Mirtazapine Withdrawal- the key to success
Posted , 57 users are following.
In a month I will have come off mirtazapine completely and for some of that time I have been able to work and do my job pretty darn well.
I went on mirtazipine for anxiety and it did not work and I put on 1 stone in weight was drowsy all the time and generally doped out. In some ways it was actually causing more anxiety and depression as well. Withdrawing from mirtazapine is different for every person and everyone has to go at their own pace. For me, it was extremely slowly when I got down to 7.5mg and lower. The tablets don't allow you to do this so request the mirtazapine solution that you dispense with a 1ml syringe into a little bit of water every night. Going cold turkey is a terrifying experience, the one most awful experience of my life and its also dangerous. I do not agree with people advocating taking valium during the withdrawal process because for anxious or depressed people a drug that powerful leaves you vulnerable to addiction because speaking from personal experience that is exactly what happened to me. Valium in my experience is nowhere near as hard to withdraw from than mirtazipine because it is so short term whereas the mirtazipine is a long drawn out business making it hard to lose perspective on what is a withdrawal symptom and what is your underlying problem. I kept a diary of my symptoms so I could look objectively at what I was experiencing and sort it out, but I still forget sometimes. As I said earlier about some of the time I have been able to work Im talking about the past 6 months where I have been following a plan devised by myself that works if you find the quicker withdrawals like \"half a table for a week then nothing\" or cold turkey dont work. There is a website by the organisation called CITA (google it) and they have a Back To Life handbook that you pay £13 for and it gives you a specific plan for mirtazipine withdrawal, tells you supplements to take such as the powerful detox drink Noni Juice, how to alter your diet to help decrease withdrawal symptoms. I had my vitamins tested and whereas before the process I was fine, afterwards I had a chromium deficiency making me very sensitive to sugar. If you can hack it I have found that a low carb, low sweetner, low sugar diet like the Atkins or the Dukan diet work very well as the mirtazipine plays around with your blood sugar levels and therefore makes you even more unstable. My basic way of withdrawing was this:
Ill use the drop from 0.1ml to 0ml (of syringe solution which with the 7.5mg solution equates to about 0.75mg very very tiny!!) as an example because that is what I am doing right now:
Week 1, take 0.1ml apart from wednesday when you take nothing
Week 2, take 0.1ml apart from monday and wednesday \"\"\"
Week 3, take 0.1ml apart from monday, wednesday and friday \"\"\"
Week 4, take 0.1ml apart from monday, wednesday, friday and sunday
Week 5, take 0.1ml apart from monday, tuesday, wednesday, friday and saturday (only take 1ml on thursday and sunday)
Week 6, take 0.1ml only on thursday.
week 7 , take nothing!
So each week you are cutting out one day of the week's dose which I have found really suits mirtazapine because if you just drop down a dose the withdrawal hits you really hard 2 weeks after and by 3 weeks on the dose I was horrifically depressed. If its too fast you can do the week 1 pattern for 2 weeks etc which I did for a while. I do see what they mean about mirtazapine having a short half life because it does hit you in the face at the 3 weeks marker, it is as if it just leaves the body very quickly between 2 and 3 weeks of dropping a dose. The gradual withdrawal that I ended up doing I think really suits mirtazipine because of this aspect.
The drop downs I did was, 30mg, 15mg, 7.5mg (half a tablet) (with the tablets I simply dropped the dose again when the withdrawal symptoms subsided) this bit was debilitating and I do not advocate it. Use the plan set out in the Back To Life booklet instead. When I tried to go to nothing from 7.5 then I experienced absolute horribleness. So I switched to solution and did 1ml (7.5mg), 0.9ml, 0.8ml, 0.7ml, 0.6ml etc etc down to 0.1ml which Im doing now. I got the solution from my GP so it is not hard to obtain it in the UK, it costs the same as a regular prescription, i think it is available in America aswell but im not too sure.
Finally i will just outline my withdrawal symptoms: vivid dreams, disrupted sleep/over-sleeping (I did a test using SleepCycle, an app for the iPhone to test whether a small dose of mirtazipine could affect my sleeping and I found with the analysis tool that I had much less deep sleep and was much more easily disturbed to being fully awake during the night than when I didnt take any mirtazipine. I think this is why you oversleep on mirtazipine.) Paranoia, itching skin, body shocks (like tingles that run from the top of your head to your toes), headaches, fatigue, bruxism or teeth grinding (can make my jaw ache), depression, anxiety, nausea, burning mouth syndrome (like a numb tingling in your tongue), floating sensations when going to sleep, cravings for sugar and carbs, confusion, forgetfulness, angry outbursts, irritability, hot/cold flashes, insomnia (the most disturbing for me but on my really slow plan I dont get this problem at all), social withdrawal (probably because my emotions were so erratic i was embarassed for anyone to see me), body aching especially in my back where I hold most of my tension, sensitivity to noise and light, blurred vision.
