I'm being treated for dysbiosis. Is there someone I can talk to about this?

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I'm taking an herbal remedy called Biocidin and I'm concerned about side effects.  I'm also taking 5000 mcg of Vitamin B12 a day and from some information I've gotten on the web I think that might be more than I need.  I don't have pernicious (sp) anemia.  Anyway, I've been taking the biocidin for 5 days, and the B12 for three weeks and now I'm having tingling in my feet, my achilles tendons are very stiff, my pulse  rate is 67 bpm, which I think is good, but it feels weak.  Is anyone familiar with Biocidin?

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  • Posted

    my first thought is that taking something that kills bacteria (and antibiotic) can lead to dysbiosis in the first place.  So the best idea is to make sure you always have a high quality multi-strain probiotic as well.

    tingling in your feet could be a nerve problem, in which case I recommend consulting with a good chiropractor (who really understands the nervous system).  if it is a nerve problem, fixing that could fix many other problems, including digestive issues.

    I'm not a medical doctor, just someone who has researched GI disorders and experienced IBS, now recovered.

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    • Posted

      Hi,  Thank you for your input.  It could indeed be a nerve issue.  I saw my chiropractor (who happens to be my doctor of Functional Medicine and gave me the biocidin) on Tuesday.  I've had three bad nights since I started the biocidin and think I maybe started to strong.  I warned her that I'm sensitive to meds.  I'll give her a call and back off on it for now.  It has also occurred to me that waking up with the sick feelings probably caused me some anxiety.

      I take a probiotic for Seniors, but think I will upgrade it based on your comment.  I've been dealing with hiatus hernia and diverticulosis and was on the Divi Diners forum for a while.  I got some good ideas there and the vitamin D and probiotic, and eating lots of fiber, has really helped.  Now, I guess, I'm full of yeast, bacteria and parasites from probably taking prilosec for several months?  I read that somewhere in this forum I think.  Do you know anything about that?

      I'd like to know what helped you with your recovery from the GI issues, if you're willing to tell me - please.

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    • Posted

      I hope you have a good chiropractor, its difficult to know for sure, but they can vary so much in quality (like all doctors).  Any truly excellent doctor is going to pursue problems until the root causes are found.

       My path to healing I i wish was more straight forward... but I can tell you what is working now and a little bit about how I got here.  First in short summary I've been using high quality multi-vitamins (liquid or liquid gels of course), high quality probiotic supplements with multiple strains, natural probiotic foods, bananas and L-Glutamine.

      So my problems were constipation, gut inflammation, and some bouts of diarrhea at first.  The gut inflammation turned into leaky gut that was giving me systemic damage and weakness in the body.  Eventually the gut got more irritated and gave me a lot of pain in the intestines and felt like the lining was being scraped away keeping me up at night.  I was eating fruits and vegetables so I did not understand why they were not still effective (dysbiosis it turns out).

      I did some reading and found out that probiotics are the key to fixing this.  The end goal is to have soft and "effortless" bowel movements, a sign that things are working well, something I had not been having for many years but I didn't think it was a big deal.  Probiotics keep bowel movements moving, help nutrients absorb, help to kill bad bacteria, etc.

      I started with a single strain 1Billion L.Longum pill which did virtually nothing.  I tried commercial yogurts which stopped my guts from painful scraping but did not repopulate the flora.  Finally I found homemade saurkraut, which immediately showed improvements consistently in my digestion.  This was it, I thought.  But relying on that everyday wasn't possible, because it eventually started giving me irritation from overuse (and from I think a pre-existing ulcerative condition).  So I needed something else.  I tried homemade Kefir which was great for a while, and provided a lot of energy via great nutrient absorption.  I started gaining weight and my muscles become stronger.  I also noticed that my lower abdominal pain was gone.  But eventually (through negligence I believe) my Kefir went bad and then drinking it gave me more problems with dysbiosis...  some people say Kefir can't go bad like that but my stomach and nose says otherwise. 

      So with my Kefir gone bad I was feeling in a desperate space, I decided to shell out the money for some overpriced probiotics at the mall (twice the price online but I wanted instant relief).  These probiotics were 25Billion per capsule.  These are said to be colonizing strains, and they seemed to colonize better than all the other probiotics I was using before (the Kefir didn't seem to colonize, I was addicted to it).   Using these high quality supplements things have been consistent day after day.  That shows me things are going to be ok.  I can even take a day off and the effects are still there.   

      Concurrent with these probiotics I also got in the habit of eating a high quality multi vitamin daily (the low quality gave me headaches) and a twice daily Zinc supplement before meals (I would chew it up to make sure its absorbing well).  Zinc has helped protect my blood brain barrier from leaky gut, and also has anti-pathogen properties (though its not an antibiotic perse).  I recommend Zinc that has some Manganese in there, since Manganese is using by friendly gut bacteria.

