Help!

Before me he was married for 10 years and went through a lot of family stress and he had friendships that let him down... because he got good at hiding his drinking from his wife it continued with me and I never really caught on until I moved in with him... he got really bad with basically a bottle of whiskey a night (mixing with water and not much he water) I fell pregnant and I told him enough so he stopped whiskey and went to vodka and for the last two years he just kept telling me he is trying and that it will be better etc and throwing all these excuses and I'm just so tired

I have told him all he needs to do is cut back, I don't expect him to stop drinking unlike his ex wife...she use to always hound him that's why he started hiding it and that became a habit he doesn't hide it with me. He thinks he does better when he doesn't have a whole bottle of vodka but maybe half and a bottle of port because the port is lesser percentage but I just can't get through to him. He said he just keeps saying 'oh well one more won't hurt' and he has tried some of my alcohol removed beverages (I don't drink alcohol as I am still feeding our little girl) and he has liked them but they don't give them that 'feeling' he needs. I know he is starting to get back headaches and sore stomachs and his bowels also play up most days but he blames coffee or being dehydrated or not eating enough but if he is drinking almost a 1L bottle of vodka every night it has to be that

Hi there, yes he has been for many years I just never knew it because at the start he was always hiding it or of habit and he just kept saying he was going to sort it and now 2 1/2 years later we still go over it and over it and I am lost. He functions very well... runs his own business, doesn't drink in the morning but as soon as he starts he can't stop until he goes to bed.. I can count on my two hands (easily) the days he has had nothing in 2 1/2 years and they were bad nights...I have read a lot about high functioning Alcoholics and it amazes me how he does it

Yes I was always amazed how my husband managed to go to work looking like death warmed over.

Small changes and a positve attitude is the only way to tackle this, I personally have found. What you must understand is that his brain has been altered and whatever problems he has had in the past has now been taken over by alcohol. You are now trying to undo years of misuse, but it is not insurmountable.

A very good book I have found Beyond Addiction is a good start. It is aimed at the American market but dont be put off by that.

Continue to support him. Try and get him to realise that people do die from this disease but tell him in a kind but firm way. He has got a baby now, his baby will need him.

My husband thought he was indestructible, drank heavily for many years. It began to affect his brain which he needs for his job as an IT consultant.

He was very secretive hid everything from me. It was only when I started to use a different approach that small changes began to happen.

Keep in touch. It is a long journey but you will get there. We are still on ours, but it is much improved x

Thank you so much for your kind words and help. I will search for the book online and I will remember that I'm dealing with the alcohol him not the real him. I definitely have been very gentle but firm with him

Well done you. I wasn't always kind to my hubby, but it just dawned on me one day, that I wasn't getting anywhere.

When he has bad nights from stopping alcohol can you ask him what he experienced? Did he have halucinations, sweating, trembling? Got this good advice from my GP -that is someone you can go to for advice.

I never found alanon family groups much use to be honest, they always told me he had to reach rock bottom which I think is idiotic as this could mean death

Keep in touchx

He just couldn't sleep tossing, turning, sweating, nausea, just could not switch off and yeah I went to Alanon but being in such a small town the meeting times were always in work times and with my job I can't really book appointment times for things as easy as other people can as I look after children from home. But from reading up I have done everything I can except this withdrawing from him. This is the first night I have told him we will be in seperate rooms and twice already he has gotten up to have a drink. He said well he may as well drink since he can't come to be I feel like he is doing it to get at me.

Hi Cat it may seem that he is doing it to get at you, but to me that action comes across as bravado to hide his guilt and he is probably secretly ashamed. By blaming you, he doesnt have to face his responsibilities. I have experienced this with my hubby because at that time he did not want to stop drinking.

Its very hard but try not to overereact to that. Your hormones are going to be all over the place too having just had a baby.

