Hormone I've been taking for years

Listen if it were up to the EU, they sould shut down so much of the US supplements....I recall probably 20 yrs ago the first coop health food/supplement store had yellow banners on empty shelves of supplements..... The fight I'm sure isn't dead.

Things seem to be quiet now as the supplement world is so big and strong but things can change.....bonkers yes, some governments worse than others....there is a lot about the U.S. govt I'm not proud of.

But big pharma can continue to bring on those toxic drugs full of possible side effects and that is all ok....all that govt control.

Reminds me I outta stock up on DHEA....

You don't mean progesterone cream? I've taken Preg caps too at one point...doc had me taking both.

My reply got censored... I mentioned the co. I use in Monrovia, ca.  Yes the pump. And yes, I wd stock up. You don't know when something's gonna get discontinued.   Maybe you could supply us Brits and make a profit. Why not!

Hi Joy, your on a lotta stuff that is metabolized by you fegato/higado..or LIVER....since your gonna do blood work soon...please check the liver enzymes if if....you don't do the TSH.

Noticed our Mayo suggested that if the CYP219 gene was mutated...dhea may inhibit stuff???whatta stretch.they used the Cytochrome P450  as cover?....big pharma has its reach into everything including my pomegranate juice...It rang a bell....checked my study notes on PPI's.....".PPI’s/Alginates

''PPIs are pro-drugs. They require gastric acid secretion to be converted to the active sulfenamide or sulfenic acid that blocks gastric acid secretion.

All PPIs except tenatoprazole have short half-lives (about 1 hour) and all have good oral bioavailability. Most PPIs are metabolized by  the

CYP2C19 gene,

and 3A4.(  an important enzyme in the body, mainly found in the liver and in the intestine. Its purpose is to oxidize small foreign organic molecules (xenobiotics), such as toxins or drugs, so that they can be removed from the body""..

keep hydrated ....keep in touch......Claudio

My experiences are  with both "govt customs", they block many  imports...some use "agriculture reg's...and other non related regs merely to block the importation...On Line pharmacies in the UK refuse to ship to the US becuse of our FDA. I would think you might be able to obtain DHEA from other EU countries...... too? but I fear quality/safety etc.  and for what its worth...I've seen several posts illustrating source of purchase .price etc..and Joy is absolutely on target.. I can purchase from "on line" Canadian Pharmacies.......prescription drugs.....Claudio

True, I haven't tried to source from any EU country as assume the ban originates exactly from Strasbourg coinciding with the uk banning certain herbs over our own counter as it were... I have found the US light years ahead of us so why they wd want anything from the UK that they could not source themselves wd be surprising.   Weird that it's easier to buy prescription drugs than herbals on line.   Next they'll get their claws into good old hydrogen peroxide which I keep in an aerosol at all times (dilute, bien sur) along with Mastic powder entre autres.....

I think big pharma has some influence. I chose to test the purchase of a

Glaucoma med and received "we do not ship to the US per FDA regs"even if prescription from reg EU Dr.

That might be the good reason..the actual could be "complaints of not

Receiving purchases plus the problems associated with credit card

disputes".(product not clearing US Customs ) . Agree those with even

a tad of power do their best picking fly droppings from pepper ..claudio

• Do not use if you suffer from seizure disorders, as pregnenolone can suppress GABA activity, resulting in an increase in central nervous system activity which may lead to seizures in those with epilepsy.

Hi The above was a warning from Boveia site in Australia on pregnenolone - other than that it suggests that you definitely don't take  pregnenolone if you are taking DHEA and no we can't get it on our site in Australia either.  I have some and probably got it from our health food store a couple of years ago then read the warnings and only take it occasionally.

Interesting re hair loss.  Post viral fatigue got me onto those supps too. Have you been advised to take glycyrrhiza (liquorice tincture) for adrenal support? It can be v dramatic.   You have added weight to my quest for sourcing DHEA .... Shd have stocked up foreseeing all good things come to an end. I wd gladly send some dollars to anyone who could mail me some! Omg the subterfuge to which we are driven

You can buy DHEA supps in the UK from Biovea. So what have been the benefits from those taking dhea ?

Many thanks for the Biovea info.... Am onto it.

Personally, it gives energy principally and maybe some improvement in skin. I wdnt take it permanently but take it for alternate months, say. Has it helped with yr chronic fatigue syndrome?

sarah

Hi Sarah,

There are studies stating supplementing with DHEA improves CFS on many areas, a simple search will bring it up. I've not used it yet but since Biovea were doing buy one get one 50% off i bought two bottles of the 10mg dose. So it's something i will be sure to try at some stage. I've been doing lots of herbals lately and am curious to see if they have helped balance out my adrenals. I shall compare my old adrenal test with the new one, 3 month gap.

