Problems with blood pressure going mad trying to work out levels

Thank you i also wrote a reply to mrs0

yes dont smoke or drink walk 1 hour or more a day etc 

Not convinced giving up caffeine has any bearing on blood pressure. Also the jury is out on salt. Its usually the crisps and chips they come with that are the problem. 

Many things that we are told are bad for us often out not to be. My last blood tests showed that my sodium levels are low.

I had a very, very old doctor in the 1960's who used to smoke a big pipe in his sugery. I once asked him what he put his longevity down to. He said moderation in all things and an excess of Whisky. 

I did give up salt on diagnosis of hypertension and could nevergo back to consuming it as I once did aas I no longer like the taste. My husband [83] is quite another matter. He seems to have lost his tast these days yet piles the stuff onto the side of his plate always saying he likes the 'crunch' .And he eats it too!! He doesn't have hypertension although does take a small dose of Atenolol for 'essential shake' [of the hand] so that may be the reason, doubt it though as he always had very low pressure. A full blood count recently said his sodium levels were well within bounds, at the low end of what is acceptable actually. That really shouldn't be so if what the experts say is right.

For myself I gave it up as I was willing to try anything to reduce the BP myself by any means if I could. I've no idea if it has made any diffference.

When expecting my baby I was sent to a dietitian for advice on what and what not to eat during pregnancy due to the fact that I have one kidney.  One of the things I was told to avoid was salt as it could cause fluid retention and lead to high blood pressure which was expected to be a side effect of the pregnancy for me in the later stages, also due to having just one kidney. However I proved the experts wrong and my BP stayed normal throughout.  I gave up salt completely and found I was unable to taste the first few boiled eggs without salt.  After the birth I couldn't wait to start adding salt again.......and all I could taste was the salt and not the egg!  I've never added salt to anything since that day.  I did say to my kidney consultant recently that in view of my overnight leg cramps I was considering adding some salt to my diet - he was horrified and said whatever you do do not have salt.  Even when the last BP pill had to be stopped suddenly after just 3+ weeks due to blood tests showing that it had caused low sodium levels, raised urea and creatinine and worsening kidney function, he still told me not to add salt.  The good news is that my repeat blood tests 4 weeks later show that my kidney function has picked up 7 of the 8 points lost on the Indapamide, and the sodium and protein levels have returned to normal.

The salt subject is an interesting one especially in view of the latest theories abounding that it is sugar not salt that is the culprit!     

Yes the sugar versus salt theory is interesting, I'm inclined to believe it too. If you have only one kidney though I can understand why your consultant was concerned. I don't know much about kidney disease although if you have only one kidney ;perhaps you were born like that so not disease. Sorry I'm an ignoramus on the subject except that hypertension can lead to kidney problems.

Well I'm sure we're all ignoramuses on subjects we haven't had to deal with! I was born with two kidneys but after many childhood problems it was eventually discovered that the problem was being caused by a kidney so it was removed approaching my 13th birthday.  The remaining kidney has served me well for over 50 years until about 8 years ago when a blood test revealed chronic kidney disease.  At the time, I had been taking a small dose of Ibuprofen daily for several months, had undergone a scan during which dye was injected, and was suffering from a then undiagnosed rheumatic inflammatory illness.  Any one of those things could have damaged my kidney function.  And, yes, as you so rightly say, hypertension can lead to kidney problems, as can many of the hypertension drugs.  So it would seem I'm between a rock and a hard place!  There you're not an ignoramus any more.....probably just bored to tears! 

As I said earlier I stopped both and it did not make any difference to getting Hypertension or T2. 

Ah but did you stop turning the water into wine as well, Derek?!

Did you have symptoms from your undiagnosed rheumatic condition that caused you to take ibuprofen?

Yes in so far as I stopped making home made wines when I no longer had a garden:-)

One to perhaps amuse you. The first wine I made was not from our own fruit but from rice and raisins. After initial fermentation I was going to put the rice and raisins on the compost heap. Then I thought that the many  starlings that visited our garden would like it. Soon a flock descended and had a good tuck in. Unfortunately they were unable to leave right away as they were staggering around in a drunken state.

The wine did turn out to be very good.  

Yummy, rice and raisin wine sounds tasty - not surprised the startlings made the most of it.

Hubby thought he'd venture into wine-making in the early days of our marriage.  The air turned a bit blue when I found a cork had blown in a demijohn that he'd placed in the airing cupboard!  Our white linen wedding presents were now damson.