It obviously doesn't help that his family appear to be clueless. Its very dangerous to just stop. If you have been doing some research you will know that. You seem like a clued up girl to me x

Unfortunately, the only thing that made my husband realise that he was putting himself in real danger was when he tried to come down too quickly and he had a seizure and was hospitalized. The consultant then told him that he would not survive many more of those.

I would not like to see you or your partner go thru that kind of hell. The book will help but he does need to realise what damage alcohol can do, it can damage every organ in his body including his brain. He will need his brain for his job.

Try and get to see your gp, they can explain it better than I can. I do know that the brain can suffer if it does not get thiamine b1 supplements as the alcohol does something to the brain.

I work with people who have dementia 3 of them have Wernicke's korsakoff dementia and they are only in their 60's I believe that can be caused by a lack of thiamine please research that too, just to make sure I am right-unless you know more RHGB?

Hope all this helps. Thinking of you. I am here as is everyone on this site. We are all with you xx

Cat, you're dealing with a medical problem that has changed his brain. If he's interested in turning this around, I would suggest you show him info about The Sinclair Method. It's what turned around my 30+ year daily drinking addiction. He doesn't have to quit drinking to start it and it will decrease his urge to drink, month by month. It blocks the reinforcement that alcohol causes in the unconscious/subconscious part of the brain and the compulsion to drink will begin to fade, bit by bit. 

As he's so deep into it, I suggest that he work with a doctor on this. Here's a link to a description of The Sinclair Method, I'll PM you some links to more info. If he wants to do this, there's a 78% chance that this will be the last year that he's run around by the bottle. After drinking for every night for over 30 years, a six-pack of beer now lasts me over a month. The compulsion to drink is gone and I'm no longer controlled by alcohol. 

Have a look at this and check your private messages for additional info:

https://patient.info/health/sinclair-method-for-alcohol-use-disorder

Hi Adefree doesnt his liver have to be in a reasonable state b4 he can start taking Nalt/Nalf ? Also, Cat's partner is in denial, I would argue that he needs to admit he has a problem first before he is likely to want to look at what's out there.

I do fully believe in TSM but he has to want to do it ? I have pushed different things at my hubby who has AUD but nothing worked when he was in denial x

"I work with people who have dementia 3 of them have Wernicke's korsakoff dementia and they are only in their 60's I believe that can be caused by a lack of thiamine please research that too, just to make sure I am right-unless you know more RHGB?"

Oh, you have, Wernicke's encephalopathy, Korsakoff's syndrome and then Wernicke–Korsakoff syndrome (WKS).

They can range from slight forgetfullness to full blown madness. At my time in hospital, I saw/heard the latter and I can still remember her name to this day. I didn't know what it was at the time, I just thought she was raving mad and couldn't understand why they didn't put her in a mental ward - at the time, the hospital did have mental wards. I have since found out that the mental wards do not have facilities to deal with the physically sick.

Yes, thiamine is the defacto vitamin to take. The problem for a lot of heavy drinkers is that they don't eat properly as they get their calories from alcohol. Plus alcohol flushes vitamins out of the system.

Most people can cope with heavy alcohol abuse for years, then it catches up with them. Sometimes they get away with it, sometimes the damage is done.

It depends on the person, JulieAnne. He should see a doc that's well versed in The Sinclair Method and other types of Medically Assisted Treatment. If his liver isn't too far out of whack, the doctor may figure that the Naltrexone would do far, far less harm than the alcohol. At the dosage used for TSM, the Naltrexone itself likely wouldn't exacerbate liver problems anyway. In studies, it took over 6 times the TSM dose to increase liver enzymes. 

Even if in denial, TSM may lower the bar enough that he would be willing to make a change. In reviewing the material, Cat may begin to understand that this is a medical condition in which the brain has been hijacked, not an obstinate choice on the part of her partner. 

Nalt needs a liver test and nalf doesn't.

It depends whether they are metabolised and how they are excreted. Campral (not metabloised) goes via the kidneys, not the liver, for example.