The benefits to me are more energy, no fatigue to speak of, pain keeps one fatigued and I deal with OA and FM and hip replacement mess pain, but overall I have some good energy for 76...AND it does enhance libido, no partner but myself....so all is good in that department....pretty amazing.

Google: Benefits of DHEA, it's a precursor to testostrone too....I get a few little hairs on my chin but pluck them out.

My voice is strong but not deep like a man, but a strong voice in general....could be the grape seed helping too with circulation bodywide.

Start low 10mg and go from there....as info says we decline with DHEA at 20 or 30...

Hi Joy, thanks. How long before you noticed benefits ?

Could really use a boost, but also need to have more uninterrupted sleep.

I got the 10mg today.

I used MOST of the adaptagens for adrenals and need to get a new supply of a food based product Drenamin I've used it in the past but am out of it and have to buy again. My friend who deals with ME uses this product thru here chiro's office...we both muscle test.

David, it's been such a long time ago when I started on DHEA, I don't remember how long it took....I just know I wouldn't be without it....can you get a blood test done on DHEA. look for a PM from me.

Hi David,

I am super curious and would very much apprecaite  some data...can I presume you developed CFS post a viral infection? If so, was the virus Identified? and lastly...what if any meds were taken for it?  gracias...Claudio

Hi Claudio,

No virus has been identified. I can only think back to Nov through to Feburary and how shockingly bad i felt. I was exposed to something.

The docs at the time labelled me post viral, but as time went on and i really had minimal improvement i am now CFS. I've taken no meds and only been offered anti-depressants and sleep aids. Which i refused. I've lost my job and am largely now housebound at 34. Social life is non existent.

From my adrenal stress test in July my mean DHEA was 0.37. Normal begins at 0.40. It's interesting when i went to the TCM clinic they said my internal organs had aged. And DHEA is a marker for aging, so i perhaps i have, internally aged more rapidly than what would normally occur. Christ i do feel like about 80. I feel i am in a big hole and getting out is going to be tough !

The folks in the U.S. who are challenged with CFS and ME often have discussed the protocol of the "famous" MD in the UK...I don't think I can mention her name here.....we have two major groups over here who talk CFS ME non stop. Many theories but no "cures"....just management....

oh gracious my 2012 dhea test came in at 1890 on a lab range of 350-4300..

That 10mg won't do much, maybe take 50mg and alternate days.

Wow not good news..so discouraging...hope the DHEA will give you a lift. ....some specific viruse's "can" (not will)...cause dna mutations.  reason for my query re "ID"...My CFS studies go back to sometine in the mid 2000...so am not up to speed....back then drugs failed miserably...1 study each of simple NAC or Inosine showed promise..I don't know if there has been futher studies. Both are prime candidates in ALS sub types...not necessarily in tandem but could be?. I think..just maybe the Inosine with good intestial flora can boost...reboot the immune system..am aware of only one subjective case postive outcome. A mensa type Brit in Au found his female friend ready to meet her ancestors...She had been on an antibiotic "minocycline" (been too long to be absolute)...his reports of recovery  indicated the Inosine was the big player, as it either re booted or supercharged her immune system. You've been wise not to take either the anti depressants or sleep aids...have too many records of these causing more trouble than what they were supposed to treat...and my youngest daughter holds a PHD in Psychiartry..Check out the  two if you haven't done so already. wish you well..and soon...Claudio

Not sure we are comparing the same thing, or labs using same parameters ?  i've read about DHEA-S but am unsure about this in comparison with DHEA. The normal levels on the test i did were 0.40-1.37.

Thanks Claudio. Been working on the gut many months and will continue to. Inosine looks interesting. I'm extra exhausted tonight and fear for my future in all honesty.

Don't despair David...once again last night got an e mail from my son in law  (40) who is a bio engineer in the Pacific Northwest that his sad transplanted kidney has increased function...its a 17 year old transplant..and you know he is on big time anti reject meds...thus....uremia...but even with the upbeat news he is reluctant to increase his protein for fear it might cause trouble...several months ago he was on the "urgent" transplant list....no longer. (I told him his replacement was a liver pretending to be a kidney)..his nephro's scratching their noggins....

