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Night vs Day urination ability

Posted , 10 users are following.

james87669
james87669

Why is it that I can have such a hard time starting a stream when visiting the toilet during the night (after having been asleep for several hours) and have little problem during the daytime when awake and alert? As I see it this has less to do with BPH than with mind/body connections. 

Any thoughts on this?

1 like, 32 replies

32 Replies

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  • caringbah
    caringbah james87669

    Posted

    I was the same James before PAE but improved dramatically after. 

    I also notice I pee much better standing up than sitting down. Anyone else experience that?

  • Pepasan
    Pepasan james87669

    Posted

    I have found that the fuller my bladder the more likely the flow would be problematic. In the day we feel the urge earlier, so the bladder isn't pressing on the prostate as much but during sleep it takes longer for the body to wake us with the urge to empty and there is therefore more pressure. Just a theory deduced from subjective experience.
  • ben_87928
    ben_87928 james87669

    Posted

    Firstly James, thank you for your quite timely post.  Timely because recently I've been curious to know the reason, if not answer, to the same question as you enquired about on this most useful and helpful forum. 

    So like you I found significant problems starting a stream after sleeping in bed, perhaps for just even only a few hours.  Also I can experience similar difficulties in starting a flow after sitting for just a couple of hours too.  However the two-hour sitting problem usually only occurs when I'm attending a show at the theatre.  Attending the theatre means that for a number of reasons I'm somewhat restrictively 'boxed in'.  Obviously when sitting for long periods and wanting to spend a penny at the theatre can be a problem but say at home, the 'boxed in' situation doesn't apply.

    This difficulty starting a flow probably goes back to about 18 months ago and it's only been in recent months that I found taking exercise, such as a walk/stroll, does for whatever reason, helps to initiate a stream .  I should also mention that for myself an even more noticeable improvement in both sleep length and lack of BPH symptoms, I personally find after playing 18 holes of golf.  Unfortunately given the English weather I'm not able to utilise at this time of year…

    So in in part it would seem one answer the initial enquiry of james87669 about poor stream start is related to lack of physical activity, which perhaps points to a relationship in causing muscle tightness and maybe in turn increased stress of the prostate?  Which is thus possibly reduced when physical activity takes place?  Just whether more physical activity is, as James mentions in his initial post, anything to do with "mind/body connections" I'm not entirely sure?

    Perhaps it's worth mentioning that over a year ago in a private consultation with a urologist I mentioned my problem of difficulty of starting a flow, and was in no uncertain terms told by the urologist to take tamsulosin.  Which although I was reluctant to do so, I did and it did to an extent help with initiating flow.  However, chiefly due to the tamsulosin side-effects, a few months ago I gradually eased myself off tamsulosin.  Fortunately since completely stopping taking it, so far, touching wood, apart from the experiences described above, starting a flow hasn't been a significant problem.  What the reason is for the improvement I'm not altogether sure.

    Perhaps though it's worth noting I have for the last 12 to 14 months significantly changed what I eat to an even more I believe healthy input of foodstuffs and liquid.  E.g. for breakfast, I now eat a avocado, a papaya, home-made muesli made principally from various nuts, dried fruit, quinoa, sprinkled with organic wheatgrass powder, chlorella and/or spirulina.  I have also installed a good four stage water filter and drink non-caffeinated herbal teas.  If nothing else, since starting this change to a more natural food non-processed food diet (not that I ate much rubbish processed stuff before though), however since the change of diet, apart from finding it easier to start to a stream, I do have a good deal more energy than previously was the case.  And this without having to put up with the well-documented side effects of tamsulosin!

    Just out of curiosity, I wonder if some urologists or medics when dealing with patients that experience such urinary problems as described above, like poor stream start, if sometimes first they recommend the free more natural fix/workaround, i.e. such as, taking a stroll/walk etc for a few minutes.…  And/or also do the medics enquire about their patient's diet.  And if so, where appropriate, perhaps recommend to their patient/s to improve the diet? I'm tempted to ask if generally they don't mention these things, why is it?

    Oh incidentally caringbah , yes I also find a much better flow when standing up as opposed to sitting down, I suspect gravity plays a role in the reason for this.

    • arlington
      arlington ben_87928

      Posted

      What side effects did you find w/ tamsulosin?   Thanks
    • Pepasan
      Pepasan arlington

      Posted

      Retrograde ejaculation. Makes no big difference to feeling of orgasm with intercourse, but much less satisfying with masturbation.
    • ben_87928
      ben_87928 arlington

      Posted

      Using 400 µg daily tamsulosin, I personally fairly quickly noticed a general lack of libido.  Manifested mainly in reduced drive/energy and to an extent physical strength.

      To sum up, I became quite lethargic!

    • james87669
      james87669 ben_87928

      Posted

      Yes ben, very well said! I have taken many similar steps to improve my situation.Wondering if your sleep has also been effected while on tamsulosin. My nex Uro visit is Feb18, and I will discuss discontinuing the tamsulosin and see what happens.I have the ability to self cath so I am no longer woried about a trip to the ER. BTW, a little over a year ago I had a procedure which was supposed to get me off meds completely. This being  Trans Urethral Microwave Thermaltherapy or TUMT. An outpatient procedure that promised much but failed to produce the desired results since I was back in the ER nine months later in retention.

      I have included in my diet a top quality supplement as recommended by my Dr. and am in the process of overhauling my diet. Daily walks of 2 to 5 miles and maintaining a proper BMI. I think that with a little effort we can restore our function without relying on medication. 

      Thanks again for your input !

