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Mix and match benzodiazepines

Posted , 5 users are following.

BS8
BS8

Why don't doctors understand the hell they're putting human beings through. It's either falling on deaf ears or 'all in your mind' is a good one when referred to a psychiatrist when you're in withdrawal. The next thing is you are diagnosed with a mental illness and given a label. The best one is probably schizophrenia or they'll change it to maybe schizoaffective disorder then add more to the mix of antipsychotics. Unfortunately antipsychotics also lower the seizure threshold. So how can you taper of any benzo when you're at risk of seizure from the antipsychotics? Can any doctor answer please? All benzos and Z drugs work in the same way to give their posh name anxiolytics or hypnotics. All are addictive, cumulative and have a different half life! So how and why do they keep on prescribing them? Why give diazepam and zopiclone combined with rispiridone, or diazepam with Olanzapine? Does this make any sense? They knew in the 1970s these drugs were causing devastation, breaking up families, driving people to suicide. YET there are people even on this forum who are new to benzos. WHY new accidental addicts. Is it money from drug companies or sheer ignorance? 

3 likes, 34 replies

34 Replies

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  • tootsie58
    tootsie58 BS8

    Posted

    BS8 it is to do with money. Plain and simple.

    I myself and have lots of diagnoses to my name. But I knew what was wrong with

    with me.

     

    • BS8
      BS8 tootsie58

      Posted

      Thanks I think so too. I was really angry when I wrote that post. Will explain, been really busy will msg you asap 

      take care

    • BS8
      BS8 carol20979

      Posted

      You and tootsie and I agree money. I wonder how many MPs in the UK or those on Capital Hill has an interest in these, can somebody find out please? I know of a few companies, one who manufactures a certain antipsychotic depot injection costing around £ 400 00 per shot! Sent someone crazy it was yellow carded! I noticed posts I've put on the zopiclone forum have little or no interest, yet they are on benzos. I'm wondering if they don't understand the difference ie the different benzodiazepine names? Really anything that affects the GABA receptors as some are sort of I suppose interchangeable?
    • carol20979
      carol20979 BS8

      Posted

      The way I unerstand it each one works a little differently from the next Xanax is at the top of the food chain so to speak and should only be used in  extreme cases like those with debilitating panic attacks even then I would not take it
    • BS8
      BS8 carol20979

      Posted

      What we need is a Doctor to explain, there must be one on this forum. How is it possible to withdraw from Xanax which I understand has a half life of between 6 and 12 hours also the easiest way to taper off of diazepam which again I understand has a half life of up to 200 hours. Why up to? Could  it only be 6, 26, or what? What if someone was on Xanax how long to be eliminated? What if say you decide to convert from Xanax to diazepam then found you couldn't cope? You decide to try say Tranxene yet another benzo but try to wean over then you feel worse? On top of this you have a virus. How would you know which was making you feel ill. if  you were in the older age category where benzodiazepines are ill advised. Where is the research on these drugs? Where are the experts on them? Are we Guinea pigs now?
    • annie1963
      annie1963 carol20979

      Posted

      I take xanax because it's the only drug that will make my foot pain tolerable. I never though I'd take such a drug.
    • BS8
      BS8 annie1963

      Posted

      I'm puzzled, I don't understand how or why you were prescribed Xanax for foot pain? What drugs had you tried before,also how long have you been taking iAnnie, how were you aware of it. Do you have a diagnosis on what the pain is in your foot? 
    • annie1963
      annie1963 BS8

      Posted

      After taking every test, nerve conduction, small nerve fiber test, diabetes, etc. taking pain meds, muscle relaxers, depression meds, using creams, changing shoes, nothing helped. I used xanax for an extreme anxiety attack and my feet calmed down. My therapist calls it conversion disorder. Where your body expresses your mental stress through some physical form. I tried to commit suicide over this horrible situation before this was figured out.
    • BS8
      BS8 annie1963

      Posted

      Annie I too have indescribable pain, 21 consultants later, numerous tests it was eventually diagnosed as autonomic neuropathy, everything that should work automatically doesn't. 

