Vaginal Atrophy

Susie

 girl where do you get your organic coconut oil is it well.ca

I am from Canada 

Please tell me

sheila, I am in the US, but supermarkets and health food stores sell it here. Just read the label to make sure it's organic. You don't want the least expensive one.

If you want to use it as a vag suppository you need to refrigerate it, then carve out whatever size or shape you need. It melts immediately. Smells good too.

I get my coconut oil in Costco or Wal-Mart here in Ontario ..it's organic and cold pressed virgin

HI suki

im speaking to my gp next week to get prescribed some treatment for VA. is the estriol for internal use ?

im looking for an internal treatment but ideally the weakest to start off with, are you aware of which is the weakest ? many thanks x

Yes the estriol cream is for internal use - the cream is called ovestin cream and it comes with an applicator for inserting internally. Estriol is known as the weaker of the oestrogens found in the female body but is particularly effective for vaginal atrophy and urinary problems.

ruth, I use a cream with no applicator. Just a pea sized blob of the estradiol cream on the finger and inserted just at the vag opening. Very simple. No discomfort, though I am now using it only twice a week. Every night started to cause burning. 

Absolutely use coconut oil. Very soothing. I keep mine chilled and use as a suppository on the non hormone cream nights. Through experimentation you'll find what works for you.

You'll get plenty of info here.

ruth, I can't insert anything, not even a capsule of Vit E, without using coconut oil for lube. Otherwise it feels as though it is stuck to my skin and very painful. Coconut oil will be your friend.

Hi Ruth

the most important advice I can give you is if you need to stop the Vagifem due to the applicator, make sure you have one of the creams Estrace, Estradiol on hand to use as if we stop the hormone......the discomfort comes back and takes awhile to feel good again. I tried to stretch out the Vagifem to every 5th day and when I did the discomfort started to come back.....needless to say I will not do that again and realized that this truly is life long.  I just don't understand why some woman suffer from AV and others don't......what caused us to have this?

HI wendy,

Hard to say why some women get very miserable vaginal atrophy. We are all losing our estrogen as we approach menopause so it has to effect the majority of women you would think. Then when the periods end that nice estrogen production that kept us so healthy down there is about gone. They say blood flow is very important to this area to keep it alive. One of them use it or lose it deals. Just saying maybe the women that have kept themselves sexually active to keep that blood flow happening down there regularly has helped them a bunch. Then there is the women that just don't say how bad they feel downstairs. Reports show many women are effected by this but never talk to their doctor about it or seek any help because they find the issue embarrassing. One cannot help wondering how many women are walking around out there suffering and feel they can't talk to their own doc so just live out the rest of their life with that discomfort hoping someday it will just go away. I agree with you on the use of estrodial or estriol creams. I use a mixture of both. Keeps that area free from these problems I see so many women on this board suffereing with. 

ruth, I don't use an applicator as my cream is applied on a finger tip at the vag opening, but if I had to I would put the oil on it or you can just "pave the way" by inserting a small amount of chilled oil before inserting the applicator. You'll have to experiment. You will read here how varied women's problems and solutions are in their attempts to deal.

So glad you saw your doctor today....what was the outcome?  Did she switch to cream?

wendy

let us know what your doctor advises you to do this morning.

wendy

Hi Ruth

yes the Vagifem you were on does make vaginal area better..healthier as will the cream I'm sure as I believe both are good for AV.  Once we have Atrophic Vaginitis we have it for life...unfortunately.  There is no cure....thankfully though there is  Vagifem and creams that help us to have quality of life.  I cannot imagine not having these meds.  Let us know how you do with the creams......many ladies use them and are able to with or without applicator.

Thank you for sharing

Wendy

Hi Ruth

i asked my GYN how long I needed to be using the Vagifem and was told this is the way of life for me.  Also if you try to stop the Vagifem or creams you will find the discomfort comes right back......that's what happened to me when I tried to stretch out the days to less than 2x weekly.  I had hoped to be on Vagifem for awhile hoping it would heal the AV........but I guess not.

suki, I must be a bit like your mom. I was diagnosed with AV at 67 and only as a result of going for my last pap smear which was nearly impossible because of the discomfort.  I wasn't in any pain otherwise and was hell bent on avoiding hormones because of my sister's cancer after being on HRT. I still don't have any pain, just a vague itch which I am working on with the probiotics after a round of flagyl. I'm sure many women went through their post menopausal years without the sex as it was too uncomfortable, as many women here have reported. It would certainly explain why so many men had mistresses in the past!

The doctor who initially diagnosed me prescribed premarin and was full of dire warnings. When I questioned her further she backed off on the warnings. Why I don't know. Had she given me some statistics to read I would maybe have reconsidered. I even asked her for websites. I found this site, myself, learned about the Mona Lisa and was waiting to hear about results of those who tried it. I'm no longer considering it an option as my doc is not recommending it plus I'm dealing with LS.