I'd listen to what JA is telling you, she has gone through the same and to me, has handled it the best way possible. It doesn't always work, but it is the first thing I would try.

I also agree, AA, Alnon and other groups, don't seem to operate in the real world. I would/did definitely eschew them. The problem is that they have a one size fits all policy and very few people that have real experience.

As has been said, alcohol has affected your partner's brain, to such a situation that it cannot function properly without alcohol anymore. The enjoyment has gone and been replaced by necessity. With the amount he drinks, they only real way to stop/calm down is with medication.

And it is does work. I realise you are probably gettin too much feedback for one day, perhaps tomorrow, options can be discussed, how to go about getting it and how to broach the subject with your partner.

Please don't think he doesn't care, please don't think he doesn't hate himself for what he is doing, he just can't see a way out of his problem at the moment.

Hi Adefree if he is in denial how can she persuade him to see a gp? My husband absolutely refused. I am not saying Cat should not try because we are all different, but from what I can gather from her posts is that he is very defensive.

Hopefully Cat will read all of our posts which will enable her to make an informed decision. The more information she has the better I think. I certainly do want Cat to know about TSM. Cat will know how receptive her partner might be.

Unfortunately, tho it has to be said that we have yet to find a gp who is willing to prescribe Nalfemene or Naltrexone. My husband was referred to the local ARC and they can be soul destroying places

Kind Regards

JulieAnne

Have you talked to Joanna? I think she knows of some private clinics, should it come down to that. 

I figure if Cat shows her partner the videos, it may sway him. Worth a try in any case and it might give her a different perspective on the problem to understand the nature of the condition herself.

RHGB well said as always. Poor Cat will have information overload.

Just keep calm Cat, do your research keep your family together, it is worth it in the end.

By moving to the spare room you are sending him a strong message. Keep talking to him. Tell him the truth you are not trying to punish him but you need your sleep. Dont give in to his emotional blackmail. I know what it is like trying to sleep next to someone who has been drinking vodka, it absolutely reeks. My husband said he used to drink it because there was no smell, really?!

Anyway I have dribbled on enuff. Hope to speak to you again soon x

Hi Adefree yes I have talked to Joanna. I don't remember her saying anything about private clinics, just that you could buy Nalfamene from a uk pharmacy. Perhaps things have changed since I last spoke with her.

For my own situation, things have taken a different direction. He was recently medically detoxed and is currently taking Campral, (a fight to get that) He has said he wants to stick with that. If it was my decision, he would be starting Naltrexone tomorrow! But it isn't. I can't make that decision for him he has got to want to do it. It is frustrating for me, but I must continue to support him even when things may go wrong. Only then will he look at alternatives x

He may well do just fine with Campral, but at least you know there's a "Plan B" if it comes to it. 

I believe there was a clinic in Scotland, one in London and yet another. Naltrexone is also available OTC in at least France and Spain, from what I gather, so maybe a little holiday to see a physician over there if needs be, just to get the paperwork. Otherwise so far so good with the Campral!

Thanks adefree. I have got a supply of Naltrexone in from an overseas pharmacy but it was very expensive, if he ever does start using it, we will need a supply which is more accessible and quite frankly cheaper!

Keeping an eye on things surreptitiously lol as always x

Yes that is where I am at a loss. I went to alanon and they basically said I have tried everything over the last year and a half that they can recommend. Now it is up to him to want to change. So far the sleeping in different rooms plan has only meant he thinks he can get up when he wants to to have more drink

Thank you for all the info ADEfree.. there are certainly a lot of helpful people on here

Oh and yes I always thought vodka never smelled but when it is coming out of his pores and he hasn't brushed his teeth because he has been to drunk to he stinks

Hi Cat

glad you have got back to me, I have been thinking about you x I have always tried to point out to my other half that if I can smell it, others must be able to.

Unlike your partner my hubby has lost many jobs. So humiliating for him, because his colleagues had worked out what was wrong with him, too.

