What are you willing to give up to pee like a race horse?

Posted , 13 users are following.

Dear BPH Sufferers:

One common issue with BPH is the ability to naturally pee like we did when we were young and carefree. With that said, what would you be willing to give up to pee like that again?

Dave

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  • Posted

    Hi Dave! Glad you are continuing to do well. I think it is important to mention that your prostate, like mine also, was (is) morbidly large at 300 cc. This size restricts our options to either a simple prostatectomy or CIC. I have opted for the latter over these past 3 years but would have done the SP already had it not been for my other problem right now ( scrotal nerve pain from a failed varicocele procedure) which first needs to be resolved.

    For men with BPH but much smaller prostates there are other good options besides a SP. In many cases their prostates are not all that large (<100cc) but their peeing problems are just caused by a median lobe that blocks the bladder neck. So a simple procedure like FLA (very expensive though) can solve that problem for them and restore an excellent flow without a major surgery.

    But I do agree with you that at 70 years of age it is time to compromise on some of our youthful advantages. I have enjoyed an active sex life for nearly 50 years but it is unrealistic and selfish of me to expect to continue at that level into my 70s and 80s. Personally I get almost as much enjoyment now from a good bowel movement!! Also there is the worry of developing prostate cancer as I age further. By getting my prostate removed that worry is greatly reduced.

    So congratulations to you on your bravery and good outcome. I hope to join you if and when I get my scrotal nerve pain problem solved.

    Howard

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    • Posted

      Hi Howard:

      I have been thinking about you lately. I see you are planning and calculating things out. Been watching your struggles with that nerve. Hated to hear that. Get it cleared up and then make the next big move. As discussed before, if you are coming my way, let me know. Would look forward to meeting you and your wife in person.

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  • Posted

    Being able to pee is like being able to breath.

    You don't normally pay attention to it, you just do it.

    Now..........if someone puts a plastic bag over your head, it becomes pretty friggin' important QUICK......

    It's the same for peeing......until your sitting on a toilet, straining.....trying to just push out just a a shot glass of pee.....and anyone else in the bathroom says, "Do you want me to call for help for you?", because your making more noise than a woman giving birth.......yeah......THEN it's important.

    I have retrograde ejaculation after GL.......I don't really like it....put that is a price I paid.......

    And "it" hasn't been used for much else than peeing in the last year or so....... a limp wee-wee is easier to control anyway.............so....

    I'd like that fixed, but we'll see what the Dr says next month........

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    • Posted

      Hi John:

      Excellent analogy. While we would normally not think of peeing (natural function), it just takes one episode of straining, or full-on retention, to put us into a panic state. Way too many midnight runs to the ER because I was locked up. Taking away the freedom of not having that one bodily function makes your quality of life go down the tubes. My goal was to get my normal back. I got it back plus some. I walked into bathroom at work this morning around 11:30. I had not peed since 6:00 AM. Guy at the urinal is dribbling away. I step up and void in less than 5 seconds. Wash my hands, leave, and the guy is still standing there. My doctor promised me a garden hose and he delivered.

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    • Posted

      While "garden hose" might be a stretch for me, I'll admit I could at lease write my initials in the snow! Maybe even put out a small fire........ok, very small.......But by golly, I'm EMPTY when I'm done!!

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  • Posted

    At this point I can say, NOTHING I pee well for now. If I was put in a position of needing to get it done, I would reluctantly accept RE.

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    • Posted

      I hear you. Along the line we are all going to give up something. I like what Howard said above about finally "compromising on some of our youthful advantages." To a fault, in some cases, we guard and protect our youthful functions, but then turn around and accept some treatment that has terrible side effects. If our youthful functions are so important to us, then why are we not thinking of our urethra, nerve bundles, bladder neck, and sphincters, when deciding on that less invasive procedures, or that magic pill? These are four very important items we should be protecting and preserving. If we do this, the rest will take care of itself.