      For gut irritation during this time I would eat bananas and L-Glutamine (in small amounts).  Near the end I noticed I had developed a small ulcer and this helped heal it (I think this ulcer was present for some time but hard to distinguish from the other gut pains). 

      So combining all this together, the good vitamin supplements, the probiotics, also the bananas and L-Glutamine I was able to get myself back to the point where I can eat a bowel of beef noodles without getting a major headache or GI discomfort.  I'd still rather not eat such food (organic is the way to help preserve good bacteria), but that food it most readily available where I'm living.

      I hope that is helpful and isn't too long or off topic. 

       

      Emis Moderator comment: I have removed product/company names as we do not allow repeated posting of these in the forums. If users wish to exchange these details please use the Private Message service.

      http://patient.uservoice.com/knowledgebase/articles/398331-private-messages

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    • Posted

      and I should add that 5 years ago I had tried single strain L Bacillus probiotics (before I had a bad problem) and some other single strain types, which produced such a bad stink on exiting the body that I stopped using them thinking this couldn't possibly be healthy! 

      using the multi-strains or the homemade probiotics does not produce unusual odors yet still provides motility and "effortlessness".  

      oh speaking of effortlessness you mentioned diverticulosis!  I hope you are transitioning to the natural squatting posture, or at the least using a "squatty botty" type device.  the modern toilet creates much greater pressure on the intestinal walls.     

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    • Posted

      Thank you, thank you, thank you!  Not too much, not too long.  I have questions and comments - and an appointment with my chiro that I have to get to so I have to go.  I'll be back in an hour or so.  By the way, she has been providing me with all kinds of supplements, all with good intention, but the biocidin made me feel like I was taking a black listed antibiotic..  Back soon.
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    • Posted

      Hi,  I have some questions about homemade probiotics and the "squatty botty"  ("double double toil and trouble, fire burn and cauldron bubble" - sorry for the quote but it seems to apply to both of the above biggrin , and I don't usually like emoticons).  Also, specific products which aren't allowed to be mentioned here.  Would you be comfortable using the Private Message service?  Not sure what that entails.  Also, Steve might benefit from this info - page down to see his comment.  He's in CA so he's probably up by now.
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    • Posted

      I don't mind using the private message to share specific product information.   I can also give a general description.  For the probiotic I use a Multi Strain (10 Strain), with 25Billion, there is also a 50Billion might be good to try different strengths and see the difference. 

      Yes for the squatty toilet there are different options, but there is one popular option that you mentioned which provides a semi-squatting position that people say helps.  I use the full squatting position now, and do this using two small stools.  I don't recommend that to anyone, as it could be dangerous in certain bathroom conditions.  Also not recommended to stand directly on the seat itself, I've been warned that some have suffered serious injury from this.

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    • Posted

      sorry I should say 25 Billion CFUs, and 50 Billion CFUs.  Make sure to refigerate to maintain the potency.
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    • Posted

      CFUs is just the living bacteria present.  I just want to make sure I am specific and right my units (science teacher).  But I know its obvious I'm not talking about 25 billion capsules or anything XD

      I know the squatty toilet might seem funny, but what really makes me cry is how far off base our medical philosphy is (mine was too until very resently) and how out of touch we our with nature.  As a society we completely changed the natural bowel movement position, and never thought twice about it.  We keep trying to modify nature, and have a tendency to make things worse!!  I think we can modify things, but we need to work WITH nature not against it. 

      The same goes for synthetic drugs, chemicals have to support our natural responses, not just suppress them!  Most of our drugs today are used to suppress basic and important biological processes (thus cannot cure almost anything), and don't take into account our bodies useful responses to things. 

      What suprised me was I learned all this from a chiropractor.  I never had much respect for them until I listened to one (and he happens to be a very good one). 

       

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    • Posted

      Heaven forbid 25 billion capsules.  I understand that the number of living bacteria isn't actually  really known because some 'get lost' in the shipping and handling.  I've actually seen the brand I buy sitting on the shelf at another local store - unrefrigerated.  When I was looking into all this a couple of years ago when I started taking probiotics (never knowing that I'd end up here, now - makes me wonder) I asked about the viability of the critters and was led to believe that some might be lost in the transmission but there would be enough left to be useful.  I don't think I've put this very scientifically... 

       

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    • Posted

      There's another thing you mentioned that I'm wondering about.  The remedy that my chiro gave me is supposed to get rid of yeast, bacteria and parasites.  This could also kill the good bacteria in the probiotics that I'm taking - right?  Sort of counter productive.  Do you think it's a good idea for me to continue to take a probiotic?  Maybe I should take a bigger and better probiotic.  I guess this is a question for my chiro,but I'd like to know what you think.

