PVNS: experience and causes

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I recently got diagnosed with the fairly rare condition called Pigmented villonodular synovitis (PVNS) a disorder which affects joints. In my case, it was my knee joint, as is often the case.

I'm posting this to help others better identify and understand this condition, and also to explore any possible causes.

PVNS is very easily misdiagnosed by GP's. It was misdiagnosed twice in my case, by two different doctors.

Because it's more common in the 30's and 40's age group, and the symptoms are similar to arthritis, it can be misdiagnosed as the early onset of arthritis of the knee/joint in people who are in the upper end of this age bracket.

In the case of the PVNS affecting the knee joint which results in a tumour growth at the back of the knee (as in my own situation), because the condition often arises after a trauma to the knee joint, the condition can be misdiagnosed as a simple lingering knee injury, leaking joint fluid, giving rise to a Bakers Cyst.

The symptoms of PVNS are both sporadic and very similar to both an ordinary knee injury and arthritis as the condition progresses. The joint becomes stiff and movement restricted. It's usually painless in the early stages but as it progresses it causes mild to moderate discomfort with a persistent burning pain around the joint area.

If left untreated, PVNS in its advanced stages, can render the joint completely unusable, requiring a complete joint replacement.

Here's my own experience of PVNS:

I was taking Tramadol (a painkiller) for back pain and was heavily into exercise and was also carrying a heavy bicycle every day up and down stairs. I injured my knee. This was due to the Tramadol I believe. My pain tolerance threshold was at a much higher level, so the injury didn't fully register and I continued exercising and carrying the bicycle, further straining the already injured knee.

Two years later, the knee joint gradually became stiffer and a lump appeared at the back of the knee. It became so stiff I could no longer crouch or bend down to tie my shoe laces. I went to the doctor and was misdiagnosed as mentioned. The second GP ruled out arthritis from an x-ray and to confirm his diagnosis of a leaking joint and Bakers Cyst, he requested an ultrasound scan of the joint. The scan showed an overgrowth on the lining of the knee joint and a tumour growth, resulting in a PVNS diagnosis by an orthopedic consultant.

A proof-positive diagnosis is carried out from sample by examining cells under the microscope from the joint which have the typical PVNS-like abnormal characteristic.

There's two forms of PVNS, localised and diffused. The localised version is what I have. It is a lot easier to treat using key-hole surgery with a better prognosis for recovery. Diffused PVNS affects the entire joint lining, requiring open surgery to remove all of the knee lining and it has a much higher risk (almost 50%) of returning, and requiring extensive physiotherapy.

PVNS is quite a rare condition as I mentioned. Therefore it's not encountered very much by GP's and there hasn't been much research done into the causes of the condition or why it returns in many sufferers. It's not thought to be hereditary, and as I mentioned, trauma to the affected joint is a common feature.

This leads me to wonder if certain medicines, or activities, may cause the condition. As I mentioned, in my own case I was taking Tramadol (at a normal dose of 50mg once daily) for several years, both prior to, and after my knee injury.

I'd be interested to hear from anyone else out there who suffers with PVNS and their backgrounds, in particular:

Anyone who has developed PVNS while being on Tramadol or similar drugs?

Anyone who has developed PVNS after a sports or work related injury, which they ignored?

How much time elapsed from any initial injury to PVNS symptoms and diagnosis?

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  • Posted

    I have had an initial diagnosis ofPVNS in the last few days. My surgeon wants to confer with a colleague- a professor- who specialises in osteo sarcoma. Apparently there two conditions can present themselves similarly. I have had 4 menisectomies to my left knee over the past 4 years due to a work related injury. 

    The pain level, restriction of movement of my knee, unable to flex my knee and the general restrictions of not being able to kneel on this knee or squat down. The pain has gradually become very intense over the last 6 months and I was referred to a pain management specialist. Not diagnosed as yet. He changed my meds around, stated he was going to write a long referral letter to a pain management clinic in my home town and they would contact me to set up a time to begin treatment for the pain level. That was 5-6 weeks ago and I have heard nothing as yet. Then these results from my MRI queried PVNS. I have no doubt that the 4 previous surgeries to this knee have greatly contributed to, if not caused this tumour in me. Treatment has not been discussed as yet, waiting for the outcome from the conference my surgeon has had with this professor. 

    Im reasonable sure that no matter the diagnosis, it may be a bit of a tough and challenging road ahead. 

    My main aim is to have a lot less or no pain as the ideal outcome. I have had extreme pain on and off ( mainly on ) over the last 4-5 years and am desperately in need of less pain, more movement and a much better quality of life. 

    I still have 2 teenage boys to look after, who do need a fair bit of care and I would like our quality of life as a family to blossom.