Elderberry wine was another favourite of his - he gave me a tiny drop of that heated up one night when I felt the flu coming on.  It went straight to my head (never could take my drink!) and I think I must have almost immediately passed out for the rest of the night but the next morning I woke up right as rain with no sign of flu.

 

Yes, horrendous pain - couldn't get out of bed.   Was eventually diagnosed as Polymyalgia Rheumatica, after a linked condition called Temporal Arteritis had joined in the fun.

How little I know about kidney function but I'm learning. Ibuprofen can cause a lot of problems too I'm told. My husband can't take it all for pain relief due to the effect on his stomach, that's quite common I believe. So many drugs can have such bad side effects and hypertension drugs are no different. The notes inside the Losartan and Ramipril too if I remember correctly, state that those drugs are protective of kidney function. I wonder which are the suspect ones?

I refused a calcium channel blocker at the start of all this because I read you can't eat grapefruit and I do like grapefruit.

 

I've heard that elderberry is really good for colds and flu. i made some once and it was horrible! I'd rather make slow gin or damson gin if I can get the damsons. On a cold winter's day a small tot of that is heaven.

If a newbie suddenly arrives on this thread, s/he will think we're just a load of alcoholics and s/he's arrived at the wrong place!

We once went to a food and drink exhibition. One stand was giving out samples of his wares to attract buyers. The elderberry was not bad. We went back again the next day as all the stalls had been generous with their samples.

We again had some elderberry and and it was dreadfull, sharp, fizzy and yeasty. I commented that yesterdays was much better. He said that he had given so much away that he had to make another batch last night:-)

Perhaps better to suffer a small hangover than side effects of medications? So long as we don't drink fourteen bottles a day as Gérard Xavier Marcel Depardieu is doing.

It was good. I still have the recipe,

We had an alcove on either side of the chimney in our bedroom where I had shelves put in and louvre doors fitted. The shelves were marginally higher than a wine bottle. One batch started to ferment again after bottling and the corks could not blow as they were pressed against the shelf above. Tugging them out was the devils own job and of course the corks  then popped and spurted wine.   

 It must have been dreadfull. So that is why you are on steroids?

My husband makes elderberry wine and I love it -it is my favourite of all his country wines. One glass at night is guaranteed to send me off to sleep. I am not surprised the second lot of wine at the exhibition was horrible. Mike always reckons that homemade wines need to mature at least for 3months before they are really drinkable. 

Having looked at all your posts, I have to say that in an odd sort of way I am glad there is someone else otbtherecwith multiple medical conditions. At the last count I had 14, many completely unrelated to each other and also unrelated to age. I take steroids for uveitis (eye condition) and at the moment I am taking 25g per day because I have just had a cataract operation on my left eye. Hate the side effects of steroids, but worth it for the fact I can now read without glasses. Happy days!!

Me too

Derek, yes that is why I was on steroids.  There's no cure and no known cause - steroids just reduce the inflammation that causes the symptoms, and in the case of temporal arteritis protect us from losing our eyesight, until the disease burns itself out, but after 6 1/2 years with the condition and 5 1/2 of those on steroids, it went into remission two years ago - yippee.  Now run a local support group under a Charity, speaking of which I must get off here and deal with  things relating to a fast-approaching meeting next week.  Great fun talking about wine and hearing your stories though.   

All I can say Gill is keep taking the pills!  Seriously though, it sounds as though the cataract operations being carried out these days are nothing short of miraculous with the amount of friends I've got who have been able to throw their specs away following cataract surgery.  At least you can now cross that one off your list!

I once worked with someone who was into winemaking big time for his family. He did not drink anything less than two years old.

Last time I saw him he was pushing a trolley round a DIY store full of roofing materials. He said 'This time last year I would not have been doing this as I had a valve replacement and a quad bypass'

Caused by too much home brew?

I had my cataracts done last year. After wearing specs rom the age of 12 the world is now a totally different place. I now just need glasses to read smaller print in newspapers.

Thanks Derek that is really enouraging. I have to say that I wok up this morning and my eyes felt normal but I could see so much better.  I will have to have the second one done to see without glasses but certainly much improved though still have colour vision problems. After the macular aneurysm I discovered I had problems wth yellow.eg cannot see yellow on white and cqnnot distinguisg eg between blue and turquoise, or red and orange. Bit of a problm when you are a keen crossstitcher like me!!

I had a cataract op 4 years ago and hadn't realised how bad the vision had become in that eye. I now need another one in the other eye.