      It seems that I'm going to take a break from that remedy for a few days then start it up again, more slowly.

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    • Posted

      I agree with you about how far we've come from what is natural and good for our bodies.   My gastro guy is giving me a bad feeling.  All he ever says to me is "No","No",  "You're reading too much"  "Don't read what's on-line" (of course, it's important to not take everything on-line as the truth), and that the 'broken bones from taking the PPI study' was of women over 45 who were smokers.  I don't care about the study, I don't want to take the drug..  Here's a 'for instance': for my hiatus hernia he precribed a PPI to be taken twice a day for the rest of my life, and maybe I'd need surgery..  I lasted two months on the drug.  Now here's my chiro suggesting that I take a little bit of apple cider vinegar in water with my meals to help my digestion. Do we need acid to digest food?  Do we produce less as we age?  And, oddly enough, or maybe not, some people might benefit from the cidar vinegar, and some people might not. We're all different and I think we need to be treated holistically and naturally.  My chiro reminded me that my hernia is not treated by the medication, and won't be fixed by it.. She's going to do some manipulation and see if she can relieve it.  Apparently the sphincter is very tight.  My part of the exercise is to give up coffee, chocolate and wine, which seems unnatural to me.

       

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    • Posted

      " he precribed a PPI to be taken twice a day for the rest of my life, and maybe I'd need surgery"   a PPI for the rest of your life and surgery... if I can quote a chiro I found online, we are in the dark ages of medicine. 

      Isn't it amazing that the conventional doctor prescribes a drug to block your bodies natural secretion of acid (he is a specialist no less), but the chiro recommends assisting the body by adding a little more acid.  which makes more sense to me now. 

      after learning more about health and who is actuall curing diseases, you realize just how wrong our minds are at such a deep level.  to have a drug based medical practice like this is truly barbaric, and yet so many doctors are people of high IQ, but smarts alone doesn't solve the problem, its starting from a belief system that is blinding people.   

      If I'm allowed to name names here, it was dr bergman the chiropractor and his online talks that really changed my opinion of what is good medicical practice.  I don't agree with everything he says, but the more I listened to him (and did research) I found it hard to prove him wrong and I found other scientists confirming alot of it (which at first sounded like nonsense, he claims to have cured patients of arthritis and other diseases). 

      He makes a strong case that many diseases we see today stem from the nervous system.  They are usually chronic degenerative diseases, which are not causes by a virus or bacteria... thus are probably caused by our own selves.

      giving up the coffee could help your body enter into a resting mode more easily (depending on your biochemistry, I know some people claim to sleep fine after drinking a cup at night even).  we are all different.  part of the journey into health is learning how to listen to your own body, not simply following advice (though advice sure is great when needed)   

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    • Posted

      about your question that's hard for me to answer since I never treated a yeast overgrowth specifically (though I might want to get checked for that just incase). 

      I've just found that certain foods keep me feeling good, and others will give me a headache.  does this mean the headache is related to the feeding of certain bacteria, or from chemicals in the food I don't know.  but I've found that wether I have an overgrowth or not, I do better on moderate sugar, NO processed sugar what so ever, and some low glycemic carbs.... and high fat (only quality fats nothing out of a plastic bottlw). 

      I in no way endorse this diet for everyone, but I judge my diets goodness 1) No stomach aches  2) No headaches  3) No bad skin.  If my skin is bad that probably means so is my blood, something I'm now thinking about.   If my skin feels bad after eating a plate of fried rice with chicken, I know I need to stay away from that (they always use the cheapest Palm Oil in a plastic bottle). 

      Trying to cook as much as possible at home, and use the best ingredients.

      What you said about the holistic approach, I hope you stick with it, to me its the only view that has ever made sense or offers hope of curing chronic illnesses, cancer, IBD, allergies, etc. 

      And about what you conventional gastro doc says about the internet that just about makes me cry.  The internet is the place where cures can be found.  People can connect with other people and share what works for them with no profit motive (assuming they aren't asking for any money).  Its wishful thinking to hope that the people who quickly recommend dangerous surgery and a lifetime of damaging drugs will one day tell us about simple natural solutions.  I'll take my chances online or with a holistic doctor.

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    • Posted

      I may have been a bit unclear I said :  in no way endorse this diet for everyone, but I judge my diets goodness   

      what I mean to say is I found this diet by looking at three main factors.  so just want to emphasis that it might be more important to look at your reactions, than to just follow a protocol.  however I did start my diet based on the gaps protocol, which begins with low fiber, now my main concern is just how organic is it, fiber is now ok for me to eat.

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    • Posted

      Hi, can you tell me what you consifer a good multi vitamin as i have had problems with headaches also with certain ones. Can you use the private message option to share this with me? Thanks so much..
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