Hi Cat. He is physically addicted and is probably drinking more because of the situation he now finds himself in, he doesn't know how to do anything else. I take it you have asked him what his plans are now things have changed?

Yes he just said (as usual) that he will work on cutting back and start later in the day but I have unfortunately heard this many times before

Yeah same thing I used to hear. I did ask him what his long term plans were. He would never answer that one, because he knew he would never be able to drink 'normally' again. That is, have one or two drinks and then leave it. He did admit this to me after his seizure.

Is your partner aware of the probability of this I wonder?

I study Counselling and Psychology myself and have read a lot about it so I have a good understanding of what is happening and that it is dangerous to just stop. I have been to my gp to have a chat it's just that he won't go to his. The Seizure part was actually new information to me as well as the dementia so I have some reading to do. I have been noticing that he has been forgetting a lot of things but I just put it down to him being drunk and not remembering

Thank you so much I will have a read through

So, how is you mentioning medication, that will help reduce the drinking, going to go down with him? Or is tha a complete non starter?

As has been mentioned previously about memory, buy some thiamine, available from the High St., such as H&B. Stick it in his food or his tea if he won't have it.

I honestly think he would be up for a medication. He only reason I think he doesn't want to go and talk to someone is being he is worried in a small town if information if leaked it might affect his business. But also for the fact that he probably doesn't want to admit it to someone else I guess aswell. If it were a medication then he could just do that discreetly. I just never knew there were some. The hard part would be getting him to the gp to get the medication prescription

Seriously, the only way for someone with his consumption level, is medication.

Most here, will say that they used medication, I certainly did.

I don't know (and I'm not asking) your financial circumstances, but you can get a prescription through a private doctor/online prescription, but that is more money than on the NHS. But then nobody knows, including your GP.

I used Campral, but that is not for him. Either nalmefene or naltrexone (kind of the same thing) would be best for him. If you're willing to talk to him and get him interested, there is a lady on here who is very knowledgeable about the medication and how best to get it.

But seriously, the alcohol has changed his brain and the medication helps to change it back and also cut down on the constant need for it. It won't mean he can't have it, just some normality will return to his life.

Thank you, I will certainly have a read up and then have a chat with him. It sounds silly to ask...and anyone can answer this...but considering he has been a heavy drinker for years and the amount he is drinking is there anyway that it won't make him extremely sick one day? You do sometimes hear about people that drink or smoke all there life and get off pretty lucky. But I'm not sure about his amount

You won't know until he has a health check.

In answer to your question, the amount he is drinking now will be damaging his health.

The sooner he stops/cuts right down, the better his chances are. Believe me, I am talking from personal experience.

So really my hardest struggle is just getting him to go to the gp

There are also some private physicians that know of this, so if he wants to keep it off the record, it can be done. Check out the video link that I sent you and show it to him too. It's about the easiest way I can think of to overcome Alcohol Use Disorder, aside from those that can "just quit", which simply doesn't work out for the vast majority of drinkers.

Hi Cat yep hubby has noticed that his short term memory has definately been affected.

Every time he picks up now, he cannot stop without a medical detox. His liver is always inflamed. This time his platelets were affected, connected to another worrying aspect, scarring-fibrosis of the liver and could over time lead to cirrhosis. (I am sure you will correct me there RH if I am wrong)

There is so much scary stuff about AUD out there Cat, learn all you can x

PS you dont say how old or how long your partner has been drinking

Thinking of everyone out there as always

JulieAnne

I will learn as much as I can. He is 36 years old and he has drunken spirits heavily since he was around 22ish

"This time his platelets were affected, connected to another worrying aspect, scarring-fibrosis of the liver and could over time lead to cirrhosis. (I am sure you will correct me there RH if I am wrong)"

Yes, fibrosis is the stage between fatty liver and cirrhosis and is not reversible. If not allowed to develop any further, it will not cause major health problems.