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  • Posted

    Howard and Dave, having a 300 g prostate-12 times normal, putting you health and bladder/Kidneys at such risk of failure should be considered a crime of your doctors and yourself(if new it) in advance. Of course simple prostatectomy was the only effective surgery for you. But for any smaller prostates there are plenty of less radical options. 135 g is still treatable with PAE. In fact, at age 89 probably the only good option. TURP us too risky at that age and not approved for prostates larger than 80 g albeit Urologists will undertake such surgery out of greed and ignorance.

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    • Posted

      Hi Gene - For me that is an interesting story. But first, only having one choice was a blessing. Had I had other choices early on, I would have tried them like most guys here, and who knows what experiences I would have had. As a result, I have had no meds and their side effects, no bands or beads, no roto-rooter jobs, etc. I would have been younger and cared more about "youthful" priorities. My priorities would have been just like most on this forum.

      As for the story, like most 50 year olds back in the day (2007), I dutifully saw my second Urologist (first was a vasectomy in '91). I had no symptoms and was just doing what medically we are encouraged to do when we hit that age. After testing, my PSA was high. After the finger wave, I was told I had a large and firm prostate. Doctor attributes this to my enlarged prostate and we do nothing. A year later we do it again and same results. This time he wants to do a biopsy. Ignorant and concerned, I agreed. Results were benign. The following year, we do the same routine again and same results - benign. Now, I am getting tired of being a pin cushion and stopped seeing a Uro for the next 10-years. Again, no alarming symptoms other than a weak stream, which I chalked up to a possible bashful bladder, and an enlarged prostate. I never strained to pee. Actually, I had to relax to just let it flow. No pushing. Again, bashful bladder and a large prostate. Absolutely no other symptoms. Life, to me, was normal.

      Speeding up 10-years to 2018 (last summer), I all of a sudden started having full-retention issues. What the heck! Went to a new Uro who only wanted to teach me how to manage my symptoms by self-cathing (terrible experience). Fired him. I have always had a moto - Don't treat the symptoms, rather fix the problem. So now I needed to understand my "problem," which led to two other Uros, and a valuable MRI with contrast. My prostate was measured at 265g. How I ever made it from normal to 265 is beyond me, especially after hearing all the guys in this forum, but I did nonetheless. So, two Uros later, I have what you pointed out, and that was one choice. The huge mass that was pushing up into my bladder needed to be removed. No shrinking (beads), no squeezing (bands), no trimming (TURP), etc. It just needed to be taken out and disposed of. Here was the "fix" to my problem, and I was going to have my "garden hose" restored, which over the years, and become a cocktail straw. What a blessing to have one choice and it was going to solve my problem where I could then say I do not have a BPH problem anymore.

      Was my journey a crime? Perhaps, but I would not have wanted to take any other route now looking back. Was the multiple Uros criminal? Well, we could argue about Dr. Pin Cushion and Dr. Stick Yourself with a Hose (both fired). It is funny how we flinch at perceived "radical" procedures, and from what I have read, my recovery was much better that most of the non-radical procedures I read about on this forum. Hence why I am here to share my experiences with the second most radical procedure for us BPH sufferers. The one that scares the crap out of most men. I relish being the exception to the rule.

      Dave

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    • Posted

      Hi Gene - 3 years ago I went into acute retention like Dave and like Dave I have a 300gm prostate. My uro wanted to do a robotic SP on me but I was reluctant as I could not speak with anyone who had it. So instead I taught myself to do CIC which I do to this day. Back then my kidneys showed signs of stress (hydronephrosis) and my bladder wall was a mess. But CIC has rehabilitated my kidneys and bladder to good health as jimjames promised it would. I even have reasonable natural voids but still need to CIC 4 times a day. I don't mind CIC that much as it is easier than flossing my teeth. But Dave's story has inspired me to do the robotic SP which I would have done by now except I have other immediate health issues. I just wanted to point out that CIC is a good option for men to keep their kidneys and bladder healthy if they do not want to do any procedures at all.