    Should have answers within the next week, so fingers crossed, it won't be the worst case scenario. 

    I am extremely grateful that I had an MRI requested by my surgeon to do prior to our next visit. I was starting to think that I was maybe going a tad crazy. Was I imagining this much pain? Was my brain stuck in a neurological loop? Deep down I knew the pain was very real and very painful. At least now we can look at the causes, treat and heal.

    • Posted

      Where you are located will make a big difference in getting a correct diagnosis as it is such a rare disease many or even most have not seen it. MRI can show it but only biospsy can confirm it. I was diagnosed in Jan 2003 after my knee blew up on me the previous Sept. I wont try and down play this disease but by the same token it is Definately a long term problem and one that virtually no-one can fully understand as you are now living on a medical island. I was fortunate enough to be within a short distance of a university medical center and teaching hospital. They have a couple of orthopedic oncologists on staff that finally have the diagnosis and had a synovectomy and radiation to start with. Google pvns and look at the discussed variety. There are pictures of what you look like around the joint. I had severe bleeding to the point the had to go in under anesthetic and drain over 200 cc of blood 3 x's and then aspirate either 5 or 6 times taking 65-75 cc each time. All of this from oct 5 to the end of the year. I fully understand the pain and mental angish you are enduring and wish I could offer some sage advice on pain management for your stage but elevation and ice along with pain meds is the best I can do. I have had a long and difficult time because of but not all directly due to pvns. Because of the group I started with, 8 surgeons with over 100 yrs experience had never seen it so we floundered around. It finally ate up my knee and tkr was necessary. They knee they couldn't get it all and it came back with vengence causing me to have a revision. After that i have had to have 6 more surgeries due to a fall and broken leg. BTW I'm in the central part of the US and my surgeon has seen about 25 cases with me being the oldest when the symptoms 1st started. It is a disease that generally affects people from early teens to mid 40's. I had one Dr at a children's hospital say he had seen it as young as 9 and one girl had 13 surgeries by the time she was 16. I don't want to scare you but your family will need to know this is a real problem and not a psychological thing. You'll need help and support both from the mental and physical side. You can send me an email anytime you wish to talk privately or just need someone who has been there and understands what you're going through. You will make it i assure you but you will also shed some tears along the way. The first thing out of everyone's mouth is " you sure don't look like you have anything wrong....you just look great". Your 1st thought is "you don't look like a frickin idiot, but you are". Take care and keep me advised.
    • Posted

      Sadly, I have to agree with your point about being strong, physically and mentally. My experience was nearly 30 years of surgery (30 plus synovectomies) and people (friends, family, work) all failed to comprehend the scale & scope of  this disease and the lack of a simple 'one only' fix.

      When people would ask - every time - "So ,whats actually wrong with your knee this time" I'd attempt to explain, and even had prepared a simplified medical artical for them to read. Their eyes would just glaze over with non-comprehension and then I'd get "My Brother had an arthroscopy once and that worked just fine, I'll get his Surgeon's number for you" Well meaning but nonetheless insulting.

      In the end, I realized that it was easier for people to decide that you just couldn't get your sh*t together and find good help. So they'd decide you had mental issues, and were perhaps an attention seeker, a hypochondriac or something.

      So whilst I was being smashed with pain, inconvenience, finance & job impacts, I was also being judged poorly by the ignorance of people who simply couldn't/wouldn't understand the issue. Indeed the best supportive discussions I had were the 'online' ones in forums like this, with other victims of this disease.

      My Surgeon - Assoc Proff Musc/Skeletal & Tumour Reconstruction, at RAH - had only ever treated one other patient with agressive difuse PVNS like mine, and indicated to me that sadly, she eventually developed mental problems... couldn't cope with it all.

      PVNS has taken me down a bumpy road, and had amassive impact on my financial security, career opportuniies, and my out look on life. I appreciate everything/everyone I deem a friend so much more, and I have some amazing long term friends that I've met through mutual struggles with PVNS. One of whom, I'm happy to say has since beaten PVNS and will be at my wedding next January.

      My best advice is to be firm with people, and if they ask, you implore them to listen carefully to your explanation. Be assertive about it, and if they glaze over, then from that point you answer every subsequent question with a polite dismissal until they demonstrate that they're ready to listen.

      My fight with PVNS is over too now. In the end, I lost the battle, and my knee joint, but I won the war and have my life back. No more surgery now, because I have a fully metal prosthetic knee joint (and one third of my femur) and mobility is fabulous. Since May 2014, when they excised my knee joint, I've now built up to the point where I can easily walk 20km a day without issue or pain. Indeed a great result!