When a liver is damaged or under stress, it struggles to produce the protein that helps clotting. This leads to a lower platelet count and the body's ability to clot when necessary.

Vitamin K, B12 and B9 folic acid, all help combat low platelet levels.

Thanks once again RH. He hasn't gone for a liver scan yet, they are waiting to see uf things settle down in a couple of months time. There must be scarring tho because the liver has been inflamed a few times.

Kind Regards

JulieAnne

Hi Cat that is a long time to be drinking spirits heavily. There are a lot of good people on here who are following The Sinclair Method using Nalfamene or Naltrexone in fact I would like my Husband to be taking it, but I have been unable to persuade him so far. I don't think he us in the right place, physically he is but not mentally.

You do have to be compliant taking Nalt/Nalf butyou know your partner and what he will be receptive to. Has he actually said he wants to cut down? As far as I am aware using those drugs is only way to reverse the excessive drinking.

Anyway more research for you!

I'm hoping Joanne will give you further info. Your partner might be able to see a private practitioner as ADE has suggested, but of course it will be down to him. It is hard to make your loved one see that they are not indestructable x

Good luck keep in touch

I played him the clip about he Sinclair method and he was silent for ages...I didn't say anything just waited and he said 'wow, something like that would be a good thing to try, I would definitely talk to a gp about that if I found that I couldn't nip this in the butt myself."

We have done better the last two nights since he went to another room. He has had slightly less than half a bottle and over a longer period of time without a string drink before bed and no getting up in the night for one so will see what happens

Hi Cat. Sounds just like my husband it gave him hope.The problem is your gp might refer you to your local Alchol Recovery Centre -ARC that can be a less than uplifting experience shall we say 😞 but on the other hand your gp may have heard of nalfamene. So, there is more research I'm afraid. Go to C3europe foundation website there is a list on there of gps who can prescribe Nalfamene-tends to be Nalfamene here in uk and Naltrexone in the states. Have a good navigation around the site. So glad he is interested x

You are doing well this early in the game I feel x

I generally find that the carrot works better than the stick. As I think I said earlier in the thread, no one wants to be dependent on alcohol, they just can't see a way out.

People want their life back, and I believe that this forum offers some of the best advice available for people. It is a crying shame that the NHS is not providing this service.

I absolutely agree with you. I have learnt more on here in 2 days than I did in three alanon meetings

You want to push for the scan, don't let it slip. I hope it is an ultrasound, not a CT or MRI scan, as the radiologist can really have a good look at all the internal organs, such as the kidneys, gallbladder etc.

Thanks RH. Got to persuade other half to have the scan as sometime he does suffer from 'head in the sand' mode. I believe he needs to know what is actually happening. When he gets the all clear from his bloods, it doesn't mean that there hasn't been any damage does it?

Just got to find a way to put this across. Hope you are ok x

I do not wish to worry you, but no, blood tests only give an indication and sometimes mean that further investigation is required. They do not indicate that every thing is okay, despite what many a GP will tell you.

I have first stage cirrhosis (there are three stages). I have complete blood tests (about two dozen types, about nine phials of blood) every year. Because I rarely drink now, these come back all within range. So if a GP was to be handed my results without any further information, they would say that they look fine.

The only way to tell, is an ultrasound, exactly the same thing as they give pregnant women. This shows up exactly the state of the liver, kidneys, gallbladder etc. It is about a 15 minute procedure and my advice is to ask the radiologist then and there, what they have found. If you can get the radiologist to talk, they will often tell you far more than the Gastroenterologist or your GP will at a later date.

Thank you RH for your thorough reply. I will show this to hubby.

Totally agree with you there as that's what I do on any scan or X-ray. Some won't discuss it and say "I can't discuss it or tell you anything, you'll have to see your go"

I find the male  radiologists far more chatty and much more obliging and will tell you more than the consultant or your GP

Yes, whilst I was being scanned I asked the guy what he saw and he told me - no sugar coating neither but not as frightening as I envisaged.

G.