and your imput is appreciated?

you have no faults night owl 2. no ones perfect in this world if we was perfect we would be robots. so happy me and carmel didnt upset you i would never want to upset anyone . specialy somone so caring. its happened to me and its not nice! we are who we are worts and all x

No need to apologise Julie On forums there are always going to be one or two that get upset by someone now and then. That is how life is when you have a mixture of people. It does not mean they take it personally or that they think yu are nasty or did it on purpose. It just happens.

i hate upsetting people carmel , but what u said about people hiding behind peoples misfortunes because there depressed isnt the case hun .. we care for people thats how were made it doesnt mean were depressed. thank you for your kind words xx

Hi Julie. SOME people do hide behind peoples misfortunes because they are depressed, and for other reasons too, everyone is different, I was not attacking you or saying you. You can care without being like that. I care a lot.

ive allways cared for people its who i am and makes me happy to care for others because i understand as ive been there and have a lot to offer people i didnt think you was attacking me carmel i was putting a point across but you do have to be carefull who u care for because some take advantage of our good hearts! but at lease we can sleep at night :-) 

Totally agree.

There you go again Julie you've made me smile yet again, it amazes me, I never quite understood the saying "the pen is mightier than the sword" until only afew years back and if any of the old sayings are true none are truer than that? The power of the pen can mend or break your heart, it can make people happy (like you just have) or make them sad  it can unite the masses or divide continents, just then in in reading what you wrote you've put a smile on my face where a moment b4 was a frown? Thanks hun.