I have not had any bleeding, but it makes sense that some women would if skin is splitting. 

ruth, did your doctor not explain this to you? I swear the biggest problem is lack of communication. Doctors seem so reluctant to discuss facts. Personally, I want to hear as much as possible. Better yet I want to read about it rather than try to remember what the doc said.

I remember asking my doctor 3 years ago if it was possible that it wouldn't get worse and she did not say otherwise despite the fact that she was recommending premarin. Future problems were "possible" rather than "highly probable". But maybe further problems aren't. I still haven't figured that out. Those of us with them may be part of a small minority.

How on earth are older people getting married? Is it strictly platonic?

The nursing homes I have been in are 95% female. Are you referring to nursing homes or assisted living? That's what we call them in the US. Assisted living facilities have individual apartments and you have to be at a certain level of independence to move in. Nursing homes are for those who cannot care for themselves and the facilities accept Medicare and Medicaid. Assisted living is paid out of pocket. Only a small % of people can afford them.

Either way, I can't imagine much sexual activity going on in either one. I have spent time in both with family members. My aunt used to sit in her wheelchair in the hall of the nursing home holding hands with someone else's husband. The wife was not happy when she visited. He was soon transferred to the alzheimer's unit. It was sad for my aunt, but she carried on.

I am referring to all types of housing for older people. assisted living. I am just reporting what the managers (with whom I work closely) of these facilities say. Just google it and you will see lots of articles on the problem. E.g. “since residents don't have to worry about getting pregnant, they also tend not to worry about practicing safe sex. As a result, rates of STDs in nursing homes are going through the roof”. In the U.K. we have had to develop guidance for nurses and care workers on how to deal with this issue. Humans are very sexual creatures and that desire doesn’t stop when we are in our 70s or 80s. Of course there must be many who, due to physical disability, are unable. I know there are more women than men in such places - perhaps the men take their pick!

I have heard of the STD numbers increasing in the older population rather than the younger one, but I didn't realize they were THAT old. Well, clearly those of us with AV issues will not be taking part when we get shipped off to the home. 

Currently by age 85 women outnumber men 5 to 2. From my personal observations I would have said it's even higher. 

ruth, this us my first time using hormone cream for AV and according to the gyn the area is responding well. I think "curing" AV would be like curing aging...it doesn't happen. Depending on the severity I think we are told to use it every night for a certain amount of time, then less frequently after that. If you were to stop using it I assume the atrophy would continue. I didn't use hormones when I was first diagnosed 3 years ago as it caused me no problems. That doc did not fully communicate that the tissue would just continue to get worse, only that it "could".

The hormones slow the progress of the AV. Apparently some of us produce more estrogen after menopause than others, but I don't think any women's bodies remain as they were when ovulating.

In my case the cream started to burn so I am now using it twice a week only. So far so good. I suspect I would also have problems with an applicator.

I will try to post a link to an informative video clip I just found, but the moderator usually blocks these so I will PM it to you. I wish I had seen this video 3 years ago, I found very little info then.

Hi Beverly

could you please PM me the video you mentioned to Ruth.  We can't get too much information that for sure......thank you

Wendy

Hi Ruth

i hope the cream will be better for you...I'm sure it will.  Good news that the Atrophy looks better....and that you stopped the bleeding!  I sure wish I knew why some women have this and others don't.  I will watch the video that Beverly sent.  Keep us posted in how the cream is working for you.

The doctor should have a small enough speculum that won't be so uncomfortable. At my last exam my doc used a baby's speculum. I didn't know such a thing existed! You have to be a little less compliant or a lot of doctors just don't listen. I have told them in the past I would not have an internal because it clearly tears the skin. If the point is to heal and they just go in and make things worse what good is that?

Hi Ruth

We are all here for each other which is a blessing.  You will be helping others in the future as well.  I was so greatful when I found this blog on AV!  It was comforting to know that I was not alone.....even though there doesn't seem to be too many ladies with this!  Did you try the cream last night?  If it burns inside it is probably due to an opening in your skin where she put the instrument in.......that should heal intime along with your vaginal walls. It took me several weeks before I felt normal again...but I did get there.  Sometime I feel some discomfort if I do a lot of walking and it's the day that I do second Vagifem of the week.  I will watch the video this afternoon!

i wish you well Ruth....keep in touch!

Wendy

Hi Ruth.....yes I'm afraid we may have to use either the creams or Vagifem or for some the Mona Lisa Treatment but that is not good for all and is not covered on Insurance and is expensive...plus don't know long term...however some women have to have the treatments and seems to work for them.  I'm just waiting to learn long term results and for the insurance companies to cover it for AV patients.  I'm thinking we will need to continue to medicate that area.....until someone finds a cure.

thank you Ruth........have a nice day! 🌷

Wendy

ruth, didn't your doctor tell you where to put it? Go with a pad next time and write down whatever she says. It is sometimes overwhelming as you're thinking about the 2nd comments when they are on the 5th. 