My younger daughter had the same sort of thing done privately at huge expense; she didn't have cataracts just bad eye sight. She is really pleased with it and says she hasn't had eyesight like it since she was a teenager. She felt it was money well spent. Not sure of the procedure but it was an upmarket version of the NHS cataract op. Could be the procedure that is advertised on TV? My elder daughter had laser treatment and is very pleased with that too, that was for long [or short?] sightedness. After a few years she finds she needs glasses just for the small print as you say Derek.

My first eye gave me problems with dryness after the operation. Evidently caused by the cheapo eye drops with preservative given by the NHS.

Once I got preservative free ones plus a different type of artificial tears it settled down.

I found it difficult waiting for the second eye to be done as they were out of synch. I was lucky in that when I once phoned up for advice a helpful nurse had a word with admissions who had a cancellation. That got me done about four months earlier.

 

I was given the choice of correcting my short distance or long distance sight so I went for the distance option. If you get it done privately you can get a graduated lens to correct both.

I had been told for years that I had very small cataracts and that they probably would not cause a problem. I was then prescribed Amiodarone after going into AF while wating for cardioversion and Tamsulosin for my enlarged prostate. I started to get floaters and blurred eyesight.

When I had my eyes tested the optician said that my cataracts had worsened and would probably need doing within two years.  

I was referred to a consultant for the floaters. She confirmed my research that both drugs affect the eyes and that Tamsulosin can make cataract surgery more difficult. 

Are floaters connected to having cataracts? First I knew I had one was when I tried to catch some rather large spiders in front of my face !! I soon realised what they were and although they moved about a bit eventually I didn't really notice them any more although of course they hadn't disappeared.  When I went for my annual eye check the optician told me I had floaters and seemed surprised that I hadn't mentioned it. I never thought to ask what, if anything, they signified. She did ask me  if I had diabetes although I wondered if that was a routine question. Are they connected?

I don't know what causes them but my doctor has them as well. He said that his are telephones. I did not ask if they are mobile.

Mine started very soon after starting Amiodaraone. I was watching TV and glanced towards the window and the shapes (leaves and an island shape) started when I looked back at the TV. I thought that it might hsave been caused by dazzle but it kept on happening. Even happened when looking at a boarded up shop window. When I stopped the Amiodarone they stopped soon after but as I had been referred to an eye consultant I kept the appointment and so had my cataracts done.

When I was again prescribed amiodarone this year they came back and still the same shape. When I had the follow up consultation after my cataract operation the surgeon said'coincidence' When I stopped Amiodarone again the leaves blew away and the island sank back into the sea:-)   

Google says:

Floaters and spots typically appear when tiny pieces of the eye's gel-like vitreous break loose within the inner back portion of the eye.

BUT:

If you see a shower of floaters and spots, sometimes accompanied by light flashes, you should seek medical attention immediately

The sudden appearance of these symptoms could mean that the vitreous is pulling away from your retina or that the retina itself is becoming dislodged from the inner back of the eye that contains blood, nutrients and oxygen vital to healthy function. When the retina is torn, vitreous can invade the opening and push out the retina — leading to a detachment.

Thanks Derek, that google info was very helpful. I do get floaters as a consequence of my uveitis, but knowing when to ask GP about them s helpful. You are a fund of useful,information!

Would rather not think of all the details - urgh!  Biggest mistake I made was to google the actual cataract op before I had it [4 yrs ago]. I knew exactly what the surgeon was doing Better not to know!

They have never bothered me but I did know that flashes were bad news. The optician said they move around the eye ball so you only see them when they are in certain positions. They are always there though.

A close friend of mine rang me recently saying that she was finding a problem seeing out of the side of one eye - I immediately thought of GCA (something I'd experienced) which can cause irritrievable loss of vision if not treated immediately so I suggested immediate visit to A&E.  They discovered a detached retina.  So no floaters or light flashes in her case.

Our son awoke one morning and noticed a little disturbance in his vision but just assumed his eyes were still sleepy.  A couple of days later he thought he should make an appointment with the optician.  He was given an appointment a few days later.  He had had a silent stroke in his sleep (a clot to the brain).  Luckily he is fine in every way apart from not meeting the DVLA guidelines for driving.  A fit 39 year old who has never smoked, never taken drugs, 3 x weekly gym sessions, amateur league football player and tennis player.  Just so wish he'd contacted me immediately he felt a problem - the blood thinning meds he's now on, given immediately, would probably have restored his vision to normal.  However, he's feeling very blessed the outcome wasn't more serious, as, of course, are we!  

 So, whatever the symptom, as far as eyes are concerned, there is no time to lose in getting it checked out.  

I like to know what is about to happen. I watched heart valve replacement and prostate laser surgery on YouTube as well before having them.