      How on long have you taken Xanax for ?

    • tess33005
      tess33005 BS8

      Posted

      We're making guinea pigs of ourselves. There are doctors in the UK whose sole remit is to help addicts. I am seeing one now, he is the only person who has treated me with respect and honesty. I think you're in the USA? Maybe your health system isn't the same as ours. I am slowly coming off forty years of benzo and Z addiction by using prescribed diazepam, the half-life of which varies from individual to individual, but is a good deal longer than that of zopiclone. It is the only thing that has helped me. At last!
    • tess33005
      tess33005 BS8

      Posted

      I think we all have very different physiological responses to these meds and obviously someone who is overweight and therefore has an enlarged liver will metabolise them at a different rate.

      Oh, and of course we're guinea pigs. And we're being guinea pigs for people who make a great deal of money, feeding our addictions. Tch.

  • craig137
    craig137 BS8

    Posted

    Poss a bit of both there. Money playing a huge part unfrotunately. Once your on benzos your on them for at least least awhile. Unfortunately we live in a society where "mummies little helpers" are the first line of attack. When (In my opinon) they should be the last line, but big pharm has ALOT of power, and will continue too whilst the US system is set up the way it is..Then you have the Z drugs are basically benzo's but all you have to do is change one molecule and bang you got a new product.

    ​Xanax is the grandadddy of them all. Followed shortly by diazepam. The reason for so many different types, is they subtly have a different way of acting on the nerotransmitter GABA (which i'm sure you all know about) such as Rohypol,(lunitrazepam)very strong very fast acting but only has the half life of about an hour. Then you have Diaz with a half life up too 200 hours. Benzos are not to be played with They are extremely usefull pills, when used correctly, as is Demerol (cocaine) or gas and air (pethidine) adderall (amphetimene) all same family of drugs but all with very different effects.

    Education is whats needed, I mean medical education, and the removal of the mental health  stigma

     

    • carol20979
      carol20979 craig137

      Posted

      So true Craig those of us with these related problems become master liars not by choice but  necessity. Do you think my employer would have  one ounce of compassion if they knew the truth mental illness is a brain disease, you get sympathy for cancer, and rightly so but none for MI you must be weak or crazy. I witnessed A coworker having apanic attack do you think anyone had sympathy for her no! well i did I understood and did not judge. that is why we hide in plain site fighting battles no one understands until the stigma is removed the suffering in silence will continue
    • craig137
      craig137 carol20979

      Posted

      Yes we are masters of diguise due to the stigma. "pull yourself together" lazy, mental, liar all things that have been said to me from time to time. So I chose to educate myself on mental health causes and cures. I read the DSMV (tough read btw) the best answer that usually shuts people up is " your trying to put a logical answer to an illogical problem"
    • carol20979
      carol20979 craig137

      Posted

      I like to think of it as a battle between your intellect and your primative brain that controls fight or flight among other things. the logical you says I can control my own thoughts and emotions but the primative brain takes over . Over time pathways develope that fast track the these reactions. It can be a slow progressive thing that builds over time everytime I think I have something beat the brain throws another curve 
    • BS8
      BS8 craig137

      Posted

      Craig it's not much different to the DSM1V where the use of the manual states ' treat the primary cause ............ Which preempts treatment for eg any major depressive disorder.  There is also an online video of Dr Bird introducing the DSMV where if you've read 1V it sounds as if he's selling the same manual. Any comments ? Pleeeeeese
    • BS8
      BS8

      Posted

      any info or thoughts on Pregabalin Craig, I'm informed it's a calcium channel blocker and wondered if you you much about it? 
    • craig137
      craig137 carol20979

      Posted

      A good description there. It's the relationship between the risk reward centers (dopamine/ serotonin levels, the mid brain (primitive and the Limbic system ( hippocampus, amygdala, hypothalamus and thalamus)
    • craig137
      craig137 BS8

