PIP assessment lies

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Hi 

I have a spinal cord injury and was indefinite DLA in 2010.

I was told just after Christmas I need to make a claim for PIP as DLA aid ending. I have done all this and had a F2F. I’ve not had a decision yet but have requested the assessors report which I received yesterday.

The report is completely wrong and basically lies about virtually everything.

According to the assessor she awarded me 6 point so daily living and 6 points on mobility. I provided 7 letters form my various health professionals which support my disability and I have a disability for life and will get worse as I get older. 

If the decision maker goes by the assessor I will lose my PIP altogether. I’m trying to find out if the assessors decision will be based on the report or will he/she take into account the medical letters?

I also suffer from mental health issues and this is just another thing on top of everything else going on at the moment. 

Any advice would be great.

Many thanks 

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  • Posted

    HI Ash,

    They can often lie on the report, it's terrible. I'm afraid the decision maker relies heavily on that report and the likelyhood of them going against is very slim. 99.99% of the time they go with that report. It's looking like your next step is to request a Mandatory Reconsideration (MR) You'll have to wait for the decision letter to do this but you can start your letter of request now. You will have 1 month from the date of the decision to get your request in. What you need to do is look at the report step by step go through each of the descriptors and point out where you think you should have scored points and why. Try and avoid mentioning those lies, that letter needs to be straight to the point. You want the decision maker to read it all and not a few sentences and get get fed up. I know it will be hard to avoid mentioning those lies but you must try.

    Most MR decisions remain the same with only 20% being successful. You'll most likely have to take it to Tribunal. 70% of those who appear at their Tribunal have a decision in their favour. The process is long and could take anything up to 1 year for a hearing. That and the time it could take for a MR decision, it certainly won't be just a couple of months. There's no timescales to any decision, including MRs.

    If the decision does stay with the report then your DLA will stop 4 weeks after a decision is made. If you claim any other means tested benefits then they could also be affected, including if someone claims Carers Allowance for you.

    Stay strong and fight it all the way, it's the only way. Good luck.

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  • Posted

    Hi you need to go for mandory reconsideration  first see if they will change decision  if not then appeal there's loads of support and imformation on this site who's been through this I'm just waiting for another tribunal  date but in meantime you could get intouvh with welfare rights and they might help u with the paper work good luck and keep me posted jean

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    • Posted

      I received a letter today about my DLA. I called them and they said it’s nothing to do with PIP and it’s the annual letter confirming award. Can I use DLA award  to be taken into consideration when I apply for the MR? 

      Mine was awarded indefinitely and surely shouldn’t this be taken into account? 

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    • Posted

      Unfortunately not because they have completely different criteria. An indefinite DLA award means nothing now, sadly. You can ask your GP if he/she has anything you can use from your medical records, but they maybe a charge for this.
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    • Posted

      Thank Denise 

      I’ve got loads of letters from consultants to GPwhen I requested my notes. I didn’t show all of them as I thought i had provided more than enough anyway. I’m going to use some of them for MR. GP is going to provide me with another letter but this time it’ll be a lot deeper in terms of my disability. 

      When I originally applied for DLA it went tontribunal too but I can’t recall the questions. Is there a big difference between the 2 now?

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    • Posted

      You're welcome.

      The more evidence you have the better but please bear in mind that only 20% of MRs are successful, so you'll most likely have to take it to Tribunal.

      DLA is nothing like PIP. PIP has descriptors that they use to score points and if those descriptors don't apply to you then you won't score the points for an award.

      It helps massively to have an understanding of what PIP is all about. There's plenty of info on the internet for you to have a read of. Starting with the PIP descriptors will help. Have a read through them to see exactly where you think you could score those points and gather the evidence to prove they apply to you. Lots of people think that because they had a life time award for DLA they will easily get PIP, that's not the case. Many people who had a DLA award will find that the PIP descriptors don't apply to them.

      When looking through the descriptors also remember the reliability criteria too. This means that if you can't do something regularly, reliably, without pain and discomfort then you're classed as not being able to do it at all.

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    • Posted

      Thanks Denise for the valuable advice. 

      My wife’s helping me with it she’s a better writer than me too.

      Will hopefully go through everything again and again till it’s right.

      Thanks again

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    • Posted

      You're welcome. Try to stick straight to the point rather then focusing on the lies that were told. The case manager/decision maker will not be interested in any of those lies. Good luck.

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  • Posted

    This is separate to the original post.

    During the assessment the chair broke and the assessor didn’t ask if I was ok or offer any help whatsoever. Basically left me there.

    Here’s the reply

    So received a letter today reference the complaint. It’s all been denied by the nurse. She said she asked if I was ok but she did it. 

    Reference the fall 

    I can confirm that the incident in question did take place during the assessment. The chair in question has been removed from the assessment centre, an incident form wa a completed on the day in accordance with internal policy. I can confirm that all of our assessment centres are equipped in accordance with DWP guidelines and have been inspected.