When your "up to it" PM re what your doing re your digestive system..when started and if your doing a diary, am much more up to speed in this area......Claudio

O I feel for you and want to give you hope.  I contracted shingles then probably meningitis with chicken pox and was in bed a year . Drenching night sweats, sleeping 17 hrs a day. 18 months later anaemic. It us now 16 years on and life had to change. Early nights, not too much exercise etc. I have had many many relapses mostly due to stress. At the time I cried whenever enough energy but slowly slowly recovered over about 2 years. Got info from an eminent doctor and wrote an article.  One thing he got me on was l-lysine which the EBV virus does not like.  You must yield to it and sleep all you need. I know that sleep doesn't come easy and it's usually non restorative . Amitriptyline does work at 10mg at night..  I thought I would die as got no explanation and young male dr barely outta short trs knew nothing cos my mono test came back negative. Have you had that? (Glandular fever).  You must get on a help site for fellow sufferers as it is very isolating and not all friends will be supportive as people equate symptoms with malingering. I lost all muscle after a lifetime of athleticism and horses. When stretching myself I would fall, ashen faced. Everyone who relates to this will have tried all they can from alternative medicine. I have masses of print outs of all my research. Use yr time to inform yourself. You will pick up nuggets of info and educate yrself. At least you have the name CFS. You can make up on social life later. You must live with hope. It will get better, guaranteed. Do not over exert. The liquorice tincture supports adrenals ... I note what Claudio said about virus and DNA. I used to say, "it's gotten into my very DNA".  Flat battery, no fuel, no engine.  Please join all those support sites. Are family supportive, former colleagues...   DHEA was one of the first supps I took.   Incidentally, can you help me get some, Biovea site jams when I order DHEA. It may have caught them up too.  You poor thing.  There should be more treatment, research and support for  post viral. It is crippling and depressing. You feel so alone. But you are not. Chat to the Samaritans. They were very knowledgeable and nowadays aren't confined to drink n drugs...

Joy you have stimulated the phagocytes on this one (an old saying from an eminent clergyman I once knew....not in the biblical sense btw). It's from George Bernard Shaw! Meanwhile I cannot buy DHEA from the site offered. I guess they've been rumbled too.... S

Reading your post and can relate.  Though abreviations are sometimes confusing me.  EBV virus does not like lycene.  Would you explain?

CFS?  

Epstein Barr Virus is implicated in CFS sometimes.  The virus is stimulated by L-arginine apparently. Curiously I cannot touch red wine ...v high in arginine, as are cheese, nuts, chocolate. L-lysine  acts as kind of antidote to arginine and I avoid high arginine foods and take lysine in powder form when I feel a low phase coming on, or worse, a relapse. They are only amino acids naturally occurring.

I read about allergy and CFS recently. But moulds make sense, all those fermented foods can trigger things in many of us. The other thing I avoid is MSG (mono sodium glutamate) that grounds me for 48 hrs min with a mother of all headaches.

Thanks Gentille, helpful.  I take lysene all the time, don't know whether that is good or not.  Had the Shingles twice, for instance.  Adrenal problems and thus weak immune system.  Joked at one time that I had a better assortment of pyjama's than other clothing.  (one needs a sense of humor)  

Would you explain the abreviation CFS for me?

When I started on this Fibro journey in 1999, an MD tested EBV and my numbers were apparent and I had ALMOST considered a drug anti viral and due to the high cost, did NOT...glad I didn't and found Olive Leaf Extract has helped me and I've been taking 500mg daily for a lot of years. OLF for short.

One doc reminded me that MANY people walk around with EBV and don't know it.I have NOT tested EBV in many years now, I feel OK for the most part.

I stopped all alcohol about 5 yrs ago, just lost my desire and taste for it. Yea!!!

Chronic fatigue syndrome aka post viral syndrome.  Have you tried liquorice tincture for adrenals and sublingual vitamin D for immune boost. PJs, Me too but call mine "loungewear". Lysine may have issues with cholesterol I read somewhere.

I just had to order from the Slovenia site of Biovea to get the DHEA. Hope not stopped at customs

OLE for Olive Leaf Extract.

Thanks joy. Yep the EBV lies dormant I understand but can be re activated, hence my care with l-arginine. Bloods just show up the antibodies. Did not know that olive leaf extract was effective per se, but it was mentioned by that MD who helped me with post viral generally. Alcohol is a bitch and so much sugar too but I didn't lose my taste for wine regrettably. Cheers I will be getting the ole olive. Sarah

I drink a lot of liquorice tea.  And add vitamin D as well.  Thanks for explaning CFS There are so many abreviations, hard to keep track of all.

In what way does Lysine have issues with cholesterol, do you know?