Some more tips: People often fear it is their illness coming back when they are experiencing withdrawal symptoms, this was not true for me because as I am nearly off mirtazipine now it is the best I have felt since I started taking antidepressants. They are only supposed to be used short term but I ended up on them for 6 years. If you felt no effect with the antidepressants after a few months it is best to come off them. Dont even risk it with drinking alcohol, it makes the withdrawal even worse, your body is going through a lot and it needs as little rubbish to deal with as possible. If you feel a burst of energy as I have done during this process even if it is 9pm go for a jog. Dont just sit around waiting for it to turn into a panic attack. And finally go with the flow and remember its not real and only temporary. \"This too shall pass.\" So just do your best at real life and hibernate through it all. This drug is not easy to come off just as all antidepressants are hard to come off, it has been compared to heroin withdrawal and having researched heroin withdrawal I agree with the comparison. If you drop too suddenly and end up seeing the doctor because you are suicidal and at your wits end you must slow down and dont let them just pump you back up to 30mg, just go back up to the last dose you took before you went crazy and go slower next time. A word of warning: the majority of GPs and doctors do not understand antidepressant withdrawal and from my experience neither do psychiatrists fully, they just prescribe. However you must not blame them for their ignorance even though it is hard not to when you are in hell, you put the drugs in your mouth so YOU have to get yourself rid of them at YOUR pace. It is sadly the ways things are in the UK at the moment.
The best of luck to anyone who is on this road.
I hope something I said in there helped you.
If it didn't nothing lost!
Kathryn.
24 likes, 157 replies
sarah_47032 Guest
Posted
Have you successfully come off metarzapine now? I came off in October 2015, and still can't sleep without either nytol, zopiclone, temazepam or 15mg of metarzapine. It's getting worse instead of better. I think I didn't taper for long enough but up until Xmas, I thought I was doing really well; even sleeping unaided a couple consecutive nights a week. The doctor says it's not withdrawal from metarzapine anymore and I have underlying issues. After reading this thread, I'm hoping I will get some answers and manage to one day sleep again drug free :,( I'm starting to lose my patience and my sanity from insomnia ..
betsy0603 sarah_47032
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Are you using mirt to help you sleep? If so, you have essentially reinstated the mirt. Do you use it every night, or intermittently? If the latter, it could be that you are worsening your situation by confusing your nervous system - will it get mirt or won't it?
These psych meds cause physical changes to the our neurons. They cause neurotransmitter imbalance that the nervous system pushes back against to regain homeostasis by down-regulating receptors and production of serotonin. When we come off too quickly, an imbalance is created from the reverse situation - the drug isn't there performing it's action which the nervous system adapted to, so now it must upregulate. If you use the mirt intermittently, you are destabilizing your system - it can't figure out what it needs to do - upregulate or downregulate - to regain homeostasis.
If 15 mg helps you sleep, then I would advise taking that every night and then, once stable, doing a very slow 10% taper off. By going slowly, hopefully you can retain your sleep as your system adjusts to gradually decreasing amounts of mirt. Rebound insomnia is a common withdrawal effect of coming off mirt too fast.
sarah_47032 betsy0603
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sarah_47032
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betsy0603 sarah_47032
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I came off Effexor over a year ago, and initially didn't really have withdrawal. Many months out I developed severe insomnia waking with anxious, ruminating thoughts. I was also experiencing daytime fear/dread, depression, derealization and more. I'd never had such issues before in my life. I reinstated, and only after that did I learn about protracted withdrawal last months and even years, especially with cold turkey/fast tapers.
Healing from ADs occurs in a windows and waves pattern. You can feel better and think you are done, but then go into a wave and feel much worse. You may be in a wave, but I would expect there to be other symptoms, too.
I would just be careful about using mirt as a periodic sleep aid since it affects serotonin receptors which are trying to upregulate - sudden doses will confuse your system and is not advised.
sarah_47032 betsy0603
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sarah_47032 betsy0603
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sarah_47032 betsy0603
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betsy0603 sarah_47032
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Have you used the temazapam regularly? That one can cause withdrawal if used fairly regularly and not. Zoplicone (Ambien) can also be problematic. I've read where people only get a few hours sleep per dose, but that was with people who were in withdrawal from other meds.
When you take the 15 mg of mirt, does it do the trick and make you sleep? Do you feel any side effects? Sorry, a lot of questions! What was the highest dose you were on before you came off?
sarah_47032 betsy0603
Posted
I was on 45mg for 6 years.,the zopiclone and temazepam I try to use very sparsely because they stop working as does the nytol ..Iv been meaning to get antihistamine to try.
I also take magnesium, calcium, vit c and d and put lavender and chamomile on my bed. All ideas from the Internet and I go gym regular but none of these seem to help.