      Posted

      Yeah it hasn't changed that much from DSM1V to the latest edtion which is the DSMV5 which was last updated in 2013 I think. Mainly minor changes in criteria for certain conditions and classifications. Not much help (in my opinion) definately more for people that what to get into the nittty gritty of it. A manual basically. So yes your right pretty much the same thing
    • craig137
      craig137 BS8

      Posted

      I had a friend in rehab who loved the stuff, that and Gabapentin. I personally don't have much expirience with it my self, but as far as I'm aware it has similar properties of benzos and is chemically very similar. Even though it's not classed as a benzo. It definately has benzo like effects. Think Paracetamol vs tramadol in comparision of strenght
    • BS8
      BS8 craig137

      Posted

      Tramadol is now reclassified like Zopiclone. they said in the beginning it was less addictive than codeine, they never learn do they?

      As as to the manual their (!bible was once described) what is the point of it if it's never followed, bit like the BNF I suppose?

    • craig137
      craig137 BS8

      Posted

      There is no way Tamadol is less addictive (harder to get hold of as you can just buy codeine/paracetamol combo and then do a cold water extraction. I agree though that both the BNF and the DSMV are more academic usage than "reader friendly" virtually useless for 99% of the population.
    • BS8
      BS8 craig137

      Posted

      People I know have been taking Tramadol saying it's not as good as Codeine, I don't think they get the hit. I suppose a bit like a huge Valium hit in one go then withdrawal through not spacing it out!

      have the printout of the relevant pages of the DSM1V re: withdrawal symptoms. When I get home I'll try and post it. that is reader friendly. The interactions pages in the BNF we just need the PIL and post those do you think? 

    • craig137
      craig137 BS8

      Posted

      Could you Email that to me would like to have a good read of that. Your right Codeine gives a stronger "hit" but Tramadol lasts alot longer. Either way take enough of either and your gonna get stoned
    • BS8
      BS8 craig137

      Posted

      I'll send everything I have. Have to go home first as its all scanned into my computers. I may have the use of the manual on this iPad if so I'll send it immediately!
    • BS8
      BS8 craig137

      Posted

      That's my point with addiction and tapering off at your pace when you've stabilised on one drug. I have supported two people very recently and over a long period of time. Both were almost off benzos. One was agoraphobic but better now coming out occasionally. Hypersensitive eg could stand water ( chlorine ?) drank only bottled water! The other was just coming out with the odd out of context remark! They were both sectioned one on a cocktail of various benzos and antipsychotics. The other I don't yet know! 
    • craig137
      craig137 BS8

      Posted

      sorry to hear that, we could always use an understanding friiend such as yourself smile I'm assuming that Tourettes has been ruled out for the one who was coming out with strange remarks??
    • tess33005
      tess33005 BS8

      Posted

      DSM? It's a joke. Even the compilers treated it as a joke. A real one. Who in their senses would believe in all the highly specialised 'disorders' that now exist - when they never did before? Jon Ronson did some interesting research into this - he actually spoke to one of the doctors who was compiling DSM111 and discovered what a laugh the shrinks were having at everyone else's expense. Tuh.
    • tess33005
      tess33005 craig137

      Posted

      Ha-di-ha. Just take tramadol AND dihydrocodeine simultaneously and if you can add in a benzo for luck, you'll be hallucinating within an hour.

      I know. I did it, by mistake. I did not enjoy the experience but I liked watching the little soldiers dancing against my wall. That was fun.

      I expect it was also highly dangerous................

    • tess33005
      tess33005 BS8

      Posted

      Take tramadol with dihydrocodeine and your favourite benzo or Z for a bizarre hallucinatory reaction. I discovered this entirely by accident so I'm not posting this as a recommendation for anyone. DO NOT MIX THEM - IT IS DANGEROUS. You could easily overdo it and die. I nearly did, although the visual halllucinations were exactly like those described in Charles-Bonnet Syndrome. Which I would not like to havepermanently, thank you very much. I am still slowly reducing my diazepam and I also gave up smoking (again) a few days ago. Three cheers for nicotine patches.
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