  • Posted

    Hi,

    My name is Bree. I was recently told by my ortho that I had pvns in my knee.

    I have had a lot of pain for over a year now and I was told I had a sprain in my acl and then a tear in the pcl. well they were wrong and told me I actually had this diease pvns. I am supposed to get surgery next month, Arthoscopy. They didnt give me info. but said it should be an out patient surgery. Has anyone had this done and went home the same day?

    • Posted

      I had a scope but because of the severe bleeding I was hospitalized 3 days. I was diagnosed in 2002 and have had a number of surgeries . I hope you have an ortho that is familiar with the disease. Its difficult and invasive. Most of us that have it require multiple surgeries. Google pvns and see what you have. I Now have a surgeon who has treated over 25 cases and the university medical center has 2 ortho oncologists to back him up. Some will tell you an mri can diagnose it when most super specialist will tell you it takes a biopsy. You're the 2nd person on here today that just rec the diagnosis. Its a difficult disease to completely control. My original ortho group of 8 with over 100 yrs experience had never seen a case. Radiation is another treatment. I had 30 rounds of 75% Radiation to start with. It slowed the tumor but didn't get it and wound up burning the tissue pretty had. BTW its a disease that normally hits between early teens to late 40's. Mine hit at age 65 and 13 years later I still have some in the bone. It is in a bundle of nerves and if they go after it I could lose the leg. I hope this isnt seemed a scare tactic post but you need to know its not a quick or sure fix. BTW I'm in the central U S and use a teaching medical school as my hospital. If I can be of any additional help and you want to talkbprivately, just email me.

    • Posted

      I'm 34 and I have had the pain and swelling for well over a year now. In tired of being in pain and some days, I can hardly walk. I'm hopes that this surgery works and that I can go home the same day it gets done. I was curious of how long the recovery time is for this type of surgery?
    • Posted

      Its been awhile but I do recall there was a lot of bruising, swelling and bleeding. Then I had several weeks of rehab 3x's a week. I had already retired so didn't have to worry about that. Unfortunately, I never was out of pain and used pain meds of various types. A year later I had my 1st tkr. You are much younger and the tumor hasn't had as long to develope so you may have a whole different time table. Where are you located and who will be doing the surgery and the big question, how much experience does he have with pvns. If he hasn't handled this brfore, get a second opinion or get to an ortho oncologist or equivalent to handle the tumor. My current surgeon knows exactly what to look for and how to remove it.........and that isnt even foolproof. He visits with the ortho/oncologist that did my synovectomy daily. Good luck
    • Posted

      I live in Carlsbad, it's in California. I had several referrals sent to Orthos, which a lot of them didn't know what it was or how to treat it. I went to san diego sports medicine and orthopedics. He knew exactly what it was. He said I have been misdiagnosed this whole time. So I was somewhat relived that he knew what if was after me being in pain and swollen for over a year. I feel that he will do well. I hope. I can't stand the fact of being in so much pain . I get Norcos but they aren't even working anymore and my Dr. Won't give me anything else. So I just Deal with it
    • Posted

      I took Oxycontin for awhile but hated it. I have been on a combination 30 mg MS Contin which is time release and 10/325 hydrocodone. Icing helps some. Stay away from the tendency to t grow heat on it as it will just cause more pain. When I had the synovectomy insurance bought me a cyrocuff. Its like a cooler with a pomp and hoses. You fill the tank with ice and small amt of water, wrap the cuff in a towel so the bladder doesn't. Touch your bare skin. Then wrap The bladder around the knee. It pumps ice water around the leg continually. I sure hope you get some tell a f soon. When my tumor broke originally my knee was swollen almost 5" larger than my go9d one and the blood started backing up in my leg and then into my abdomen. On top of that i had a trip to Chicago and San Fransico the way 10 days and another trip to San Fransico just before Christmas plus a grandsons wedding the week after. Not having a clue what it was and all the swelling and bleeding I just assumed I had sometype blood related cancer. So did my dr. I had thousands of $$$$ worth of blood tests trying to find out what kind and how long I ad to live. In the meantime it was a whole lot of head nodding and hand wringing........but no answers. I would sure ask your Dr to revisit your pain meds and do ice often and elevate so your leg is just above your heart
    • Posted

      I do alot of cold on it. The ice gets too cold so I do a lot of frozen blueberries and peas. It feels really good. I asked my primary care Dr. For something a little stronger as the norcos weren't working thar great anymore. I need stronger mostly at night because I hardly ever sleep because of it. She will not give me anything stronger because she said I will just get used to it as well etc. It's so frustrating, I'd rather not have to take anything at all but I'm suffering and nobody understands. My left knee has started to swell also and is starting to hurt so I am wondering if I have it in both knees.
  • Posted