    The client states that following the fall the HP did not offer assistance and did not check if he was ok or needed assistance.

    The HP refutes this allegation and states she did ask if he was ok and did not assist as she has a pre-existing back problem. However as I was not at the assessment and in the absence of independent witnesses I am unable to fully resolve this element of the complaint.

    Conclusion,

    I am sorry that You felt distressed by the assessment process. On investigation however, I can see no wrong doing by the HP and the correct procedure regarding the reporting of incidents has been followed. However, as I was not present at the assessment and in the absence of any independent  witnesses, I cannot fully resolve the allegation.

    basically banging my head against the wall 

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    • Posted

      Did you fill in an and sign an incident form? If you didn't then you should have because an accident happened while you were at the assessment and it seems like it's your word against theirs.

      If they say you did and you didn't then ask to see the form that you were supposed to have filled in. It should have been signed by you also. Did you take someone with you that would have seen what happened that day?

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    • Posted

      Hi Denise, 

      I went with my wife but they saying she’s not independent. My wife went the next day to check k if they filled the form in and if she can take a look but they said no and it had been filled in. They’ve said they’ve done it in the letter so can’t deny it in the future.

      I’m seeing MP tomorrow regarding the fall. I’ve managed to get an appointment with CAB too to help with complaint about the lies in the report. They’re basically telling me that she’s right but hopefully I can prove she didn’t ask if I was ok or help. She squatted around 5-6 times when checking my legs and stuff and she didn’t look as if she had any back issues. Then the part about having an independent witness how do you do that? Do they want me to just pick someone out from the street and ask them to sit in for an hour or so. I’m not going to drop it and I’m going to take it as far as I can. 

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  • Posted

    Received the dreaded brown envelope this morning. I was on high mobility before and have now been awarded standard for both.

    The report as I said before was full of blatant lies. The annoying thing is the letter says they have taken into account the incontinence as being consistent with the GPletter yet for other activities the GP letter has been ignored. They’ve not taken into account letters from the consultants and because I use crutches this means I ha e good grip. It’s ignored all other parts on the supporting letters which makes no sense to me. The later is dated the 19th and I received it this morning. My appointment with CAB is on the 14th. I intend to get a reconsideration And am really annoyed why all the evidence was ignored. There is no mention of the fall either in the report. I’m considering reporting the nurse too for her lies in the report to the NMC 

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    • Posted

      Are you saying the decision maker went against the assessment report? In your first post you said the report had given you 6 points for daily living and mobility, if so then they went against the report and that itself is extremely rare.

      How many points were you finally awarded? It's really important that you take a look at all of the PIP descriptors so you know where you can gain those extra points. I know you're annoyed at the lies that were told but for the MR you should concentrate on where you think you should have scored those points and why. Not focus on the lies that were told. The next decision maker who will look at the decision again will not be interested in those lies. You need them to read your MR letter and not get bored after the first page. I'm sorry if that seems harsh but i'm only stating facts.

      They will look at the whole award again and not just the descriptors you disagree with so you do risk losing everything you already have.

      If you have a mobility car the motability will be in contact with you for that to be returned. There is options though but this depends on how long you've had a mobility vehicle.

      The complaint for the lies in the report should be sent to the assessment providers and not DWP because they don't deal with those complaints. I'd be very surprised if you have a response back as mostly they don't. Reading what other people have said but if people don't complain the lies will continue.

      Finally, you have 1 month from the date of the decision (not the date the letter was sent or received) to request the MR. I'd advice you to send any further evidence with the letter. Good luck.

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    • Posted

      Hi Denise 

       

      I’m working on it now by going through all the descriptors. The decision maker has not taken into account the consultant letters from my surgeon, urologist and pain management team. They’ve just picked one point form the GP letter and I’m assuming that’s why they’ve given me 8 points and then at the same point they’ve ignored all the other parts of the letter. I don’t have a motability car so that doesn’t apply to me. I had prepared myself anyway by getting more supporting evidence from the consultants and GP which is more up to date as the letters I originally sent in were around 18 months old. I’m also going to dispute the length of the award as it clearly states in all the supporting letters that my disability is for life and will not get any better. I think it’s ridiculous the way they can ignore all other evidence and go by the assessors report with whom I spent about 30 mi utes with. She also didn’t mention nothing about the fall during the assessment. Not sure how these people sleep at night 

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    • Posted

      The decision maker relies heavily on that assessment report. You were extremely lucky to be awarded those extra points and i can't tell you how rare that really is.

      As for the ward length there's 1000's and 1000's of people out there that aren't going to improve, myself included and the maximum award length before assessment is 9 years. Very few people are given this. I do know of 1 person that posts on here sometimes, who i did actually give a lot of advice to was given that very same award by a Tribunal. This person has MS. My maximum award length so far before re-assessment has been 3 years. I wish you good luck protesting that part. Indefinite awards no longer exist. Having that indefinite award for DLA has nothing to do with your PIP claim.