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    • Posted

      HinDave, I just read your forum,and it is most interesting. May i ask how old you were when you had this procedure done? I 'm 89 and having similar problems and was think along the same procedure you had done,prostatectomy.this is what you had done right?I also am feed up with URO"s.

      thanks for this info. Would you PM this info to me?

      Thanks,

      frank,

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    • Posted

      The Uro who did my GL many years ago said that he did GL for a patient of 92 with a very large prostate 'as it is a very gentle procedure'

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    • Posted

      Hi Frank - Just sent you a private message. Yes, I had a Simple Robotic Prostatectomy performed, not a Radical Prostatectomy. There is a big difference between the two. If you are able to contact my Urologist, I think you would be pleased with him. I hope my message gives you the information you are looking for.

      Dave

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  • Posted

    No, Howard,

    CIC is not a good option. I was forced to use for a few weeks before mY PAE. You always wind up with UTI, not such a thing as sterile catheter. It cost money to buy catheters, hurts like hell and causes bleeding. Don't try to convince anybody on this forum that it's a long term solution for the BPH treatment. It's not. Men resort to it in different cases when the bladder doesn't work properly, after some cancers or paralysis of the bladder muscles.

    It's almost an impossible procedure for working folks.

    REgarding yours and Dave huge prostates let me not believe your both that you were asymptomatic till your prostate has grown to the size of the orange. Your UROs and you yourself brought the situation to the critical stage of retention and humongous prostate became treatable only by radical or simple prostatectomy, which always was effective, and safe but requires a long stay in the hospital and recovery time. That's why TURP was invented. You don't need to stay long time in the hospital, suffer at home for 3-6 month.

    Now you are trying to convince everybody with the prostate less that 100g that SP is the only way to go.

    BTW GL is not a gentle procedure. IT's almost the same as TURP, but doesn't allow to take the material for biopsy for cancer presence, because it's all eviscerated by the green laser. Incontinence and ED, RE are as often as with TURP. The part urethra inside prostate is totally destroyed , strictures are common due to the long Folly catheter placement in the urethra.

    Any other nice advice for us BPH sufferer with underdeveloped prostate of less than 150 g gland?

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    • Posted

      Sorry Gene - with all due respect I disagree with almost everything you write here. I have done over 4000 self-caths over 3 years and had only 2 mild UTIs. I travel and lead an active life and CIC has little effect on it. CIC is a viable and easy option for BPH sufferers as many men on this forum will attest. It has no side effects. I take full responsibility for my current situation. My uros wanted to butcher me over the years and I declined. It is not their fault. You are entitled to your opinions and they are very welcomed but please do not try to diminish my experiences. We are all very different with our BPH problems and what works for some men may not be the best solution for other men. We all have to find our own way and be masters of our own domains and not blame anyone else. Good luck to you. Howard

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    • Posted

      Hi Gene:

      I would like to address the recovery time for a Simple Robotic Prostatectomy. I was released from the hospital 24-hours after having the procedure. I had 6 small incisions in my abdomen area and a sewed up bladder. I left with a catheter and foley because the bladder needs to heal. Along with the 6 small incisions in my abdomen, the bladder is an access point to the prostate. With this route taken, the bladder neck, sphincters, prostate nerve bundles (which are on the outside of the prostate lobes), and urethra, are never touched (this is a good thing because I do not care what you take or do, your decision should take these fours things into consideration). When the inside mass of the prostate is removed, the prostate lobes are left intact.

      At home, I never had to take anything stronger than Tylenol and Motrin to manage pain. My mid-section was the sorest for the first 4-days. After that, each day it got better. Also for the first 4-days I took a stool softener so I would not have to strain for a bowel movement (mid-section was sore). After 10-days on the catheter, so the bladder could heal (by the way, the bladder does not have pain receptors), I went back to the doctor to have the catheter removed. He first had my bladder checked to make sure it had healed and there were no urine leaks. All was good and he removed the catheter. I walked out after 10-days a free man. I needed not meds, catheters, or anything else. Garden hose was in place and I was about to test it.