If you haven't read it already google the latest AARP newsletter article on menopause and how much doctors are NOT taught. It's disheartening, but will give you more confidence to start questioning doctors and taking notes that you can verify, discuss or dispute later.

suki, I have been pondering that for years now. Wouldn't using one basically just give you a view of the cervix? Unless the speculum were clear how do they see the vaginal walls?

I assumed they were still metal. Can't say that I looked at it. Wouldn't metal be more conducive to being cleaned than plastic? Heck, everything is on you tube, maybe they have a vaginal exam!

I also had abnormal cells many years ago. I believe they took a sample at the same time they burned, froze or whatever they did to the cervix. I don't remember an endoscope then, but it was so long ago I barely remember it happening.

Hi beverley, would you mind sending me the video on Av pkease.

sounds like i need to see my Gp to discuss treatment. i was diagnosed with Av approx 2 years ago by a gynae after a bad infection. Smears and sex had been painful for a while and id just been using different lubricants but they were causing burning. Vagifem was prescribed but for short time use. Ive been managing just using lubricants but think i need something else as they all cause burning or dont stop all the discomfort. i was unaware that it progresses if you dont continually treat it. i really dont like the idea of using hormone treatments at all. I will try the coconut oil too and i drink soya milk. thank you in advance. ps is av the same as va ?

Tezes, I'm not sure what video you are referring to. Looking back I see I sent one to Ruth 3 months ago, but I don't remember it or where I found it. Maybe Ruth saved it on her computer.

I also wanted to avoid hormones when I was diagnosed with AV as my sister had breast cancer and the AV wasn't causing any problems other than when I had exams. I went three years more with no hormone use and still was not especially bothered by it. Then I was diagnosed with LS (an autoimmune disease) due to low estrogen (according to my gyn). I wasn't aware of that either. There is no avoiding using the cream now. I am using small amounts of estradiol cream nightly and have to use steroid cream for the LS. My best advice to you is to use a hormone cream as not using it can lead to more serious problems. Many women gets serious UTI issues as a result of the AV. I don't but the LS is not curable and can also be serious..

Look for info on estriol online. It is a weaker hormone and may help you. I am considering switching to it, but it is much more expensive as it is not covered by my new health insurance.

Using lubricants is fine. I still use coconut oil and my gyn recommended vaseline because of its PH.

I have never used Vagifem.

Hi Beverly. Just to let you all know that im still here. Just going through a lot at the hosp at moment. Will be back with you all shortly,. Hi to Suki girl as well. Hope you are all well. Best wishes Ruth

Haven't forgotten about you, Ruth. Assumed you went in for a hysterectomy and were recovering. Hope things are under control.

Best wishes!

Thanks Beverly.Having some treatment done first then working my way to a hysterectomy. Be glad when all over. Hope you are ok and coping with your problems. Best wishes. Will be in touch asap

Hi Ruth,

To quote someone far more intelligent than myself, “That which does not kill us, makes us stronger.” Hang in there!

I'm swimming in a pool of ignorance re LS, but otherwise OK.

B.

Hi Beverly, i seem doomed to get conditions that the medical world knows little about and cannot help me. First vulvodynia, then vaginal atrophy now a very obscure and rare condition called Kienbock's disease or avascular necrosis of the lunate. Basically one of the small bones in the middle of my wrist (the lunate) has lost its blood supply and has died. The bone will slowly decay until it leaves a space and a very unstable and painful wrist. No one knows what causes it and there is no cure (you cannot restore blood supply). Various things have been tried with varying success but so few people get it that they don't really know what works. My best bet at the moment is to wear a wrist brace to stabilise the wrist and reduce the pain so that i can function normally on a daily basis and use that hand. Eventually I will have to have a major op to either insert a metal plate or remove the whole row of bones in the wrist. But, you know, it isnt life threatening, its in my left wrist and i am right handed and i get to get other people help me carry things!

Good grief, Suki, that name sounds like a malady from outer space! Glad you explained and am sorry you have it. But you are just proving that Nietzsche was correct! Soon you'll be superwoman!

I know a woman who had steel plates in each wrist. She is elderly and broke each of them due to falls. It is inevitable that the older we get chances are some things go wrong. Built into the machine. I just wish people who can send spaceships to far distant planets could figure out more of what causes our physical malfunctions. Isn't there more money in curing disease that photographing Mars?? Just sayin'.

Ah ... man's insatiable thirst for knowledge. We probably know more about space than we do the human body!