Thanks, i will give l-lysine a try. I was tested for glandular fever and it was negative. EVERYTHING has pretty much been negative except borderline normal neutrophils and platelets and total WBC. Althoughi had my bloods taken in 2007 according to the doc and the levels were the same. So it's possible the virus has actually damaged my DNA, or is it RNA replication process in some way. I'm just sick of it, i had a horrific night in bed, literally i think this muct be the closest you can get to dying without actually dying.

That's why there is so little support, all testing reveals nothing. At my worst I too thought it could not get worse, I called a hospice one morning seeing my body wasting.  And going downstairs on backside, crawling up on all fours, sweating with exhaustion. But, what I gave in to was taking the amitriptyline in order to get some restful sleep. it may be that at the beginning of recovery you get ever more restless waking up more tired than when you went to sleep. Amitriptyline at 10mg us not antidepressant dose of 75mg.  other herbs I recall were skullcap, eschscholzia (Californian poppy) and NADH at that time. But honestly, wait and see is the only reality. I used to think it would be better tomorrow, and tomorrow and tomorrow. You must try and keep calm as stress will set you back and there are intractable cases but if your symptoms began last Nov then it has not yet been a year. Recovery is very gradual ... Did you get ESR and haemoglobin as anaemia may account for much of the malaise. Another thing to look up is H2o2 therapy. Simply, hydrogen peroxide.  I've  used it in aerosol into the ear canal. And gargling. But there are more radical ways.... Think back to when you got ill. I was around teenagers under covered equestrian centre in Nov also;  teens can recover without a blink but can carry pathogens more catastrophic for adults. I actually carry an aerosol of h202 and use it. Esp when people are coughing and sneezing and on aeroplanes.  See food grade h202 35% on ebay. COntroversial, but then so is the way post viral fatigue is dismissed so easily. And you need someone to call daily. Crois-moi the Samaritans works. They have the time to listen and can often give valuable advice. Don't suffer alone. Low morale will set you back. St. John's wort could be good and it's anti viral.  Even conventional medics acknowledge that one.  Thinking of you. Write any time. Sarah

Hi Sarah, the worst part of all this for me is not actually knowing that is wrong with me, only my body telling me i am very ill. My ES was normal and i had high iron levels. I got tested for haemochromotosis but that was negatie also. I may have to get more radical with regards to sleep. A shcoking night last night.

If you get 10mg amitriptyline, it is v low dose, they give 25mg for back pain.  Take one at around 6.30-7pm. If you haven't drifted off by 10 take one more. It may prove the break your body needs. I realise how hopeless things feel, but it may help if you tell yourself this is going to run its course it has taken over your body and you will yield to "it". You understand the nature of it. Time is on your side. Ok so you write off 12 months or so. It is nothing in the big picture and everything for a reason. When you come through this or it passes through you, you will be all the richer for it and good will come out of it. No need to be unrealistic but you can think positive among all the hellish realities of what is actually a very serious and life changing assault on your body.  Please do get the 'script for ami. It is an old proven drug, cheap, so not plugged by the industry.  You need something extra right now. You don't have to take it for ever and at 10mg it's almost placebo. Sarah

Thanks Sarah, i got ami from the GP a week ago but didn't want to use it as i didn't feel so bad but the reality is my sleeping is very poor and i've tried everything else. I'll likely give the 10mg dose a bash tonight. You feel so lifeless and with so little energy you can't enjoy anything or switch off from it whether i read a book, have a bath, listen to music, go for a walk, it's there.

Reading particularly difficult...lack of concentration.  Even watching tv drains your energy and there are no resources to draw on. No energy from food etc. but don't push yourself. Maybe if sleep can establish some pattern it'll improve but the moment you feel the curtain coming down, you have to stop everything. It's as if your very breathing is draining you further. But it will get better. Bfn

Yeah that's me. Appreciate the support !!

Just one more thought on yr haemachromatisis, have you had your spleen tested by any method?  I would keep an eye on that, what was the number ... Above 16?  I think this is v important David esp if you deteriorate or start to feel a lot worse... I am out for the day but keep me posted plse ...S

No spleen not been tested as far as i know. My iron levels were slightly above normal. Nothing too dramatic. Why would i want my spleen tested ?

serum albumin was 51 (norm 35-50). Mean corpuse haemoglobin 32.7 (norm 27-32).

O that's low enough. I won't regale you further.....  I guess numbers are only numbers.  It's about how we feel not what we measure! Don't tire yourself.  Maybe you can allocate 3 x p.d as once we get on here the hours can fly past which means brainwork (of a kind!)