Sorry what was that website you mentioned? I can't seem to find it but would like to go on there. Iv had more info in 48 hours on here than I have in 4 months from my doctor.
betsy0603 sarah_47032
Posted
https://patient.info/forums/discuss/depression-resources-298570
Since 15 works for you, have you tried 7.5 mg? If 7.5 mg works the same way, you might reinstate there, take every night, and after stabilizing 6-8 weeks commence a 10% taper. Check with the forum, though. I'd like to see what they recommend. They might even say reinstate less, but you'd have to go to extra lengths to get a smaller dose, like getting a milligram jeweler's scale (about $25 US on Amazon or eBay), or powdering the tablet with a pill grinder and mixing it with liquid to then meausre with a syringe. Once you've had these problems with withdrawal, though, most people are willing to go to those lengths to feel better again. I think the drugs you've tried for sleep have their own problems and are a short-term fix if at all. The antihistamine would be the same way.
phyllis_13554 sarah_47032
Posted
Hi
I have been tapering off Miratazapine for few months but even when I was on it I took Lemon Balm at night to help sleep and I switch it up with melatonin.
My new Dr told me to take a walk at high noon in the sun for a few days to reset my pineal gland. I've had the opportunity to implement that yet.
monica53564 Guest
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Patty9019 Guest
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rzammit Guest
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toni47195 rzammit
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If you want to reinstate as you are feeling bad you can reinstate at a lower dose, maybe 2.5 - 4 Mg and see whether your condition improves. When you are stable enough you can start tapering. The rule of thumb is 10% every 3-4 weeks. In order to do that you can mix the tablets with water on 1 to 1 percentage. So 15 MG of Mirtazapine with 15 Mg of water. This means you will have 1Mg of Mirtazapine for every 1 Ml of water. You take then with syringe how much you need and do your own schedule. If you are stable do not rush go slow.
Anyway you can even try and resist as you are already 5 weeks out. If you have only nausea and no depression or anxiety can just stick some more time but you never know how long it will last. Everybody is different.
Keep tight buddy.
Good Luck
rzammit toni47195
Posted
Hi Toni, thanks a lot for your reply. Much appreciated. I have nausea and anxiety and loosing weight). Anxiety kills me with weight loss. Whenever i go back on mirtazapine. I gain back the weight. I will try to go back on 5mg and take it more slowly
Have you ever tried the CITA withdrawal program? Please see attached . Thanks for your help my friend
toni47195 rzammit
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I am currently at 9Mg from 15Mg at the start of July. I am being slow in my approach and i still feel problems as my situational factors are not so good for the moment. Anyway i hope i am gonna make it.
It was stupid on me to accept these kind of psych meds but what has been done can not be undone so now acceptance is all we need. And try not to read many horror stories in the internet. If not for those i would have gonne faster on my recovery and taper.
If i was you i would not go straight at 5. Better try 2.5 - 3.5 i am sure your nervous system has already done some repairs in itself. In case you can not stabilise for 3-4 days you can increase with smaller increments up to one dose you feel stable. Preserve that stability for some weeks and then start taper. I am sure you will do it.
Anyway i am not a doctor so you do not take my advice for granted. Better discuss with a doctor and present this as an option.
All the best
toni47195 rzammit
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Good Luck
rzammit toni47195
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toni47195 rzammit
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rzammit toni47195
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toni47195 rzammit
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Hi rzammit
If you have only 5 weeks without it then reinstating a small dose might work. But do not jump into 5Mg. My advice would be start with 2.5Mg if it doesn't give effect increase by 0.5Mg up to the point you are stable. When you are stable stick with that dose for 1-2 months and after that start by decreasing 10% every 3-4 weeks. So if you are taking 4Mg you drop 0.4 MG and the next dose will be 3.6, after that drop 0.36 and so on. I think you can make it. In case you can tolerate drops with not much side effects you can go even faster.
I am droping currently 1Mg every 10 days or 2 weeks and am currently at 9Mg. The last two drops from 11 to 10 and then to 9 were done in a short time like 21 days and the previous week i had some WD which might be also amplified by my situational factors. Anyway i feel better the last two days so I am sticking with 9 for maybe one more week or 10 days and then will plan my next drop.
ANYWAY I AM NOT A DOC SO YOU CAN DISCUSS THIS PLAN WITH A DOC FIRST AND THEN DECIDE. I know it is difficult because most of the doctors think there is no WD and we are making it up but the facts are there. Important is to preserve stability.
Good Luck
rzammit toni47195
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Thanks a lot Toni! Mhuch appreciated. Today i bought a syringe. So i will dissolve 15mg with 15ml of water. I crush the tablet and try and take 4mg tonight
toni47195 rzammit
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Glad to hear you are doing good. Do not worry I think it will go OK. Anyway as you have 5 weeks without Mirt you better try a low dose first... 2.5 Mg should be good. If you will not feel relief with that go up the next day by 0.5Mg. Try to stabilize for one month and after that you can start tapering. You can keep the rest of the dilution in the fridge but make sure do not use it after 3 days as it looses strength. Make a mixture every three days... Keep in touch.