    • ben_87928
      ben_87928 james87669

      Posted

      James, I can't say that I've noticed any significant difference in my sleep patterns whilst taking tamsulosin or after coming off it.

      I suppose on average I get up about one and a half-time during the night.  Just once in awhile though I feel the need to urinate up to about four times during the course of the night.

      So far as I can recall that relatively high number of times doesn't occur if I've been significantly physically active during the course of the day/evening.

      Of course stating that helps to reiterate/confirm what I mentioned in my initial reply message.  BTW much appreciated for your positive comment.

      Of course I very much wish you well with your sensible exercise and diet approach.  Obviously there's nothing to lose in taking such an approach.  Except perhaps a few extra bob in quality food expenditure…

      Generally I have to say, it seems to me too many 'Westerners' appear to be overly conditioned to think that taking the drug and/or invasive medical system should be their first step when confronted with many health related problems!

      Having stated that though, I'm watching fairly closely the PAE outcomes and related comments reported by members on this forum.  And from time to time I'll be following whatever information becomes publicly available about the current PAE trial taking place here in the UK.  

      To my non-medical trained mind the overall logic behind the PAE procedure seems to make good sense.  And seemingly the vast majority of post-operative PAE patients enjoying amazing outcomes, sometimes very quickly as well. Plus the procedure itself can hardly be termed significantly invasive either.

      Hopefully in the not too distant future the PAE procedure will be deemed entirely safe.  Thus presumably, if the current government regime wish to save British taxpayers money funding the NHS, (I suppose the NHS still just about qualifies for being non-privatised …) hopefully the PAE procedure will quickly become much more widespread, staffed with lots of highly skilled PAE administering radiologists!

      Incidentally James, you mentioned about a quality supplement recommended by your doctor, I also daily supplements. Principally a quality fish oil capsule, quality multivitamin and Glucosamine/Chondroitin.

      Out of interest, if possible, I'd be interested to know what your Dr recommended supplement is?  

    • ben_87928
      ben_87928 james87669

      Posted

      James I've just noticed your reply message to my last (second in total) message has currently being blocked awaiting apparently the moderator releasing it.

      As something of an addendum to my second last reply message.  Although I stated in my second last that I didn't notice any marked difference in sleep patterns.  I do now specifically remember that when, on a couple of occasions, I'd forgotten to take tamsulosin at the recommended time in the early morning, I did later the same day, about about mid-afternoon, took a tamsulosin tablet.  Following which, I do now better recall, my subsequent sleep was to an extent adversely affected.

      I'm still not sure why the tamsulosin instructions say to take the drug first thing in the morning.  I remember doing some inconclusive research trying to find this out.

      However personally speculating , knowing that the drug lowers blood pressure and pulse rate.  It might be recommended to take early in the day to try to minimise the possibility of the drug lowering to perhaps dangerous low levels ones blood pressure and pulse rate during ones usual normal sleeping hours.

      I can certainly personally vouch that taking tamsulosin does lower blood pressure and pulse rate.  As I do, for reasons chiefly out of interest, occasionally monitor with my own blood pressure and pulse rate with my own quite expensive blood pressure clicking device.

      Average readings when I was taking tamsulosin were, systolic 104 and diastolic 61, with a pulse rate 53.

      Nowadays being off tamsulosin for a number of months, average readings before somewhat strenuous exercise, are in the 120 over 69 and pulse rate of 62.

      I also found that since coming off tamsulosin I can, to an extent, more easily read the time display on my bedside radio alarm!  Coincidentally, and perhaps more telling, I've also been able to go back to using my second last bifocal prescription spectacles.

      Since all this I have subsequently learned that tamsulosin can have issues with one's eyes.  However I can't say for certain that coming off tamsulosin is the only reason for the improvement.  Because I remember at about the same time of reducing and completely coming off tamsulosin, I started supplementing with Astaxanthin.  I mention this because some people supplementing with Astaxanthin have reported improvement in their vision ..

      Therefore I can't be totally sure of the reason for the improvement.  Which relates to my short distance sight vision.  Perhaps a combination of the two, who knows?

      I do apologise for not mentioning these, I suppose important, issues, when I responded to your enquiry question.  It's, I suppose, an age thing you know, hopefully you don't…!

      Anyway James, hopefully your message can soon be released to the forum thread fully intact!

      Just a brief related comment.  I believe it is sensible to have responsible moderating of these quite important medical related forums.  So I take my hat off to the volunteer/s who give their free time to do this important work.

       

    • james87669
      james87669 ben_87928

      Posted

      Ben, moderator will not allow me to mention product. 

      Having read your last post I should mention that my Dr. instructs me to take at bedtime. 

  • ben_87928
    ben_87928 james87669

    Posted

    Thanks James, no worries about about the specific supplement info being stopped.  But of course I did receive the supplement name you sent.  I've now researched the supplement and found the company manufacturing it, noticing they also manufacture with very many other supplements too.

    I notice the supplement uses the active ingredient and much discussed and apparently used 'saw palmetto'.  In the past I've tried a number of saw palmetto based supplements.  At one point, to a degree, the saw palmetto did alleviate my common BPH symptoms.  Unfortunately though symptom alleviation didn't more than probably a couple of weeks..

    Here's wishing you good luck with the supplement your Dr recommended.

    James noticing the doctor recommended supplement info and its manufacturer , I suspect you are probably located in the US, may I ask am I correct?

    • james87669
      james87669 ben_87928

      Posted

      Yes Ben, I am a life long New Yorker (Long Island to be exact). I have had the good fortune to have vitsited England and have several friends that call it home.

      I agree that Saw Palmetto has few high marks of late but any port in a storm I say. 

      It has been a pleasure hearing from you.

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