    Anyone else on here with a previous pvns experience? I would like all of the advice I can get.
    • Posted

      Hey breaun so I am 24 years old and was diagnosed with pvns in both my knees last year. I was battling knee pain for about 3 years and it wasn't to bad I played a lot of sports and lifted weights so thought it was normal. but after a bad car accident my knees really became screwed up. It got to the point that my knees would be unbearable with pain and constantly be swollen. I started to see my ortho who just thought it was synovitis and drained my knee and told me I was going to be okay. Unfortunately I was not okay bc I was back in his office with my knees swelled up. For 6 weeks staright I was getting 110ccs of fluid drained out of each knee and the doctor couldn't believe his eyes they say a healthy knee only has about 5ccs of fluid in it so I was 100 times over the limit. He did a Mri and didn't mention anything to me but he did tell me the only way to fix this problem is to do surgery an clean out both knees. At first I didn't op for surgery bc I thought he was just a surgeon trying to make a pretty penny on the count of I was in a huge car accident. So after a year of pure toture I decided to do the surgery. I took a lot of ibuprofen just to get by in work and did countless hours of pt which was pretty much pointless bc I had so much pain an very little range of motion to even move my knee. So I did back to back keyhole surgery and unfortunately the doctor told me after biospys that I had pvns in both knees. He told me he thinks he got everything out and they been doing monthly check ups on me. But I will competly honest with you I wish I did the surgery as soon as he suggested it. I am now close to 7 months post op and doing sooooooooo much better. I really focused on strengthening my legs and knees bc they became so weak and basically had to relearn how to properly walk bc I changed my gait over the year due to pain. Don't get me wrong I still am not a 100 percent and still do get pain here and there not nearly as close to what I've been thru. There were nights I would cry to sleep bc I would constantly wake up due to pain. I still ice daily and take very warm Epsom salt baths which seem to help. I will never be able to do the sports I love or lift heavy weights but I'm okay with that as long as I dont deal with pain the rest of my life. Everyday is a new day and I just try to stay positive and hope this will never come back. I just continue to do everything I need to do and I know after your surgery you are going to do great like me! I hope this helps and excuse my typo mistakes I'm typing this whole thing on a smartphone lol. Take care and if you have any other questions plz don't hesitate to ask this forum was great when I was down and depressed and listen to old fat guy and was a huge help! God bless you and take care
    • Posted

      Thank you for the info. Yes old fat guy is a lot of help as well and has been educating me on this whole thing. I've been really upset about it. Same as others nobody knew what was really wrong and kept telling me I had a sprain in my ACL and a tear in my pcl. But as it kept getting wrose and my leg and knee getting so swollen, I just knew there had to be something wrong and that I needed to go to an orthopedic and wanted another MRI. I finally got to go to my appointment for orthopedic last week and that's when he told me what I really have. I feel confident in him as this place is really good and deals with all kinds of joint issues. I was like finally and was in hopes people would stop thinking I was mental as if I were trying to find something wrong with me. But at the same time they could clearly see I could barely walk at times. It sucks it all sucks and I'm scared about the surgery. How was your whole experience from start to finish of surgery of you don't mind me asking?
    • Posted

      Surgery wasn't to bad honestly I walked out of the hostipal both times with a limp. I didn't need crutches both times bc keyhole surgery is usually outpatient. ICE is going to be your new best friend I was icing like crazy honestly for the first 3 months. What help me a lot to was doing cold to hot cold to hot. The first couple weeks wasn't to bad it was painful but I didn't even use narcotics bc I didn't like how they made me feel. I would take 2 800mg Ibprofeun a day. The worst part was was physical therapy that was the most painful part about the entire situation bc I had to rebuild all the strength back into my legs. Like I mention before it really does get better week by week but there are going to be days were you have setbacks and a lot of pain but that's normal and it gets better. There were days were I would be depressed and freak out bc I was in pain an thought the pvns was coming back. But it does get better and I have been doing a lot better. There are still days if I work a long shift where my knees feel sore and stiff but I ice and take a hot Epsom salt bath and that helps a lot. What truly helped is working on flexibility in my legs. Like I said I still do work on strength and flexiabilty and I take it one day at a time
    • Posted

      Thank you for the info. I'm getting my surgery next month on the 23rd and I'm just really nervous about it and what to expect. I've been in so much pain with this, that I hope to be out of pain after I get the surgery. Well after I recover from the surgery that is. I can't take nsaids, I have g.i reactions to them so I can't take ibprohen. I hope it's not that bar when they go in there. I've had the pain for year and a half and have been misdiagnosed this whole time, up until a week ago

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