Motability Cars

If that had been the case I would not have stated that I knew what the ladies condition was, which I did, reason being we spoke while waiting to be seen, I would have said something but my OH said no I shouldn't, I never presume to guess the reason for someone having a car unless I knew for definite, I also know of someone who did claim for there child to have a mobility and care and had taxi to school every day and yet now child is 18 and absolutely OK and working full time in a quite complex position, I do realise that the net is large and cannot cannot catch every one who slips through, as for me just thinking of number one that is not in my nature, that's why I come on here and try to give hopefully helpful advice, not always I know but we have to give the best we can, as for hoping that no one would try to claim benefits there not entitled to is not realistic, human nature will always have those that would happily take from those that really need it,

I totally agree with you Anthony.   We have enough discrimination without us infighting and adding to it. 

 

We shouldn't judge others - unless we want to be judged ourselves....Get on with your life and don't worry about what others have or haven't got. 

 

Feel free to judge me, I have absolutely zilch to worry about, when it comes to my health issues there's not one that cannot be proved by medical tests, consultants reports etc, if you feel strongly that its a problem that we say there are people who abuse the system that's your prerogative, I stand by my thoughts that you would not be happy if you had been refused and you found out someone else had been granted and they didnt deserve it, wouldn't you be peeved.

It is amazing how many benefit fraudsters become so open about their actions in a dealership you’re the second poster after Big to claim that they were either told or heard this was the intention.

You may have had a short conversation with this person but how can you possibly know their full medical history or why they have been awarded Enhanced Mobility without a lot of supposition rather than fact.

I’m not Mr. Perfect and I sometimes wonder but having worked with many of these people I understand you should never judge a book by its cover. It is hard to get a message like this over without sounding critical but my principles won’t allow me to look the other way when I can see a contradiction, you complained about others misjudging you by claiming you are ‘lucky’ but then went on to make factual statements about someone you hardly knew and couldn’t possibly know if your opinion was right.

I have helped hundreds of people on this forum with both personal and benefit problems. By looking after number 1 I was clearly referring to looking after yourself first and ignoring any comments which are designed to make you feel a bit guilty about the help you are receiving. You are entitled as you have passed all the necessary checks and you deservedly have a motability car.

I would be peeved about myself not someone else. It really is poor when someone looks for a scapegoat for their own failings. All we are asking is don't jump to conclusions without having all the information.

I have been working on a help line for 12 years, I also have a position working for BHF and I can assure you that anyone I comment on is due to an informed comment, what your saying is that we should regard your opinion but not voice ours, I'm really glad you have never come across someone who has been swinging it, your a lucky man and I hope it stays that way.

I think these days anyone who can scam the system has to be a world beating actor!   They must also have doctors and consultants in their pocket too who tamely write the reports for them.  If they have all this then I reckon they deserve it. 

Yes  I would be a bit peeved,  but then I would forget it.  I don't envy others or worry about what they get,  only what I do. 

I learnt a long time ago that you can't control what others do,  only ourselves and the only thing we can change is our attitude to it. 

 

Don't put words in my mouth it was you who claimed to have had a conversation with a claimant who said she was defrauding the system in a dealership.

My opinion is that is very unlikely and you have simply jumped to a conclusion which is very shaky at best. If you have as much experience as you claim then the first thing you would have been taught is you should be objective and keep an open mind. The fact that you have failed miserably at doing so indicates that you are not a fit and proper person to hold such positions.

Official DWP figures have benefit fraud at a very low percentage. What you’re doing is buying into the Government narrative that ALL benefit claimants are cheats. That is clearly WRONG.

Great post Hypercat and I have nothing to add as you have summed it up brilliantly.

So did you!  Thanks.  x

 

Hi Anthony.

​The figures quoted by the DWP are estimates, nothing but pure and simple estimates.

​Put it this way I have spoken to many successful PIP claimants who mostly agree that they would not have got the award if they had not embelished the truth. There is the actual truth and the truth that may be exaggerated.

​For a start most are under the impression that they MUST write about how their disabilities affect them on the worst possible day.

​Personally from the numbers that I know that claim these benefits a large proportion are awarded not on the actual truth but on a carefully worded version of the truth. Should those claimants be treated as abusing the system? If so there are a lot more that do stretch the point who should be said to be benefit fraudsters.