      My wife and I went to lunch at a local restaurant after the Dr's appt. Once done, my wife said she wanted to use the restroom before we left. I thought, why not, I'll give it a try also. I went into the stall and no sooner could I pull it out, I overshot the toilet with a forceful stream I had not seen in like forever. I even vocally said "Wow! I walked out of that restroom and approached my wife with the biggest smile on my face. After 10-days, I had immediate results. I also went home and tested out the erection and orgasm. Thumbs up!

      For the first month, I had to be careful coughing hard or trying to fart, as a little leakage would pass as I strained. This went away after the first month. I did not have to wear a diaper or do anything else to manage. I had no urgency or any other issues. I am now 8-months post my surgery and every time I pee, I hit the water on purpose just to see and hear the force of my stream because it amazes me. After surgery, and even today, I do not regulate my drinking of anything. I drink all the way up to bedtime and I take a glass of water to bed. It is hard to explain that I am not preoccupied with peeing anymore. It has reverted back to a natural thing. It no longer manages me.

      From what I have read on this forum, my recovery was much easier than many of the less invasive procedures, and I definitely do not suffer from the side effects of taking meds. I also do not have any post-procedure complaints, and I am not sitting here waiting on the promised improvements to appear. Mine were immediate and nothing has change since. As a matter of fact, I am betting I will never have to address this again before my end-of-life. My procedure was a long-term fix to a major BPH problem that I had. I no longer have BPH.

      Dave

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    • Posted

      Hi Gene - As for advice, I have none as it relates to a man's specific BPH situation and the smorgasbord of options they have available to treat BPH. All I do is share my experience with what I dealt with and the option I selected. I am sure there are other men here with <150g prostate that will share what they chose and how it worked out for them.

      As an educator, I value thought provoking questions that make us think. Peeing is an issue with BPH sufferers, and to be able to get peeing under control and at an acceptable function, every BPH suffering man will give up something to get there once it is restricted or taken away. I am curious to what the "something" is.

      Dave

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    • Posted

      Howard,

      some rare I agree with you in regard of everybody being entitled to own opinion and methods of treating his health. Have you read on this forum, how many BPH sufferers can't CIC themselves, are bleeding, experience excruciating pains doing it and would do anything for not to deal CIC. What if you work shifts, or teach. How you handle CIC in a public restroom. Do you carry them with yourself. How do you preserve the hygiene of CIC during the insertion. I am well trained, have a Ph.D and a good understanding of human anatomy due to a couple of years of medical school. Can't imagine that going forcibly with a plastic tube through two sphincters won't cause bleeding from enlarged prostate varicose arteries. Ask anybody who underwent any flexible cystoscopy,. Have they bled afterwards? I did, for days. There scientific studies and paper written that there is not such a thing as sterile CIC. There will be always some strains of bacteria and east leaving in your bladder. Let alone that growing prostate deforms your bladder neck. Thickened bladder wall doesn't recover when you CIC. Yes, you kidney are under less stress and failure but only temporary. I repeat CIC is a temporary way to go only nothing else is possible or forbidden by the health or very old age of the patient. With new methods even age is not an obstacle now, as we hear, that 92 year old was treated "gently" with GL ablation (burning the tissue inside the prostate capsule).

      Of course you are entitled to your own opinion and sharing your experiences. I hope everybody else will research internet or this forum and will make the right decision.

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    • Posted

      When I had my aortic valve replaced in 2012 I asked them if it was OK to do it as I had prostatitis at the time. They said it was not a problem but the theatre staff could not get a catheter in and had to use a supra pubic one. So home users should presumably also have a problem at such times and I would have thought also with extra large prostates. At that time mine would have been around 125 grms.

      I've had two flexible cystoscopies without any later bleeding and also many years ago a rigid cystoscopy without bleeding.

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