Doctors tend to be more open with you if they know that you are interested and informed. 

I'm not sure what GCA is? Detatched retin though isn't good is it.

Very sorry about you son having a TIA [I presume that was what it was?] but why can't he drive now if his vision has reverted or is it something to do with the blood thinning meds he now takes?

My brother had a similar thing about 2 years ago. He woke up one morning unable to see out of one eye. He took himself off to A&E to be told he'd had a TIA [that's what he told me but sometimes he only tells me stuff on a need to know basis ].He already had epilepsy and I don't know what they added to his already lengthy list of meds. His sight in that eye never returned anyway.

You are right in that doctors are more open with you if they think you understand the problem, certainly my GP is. However I was squeamish about the cataract op!

Letters from consultants to my GP usually start:

Thank you for referring this ** old well informed gentleman to me....

I usually think that is doctor speak for 'know all'.

The only ones that I am squeamish about are dentists:-)

 

Jane, GCA (Giant Cell Arteritis, otherwise known as Temporal Arteritis) is an auto-immune/inflammatory illness where the blood cells in the temporal artery (those at the side of the head - temples) become large, thereby blocking off the blood supply to the optic nerve at the back of the eye.  Immediate treatment with very high dose steroids, sometimes by injection, is needed to save the sight in the eye affected and protect the other eye.  GCA can also affect other arteries/blood vessels in the body leading to severe pain.  There, I hope you're not sorry you asked!

Yes a detached retina can also be serious and can involve treatment over many months.  My friend had surgery at Moorfields in which they inserted some substance which will eventually be removed - until then she won't know whether her peripheral vision has been saved.

No my son didn't have a TIA - it was a diagnosed as a stroke with a clot to the brain being seen on MRI.  His peripheral vision was affected and has not returned sufficiently to enable him to meet the DVLA guidelines according to his optician.  The blood thinning meds will hopefully protect him from further stroke - everything crossed.  No cause was found for the stroke.

Wise brother of your's to go immediately to A&E but very sad that the quick intervention didn't protect his sight in that eye.  I would think epilepsy was quite enough to cope with.

Derek, don't know how you can put yourself through watching procedures that you are facing.  When I had an angiogram some years ago, there was no way that I could look at the screen.

Snap! with being described as "well informed" in your consultant's letter.  When I had that experience, I too thought that probably means "know it all" in their eyes!

My hubby reckons he asks for an injection as soon as he sits in the dentist's chair even if it's just for an X-ray!

He's my stepbrother actually.  I didn't add that he also is a cancer survivor [laryngeal] so has problems with speech, had lost both parents by the age of 5 and then lost his wife to breast cancer leaving him with 2 young children. Oh - his first child was stillborn !!! What a chapter of accidents.

Oh Jane, how sad.  We should all count our blessings.

With the first angiogram I had in 2001 the doctor had the screen at an angle and I could not see it. I had this ongoing feeling of pressure in my groin as he pushed the catheter in. How long will this take I asked him. Take? It's over and I'm watching the action replay he said. All done in ten minutes.

I expected the same next time in 2011 but it was not to be. This time I could see the screen. He kept on pushing the catheter in and around. He stopped and asked for a different sized one and then for another that the nurse had to go to the next lab for and then for another smaller size that the nurse said they did not have. He kept on fiddling and pushing and I asked what the problem was. He said that he had done three arteries but the fourth had an awkward bend on  it and he could not get the catheter round it. He then asked the nurse if she would try and explained what she needed to do. No way!! she wisely said.

He fiddled more before giving up saying that he could see enough to be fairly certain it was also clear.

Time taken 55 minutes. I later complained to the consultant as to how long his registrar had taken to do it. Part of his learning process he said.  

Ouch!  That's enough to put your blood pressure up!

Dentristry is much quicker and less painful now with higher speed drills and I say unless you are going really deep no injection. OK you need them for an extraction and my roots go very deep, I had a root removed last year after the crown broke off. She had difficulty getting it out and drilled holes in it to get a better grip then it broke in half. It took her 35 minutes of foot on the chest type dentristry. I said that made you sweat pointing to the perspiration on her face. She denied it saying it was spray.

Part of my problem is that I don't like feeling trapped, in a chair and no way out but planes are OK. 

My problem with dentists is my gag reflex and I choke if something presses on my tongue or touches the back of my throat.

One dentist tried to do an X-Ray and I gagged so much it was blurred.

He tried again and I choked even more. Go away he said, youre wating my time.

Yeah, I often think that I should wear my BP monitor at times like that or when at the races or checking my share prices.

Very funny.