      Expect to have to take it all the way to Tribunal too because only 20% of MR decisions are successful. 70% of those who appear at their Tribunal have a decision in their favour, it's much less for those who have a paper based hearing.

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    • Posted

      thanks Denise one more question when I let them know I’m asking for a reconsideration does everything have to been buthe 28 days or is just making them aware that I would like it looked at again and then follow in with extra evidence?
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    • Posted

      No problem. They will give you a further 28 days from the time you request it. However by doing it this way and waiting to send your letter of request with your evidence then they can actually go ahead and do the MR without the letter and evidence because it has been known many times.

      My advice would be to write that letter, gather your evidence, send it just before the 28 days and then ring and request the MR. You haven't mentioned the MR during any phone call to DWP have you? If you haven't then that's good. Don't say anything until you have to.

      Don't forget they look at the whole award again so you risk losing what you already have.

      Curious, how many points did you receive for daily and mobility? you said you got standard for both?

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    • Posted

      Thanks Denise. I’ve been given 8 points for both. No I’ve only just receive s the letter today so not contacted them. I’ve got a letter from GP yesterday as I was gathering everything together as I expected no award at all. She’s taken one sentence from the GP letter and agreed with that and ignored all the other points the GP wrote in terms of mobility. So what I’ll do is gather everything then send it in. In the meantime just leave it as it is.

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    • Posted

      As you only scored 8 points for both this means you need another 4 points for each. Have you taken a look at the PIP descriptors to see where you can score those extra 4 points for the daily living? If you haven't already then i'd advice you do this. An extra 4 points is a lot, especially as you only just scraped the Standard award.

      For mobility i'm assuming you're claiming for a physical disability and not mental health? If so then Enhanced would be 20 metres or less, where as DLA was 50 metres. There's the reliability factor to add onto that but please take ALL of this into consideration.

      I'm not trying to put you off so please don't think that. I'm just trying to put everything into perspective for you. DLA and PIP are totally different so please bear that in mind too.

      If you're just going to gather everything and send it with the MR request letter then please make sure you send it with plenty of time to arrive at the correct department, as mail isn't classed as being there until this happens. Post can take approx 7 working days to arrive because of the royal mail sorting process it has to go through before reaching DWP.

      Good luck.

      Good luck.

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    • Posted

      Thanks Denise 

      I’m not sure how to send a private message and I can explain a bit more to you if that’s ok 

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    • Posted

      You're welcome. Yes of course you can. Just click on my name and then click on the envelope to send me a PM.

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    • Posted

      Hi Denise 

      So finally got the dreaded brown envelope through the door this morning. I have now been given 14 points for daily living and 12 points for mobility so am now back on the high rate for both.

      I did exactly as you advised and took each descriptor and made a point of why I should’ve been awarded more points.

      I was really surprised. I saw the envelope on the side this mor OMG as wife must e picked it up.ive been worried all day and didn’t open it as I thought they’re not going to change the decision. When she returned home she opened it and she said there you go you’ve been awarded the points for both parts. The only down side is the length of the award has only been increased to 3 years now from 2 before the MR. My wife is saying is should appeal that as the evidence we sent in for the MR says that I’ll get worse as I get older. Not sore about that yet.

      Thank you so much for all your help and I genuinely mean that. Your advice was paramount in helping me asking for the reconsideration.

      On the subject of the assessors report and the fall Atos have said that there’s no independent witnesses and all the usual rubbish that goes along with it. We escalated this to the next level and again were given the same respomse.were now taking this to the independent examiner and also writing to the NMCabout the nurse and her lies.

      I will keep updating as things progress. 

      Thanks so much again to everyone who responded to my questions it made it so much easier .

      Ash 

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    • Posted

      Hi Ash,

      That's fantastic news to get the award changed at MR stage,Only 20% of MR's are successful, so well do you. You're also very welcome. It always makes me so happy to hear that all my advice has paid off when people return and tell me such great news!!!

      As for your award length of time, i think you'll be totally crazy to spend more of your time appealing this decision. That's an average award length for a lot of people. Especially as your award length was also increased at the MR stage.

      My condition will never improve and i was only awarded 2 years the first time and 3 years the 2nd time. My daughter's condition will never improve and she was only given 1 year before a review. You're extremely lucky to have had it changed at the stage you did, at least you can relax now you have the maximum award.

      Good luck with the complaint.

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    • Posted

      Hi again 

      Another update

      After Imthe MR I asked for an appeal for the length of the award. Had alettee from the courts last week that they’ve received all the paperwork and what to expect. Received a letter from DWP today and the awards has been increased to 10 years. I am so happy and I can honestly say without your advice and support I would’ve struggled. Your advice was fantastic and I hope my situation inspires people to go for an MR and if need be tribunal.

      Also I have received a response from the independent case officer regarding the complaint about the fall and how biased the independent assessment managers report was regarding the assessor. I spoke to her on the phone and she’s assured me she will take into account everything that I have raised in my complaints 

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