No not a 'world beating actor' but someone who has researched their illness and describes all of the possible symptoms that COULD arise but don't.

Les I wouldn't be naive enough to claim that there are NO benefit fraudsters but what we had in this thread are 2 posters who claimed that separately in different mobility dealerships they either over heard or were told face to face by other mobility customers they were fiddling the system. This confirmed their ‘own’ observations of these people.

Why would claimants brag over defrauding the system in car dealerships not once but twice and in different towns/city’s? Frankly it is totally unbelievable that claimants would do such a thing whether they were cheating the system or not. None of this kind of thing is helpful it just plays to the narrative that the Government peddles about claimants being scroungers.

What you’re referring to is exaggeration which is benefit fraud. To get away with exaggeration you need a hell of a lot of luck and a pretty sympatric examiner both of which are generally in short supply. From your own experience you know how methodical these people are they even knew you were a part-time councilor when you were assessed for Attendance Allowance.

It is a complete myth PIP is an ‘easy’ benefit to claim and anyone who has claimed it will have been put through the wringer to get it.

I think there are some very jealousy driven comments on here and I totally agree with you Anthony.  It's virtually impossible to cheat the PIP system.  The application form calls for fine detail, the rules call for supporting medical evidence and the face to face assessment, which currently 98% of clai,ants undergo, is harsh.  I have been involved with several claims from people in my disability support group- Spina Bifida association.  Spina Bifida is a severe neurological condition causing various birth defects and I know of several members, who, despite good medical supporting evidence and clearly high levels of disability, have had their DLA awards reduced when reassessed for PIP and some wheelchair users have even lost their motability cars.  I think we should all take a deep breath and accept that not everyone has a visible disability, but if they are in a showroom ordering a motability car, the chances are they have been put through the mill by the DWP and  they qualify as far as the DWP are concerned - and that's all that matters.  To buy into the governments' 'all disabled people are benefit cheats' attitude is unhelpful to say the least, and to consider 'shopping' someone just because they don't look disabled is quite frankly, disgusting. You cannot possibly know someone's condition in detail and why would you want to ?

However carefully you word the truth on the PIP application form, you cannot blag the face to face assessment Les.  Currently 98% of PIP claimants have a face to face and believe me they are impossible to blag your way through.  Anything you say on your application form has to be backed up with medical evidence and will be scrutinised in detail at the assessment.  PIP is a very difficult benefit to claim - I have experience of people with Spina Bifida, some of whom are wheelchair users, and all have lost out on migration from DLA to PIP, despite genuinely high levels of disability.  In addition, it isn't benefit fraud to describe your worst days -  these are actually assessed for and they don't count unless they are present for more than 50% of the time - and the claimant doesn't decide this, the assessor does.  To suggest that simple exaggeration of the symptoms of disability will be enough for a successful claim is simply not true, and gives a false impression of how difficult a claim process PIP actually is.  

As for the DWP figures on fraud - these are correct and we're supplied as a response to a freedom of information request.  They also include the figures on DWP error resulting in overpayments for which the claimant is not to blame.  In addition motability supplied figures stating that 500 vehicles are being handed back each WEEK as a result of migration from DLA to PIP. These include people who use wheelchairs. 

The point is, that PIP was not designed to support disabled people, it was designed to save money.  It looks at a very narrow section of disability and is widely criticised as being an inadequate assessment of true need as it screens out high levels of disability by design.  To suggest you can simply research symptoms and then exaggerate your way to a successful claim is irresponsible and does no favours for anyone looking for help with the application process.

Pam I couldn’t agree with you more. I have in the past passed judgement on someone and then found out later I was completely wrong. I felt embarrassed with myself and learnt my lesson.

However, not everyone adopts that attitude. As seen by comments in this thread they simply won’t accept they are wrong no matter how much evidence there is to counter their ‘opinions’ or how flimsy their evidence is that someone is cheating the system.

It always amazes me when we see posts from claimants who have been turned down for PIP then claim there are millions receiving help they don’t need. They have experienced how difficult it is to claim PIP but because they have been turned down they suddenly invent all these people who have managed to ‘con’ the system. PIP is NOT an easy benefit to claim and it is frankly nonsense to suggest that most people who get it are frauds.

Good for u.Sorry but in the past Enhanced DLA meant U were crippled .Now genuine cases have next to no chance of obtaining any help getting around.I only applied for the mobility component as I have Lung and Heart disease needing to use a walking stick.I asked if my interrogato r was a doctor and her reply was NO. The only only aspect of PIP is that almost every one will fail unless they take their case to appeal,which I intend to do.

Well put Pam this is exactly what this government is doing .If genuine DLA claimants are invited to apply for PIP how many will take up the INVITATION before this becomes compulsory Very little methinks.

I don't apologise if my comments cause offence.The old system was open to abuse but PIP means that very few will be given help that genuine cases need.

Your posts took a long time to find because this is a very long thread that's 1 year old that you've been posting in.

Many many people that had life time awards of DLA have been asked to apply for PIP and they have no idea what PIP is all about. It's totally different to DLA and is NOT awarded based on a diagnosis. It's awarded based on how your conditions affect you daily. You have to prove that those desctiptors apply to you, with evidence. So many people make the mistake and think that there's no need to send in evidence because the DWP will ask medical professionals for this. This isn't true! mostly they do not ask anyone for evidence, it's the claimants job to send in the evidence to backup a claim.

It was 50 metres for a high rate mobility award with DLA but for PIP it's 20 metres or less, this means that lots of people now wouldn't qualify under the PIP rules. So many people fail to understand what PIP is all about and this is the problem.

Your statement of "almost everyone fails" is far from the true. I've never had a problem claiming PIP. Had a review last year and mobility was increased from Standard to Enhanced. There's many many other people who've also been successful. The only issue is we don't often hear the good stories, we only hear the bad ones. If someone has a successful claim, they have no questions to ask therefore we don't hear their story.

Your comments really anger me and suggest that 2 chronic illnesses as I have don't warrant pip.I never questioned that DLA was a taxable benefit and was given the princely sum of £67.per weeks as my occupational pension was deducted.My heart disease was only discovered last year.Don't know if I can reapply. CanI ask what illnesses gave u pip.

Whether my comments really anger you or not, i speak the truth. PIP isn't awarded based on a diagnosis, it's how your conditions affect you daily.

I don't understand your your comment when you say your occupational pension was deducted because DLA isn't or wasn't a means tested benefit.

It makes no difference what illnesses i have because like i said it's how your conditions affect you daily that gets you an award NOT a diagnosis. A person can have a diagnosis of multiple different things but it would make no difference what so ever.

Hi Ann Marie, I do have to agree with Denise, I claimed low rate DLA for about 7/8 years, I have RA, UC, osteoporosis, osteoarthritis, spondolitis, Fibromyalgia, and a couple of other problems, including some mental health issues, but I would never have been given PIP at reassessment because I was able to walk and function quite well, my problem was my hands are near as use less due to the arthritis, so you can see its not the disease it how it impacts on your quality of life, sadly due to a very high impact accident I am now badly disabled and can't walk 20 inches let alone 20 metres, my sister has a couple of chronic illnesses, one being really bad heart failure but she can not claim.

I did not say I was claiming DLA ,I was put onto Income Support with premium after winning appeal in 2011.This was because the decision maker would not pay out as this was a taxable benefit.UNTRUE. I would suggest that some people are shrewd enough to read up on what they need to sail through this process......

This forum is used for advice and support for people with illnesses.you are good at handing out advice yet can't share your disabilities.On the points raised limited mobility is vital in order to keep the enhanced mobility .

I have no reason to share my disabilities with you, it is none of your business. It wouldn't make any difference to you even if i told you because 2 people are never the same. I certainly do have limited mobility, which i why i get Enhanced mobility. Enhanced mobility is only award to those who have limited mobility, in exptreme cases it's also awarded fot mental health. You really are very angry, aren't you!

That should have read " isn't only awarded to those with limited mobility and not is only awarded" Can't edit posts.

I suggest that if you like to give your opinions  why are you so guarded in letting everyone know what  you suffer from as everyone is freely submitting theirs. 

I'm not hiding anything, thank you! People here do know what my disabilities are. I just choose not to tell you. The advice i give has nothing to do with my disabilites so why are you so anxious to know? Like i said it's my business and not yours... i said many times that it makes no difference what my disabilities are because you never get 2 people the same. I'm done here. Enjoy the rest of your evening.

As I said before, you sound very bitter and now I will add nosy to the mix.  What business is it of yours what problems other people have - NONE.  It really is up to each individual if they wish to divulge personal information and not your place to try and belittle someone if they choose not to.