Going with Focal Laser Ablation for BPH

It is in chronological order BUT the order depends on whether you reply to the OP or to an individual poster or the OP who has replied to another poster. So there are many branches in each thread and each branch then has it's own order. In other words it's a mess. If you know who made the last post it's easy because you can just click on his name, go to the profile section, and read his posts in chronological order.

Jim

It can be hard to follow posts In here. Just have to stay on top of it.

Jim8

Its imposible to stay on top of a post from say yesterday in a 25 page  thread like this one. The post from yesterday could be anywhere in the thread. Most forums are chronological. You can reply to someone ( their post will be included as a quote ) and that reply will be at the end of the thread. Its not too bad when threads are short but you get to one like this one and forget it. 

Jim,

The software should put a link in each post that will take you the the previous post when you click on it.  A better idea may be, to number each post, and include the number of the referring post in every post.  Does anyone know how to get these ideas to the moderators ?

Thomas

Good idea's...

My PAE didn't really help ; however, I think it was due to the fact that I have an enlarged median lobe and not the doc, Ari Isaacson at UNC, whom I think is great and has done the second most in the US.

Rob.  Good evening.  PAE does not work all the time.  J12080 did not have a PAE.  He had FLA by Dr K.  Ken

Airman, my prostate was 125cc which is not necessarily  a double D cup as prostate go but I consider it larger in aspects of the prostates. I also had a larger median lobe. But I do know some men on this thread and some that have moved on that were once on this thread. I still have contact with them in tracking their progress. 

I am  curious,, how did you determine your prostate was its current size? Is it by MRI by ultrasound? I would strongly suggest that you find out the fact and do your research on all options, I would suggest you call Dr. k and ask all your guestions. Also there are about 8to 10 men that have had this surgery and these men will tell you directly about how and why they went this way and they will tell you of their outcome and recovery. 

I am over 18 months out and happy with my results in every way so far. My blockage wears both a pinching off the urethra and pushing up into the bladder at the neck. I think it was very enlightening when Dr. Karamanian could turn on his computer and show me this in black and white. Then the day after he show me the proof on that same computer the after film as proof that he did exactly what he said he would do with FLA to removing targeted tissue that was causing my problem. He did this first analysis at no cost to me as I uploaded him my MRI on his website. 

I hope olé this answers your questions Good luck.

There was a current discussion on FLA, including results of men with small prostates here;

https://patient.info/forums/discuss/recommendations-for-someone-living-outside-the-us-658071

Personally, I don't think we have a large enough sample size to predict results by prostate size but take the reports for what they are worth.

Jim

j12080: Also there are about 8to 10 men that have had this surgery and these men will tell you directly about how and why they went this way and they will tell you of their outcome and recovery. 

-----------------------

We are up to 25 men now and unfortunately the overall results are not as good as the first 8 to 10 men you mention. You might check out this thread here:

https://patient.info/forums/discuss/recommendations-for-someone-living-outside-the-us-658071

Jim

30cc from 3tMRI already sent to dr.K

 

25!? Sadly not a sample sized pool that inspires confidence. 

I’m going t address this with K focusing on the small prostate.

There are few complications with my prostate that have been revealed.  There are no  considerations like bladder neck cyst, prostatitis, bladder failure, (mild trebeculation) just a small 30cc prostate with a pinched urethra and bladder neck protrusion from the median lobe. 

Uro dynamics, kidney function, cystoscopy, blood tests, ultrasound and 3tMRI

any my data from doctors. F, W, or S? 

Have you considered Rezum?  Results are as good if not better than FLA across the board including sexual side effects, it's covered by insurance, passed phase III peer reviewed trials and shows durability a few years out. I've gone on the record saying there's not enough data to say FLA won't work on small prostates, but given the poor results with small prostates, I wouldn't bet my prostate that I'm right.

Jim

Jim

Yes I’ve considered rezum. I’m not in the USA, I will pay. 

I understand that the back up surgery if Rezum fails is TURP. Krikey!!

Is there data on small prostates and bladder neck protrusion with Rezum? 

Any info helps...thanks

There is nothing unique to Rezum that makes TURP the back up option.

TURP is a back up option for ANY procedure but not the only option. Other options are to re-do the procedure, try another procedure, try meds, self cath, etc, etc,

As far as I know, there is no reason Rezum would not work on smaller prostates but the best person to ask is a doctor who does Rezum and posts often in the Rezum forum under the name "JerseyUrology".

You can find him in this thread here:

https://patient.info/forums/discuss/rezum-have-you-had-this-done--499675?page=84&utm_source=forum&utm_campaign=comment-notification&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Patient%20Access%20EAP&utm_source=sendgrid&utm_medium=email#3207880

Airman, I think my prostate was about 55cc prior to surgery with similar conditions. Got up one or sometimes twice during the night but sometimes had trouble initiating the flow which is why I decided to do the FLA. Outcome had been very good since the procedure in February.The only change that I have noticed is reduced ejaculate during sex, I suspect this is because there is less prostate material to produce it. Been off Flomax for 8 weeks so sexual side effects from it are gradually deminishing. Overall very good result like most of the FLA group.

Rick

Hi Rick,

you are FLA patient  of February 2018  , me April  2018.  I have no record about any FLA patient  between us.  If somebody has info pls let me know. 

 Thank you Rick  for your info  I will add it  to my Excel  table.. 

My situation  is similar - change of my life  and return from Hell..

No  nocturia, no  drugs,  no incontinence, no CIC., no PVR .  ...  Only small complication  is  in current  weeks  some infection inside  ablated- dead tissues of   prostate, so I'm 2 weeks on  Bactrim .. All we have to be very  patient after FLA  , not like me " hero " . I started intensive work,  biking, work in garden ,  rebuild my house  ,e.t.c. And the inflamation is the  effect of it., I think , that simply  is  forbidden  to  irritate  prostate  with intensive activity - biking, motorcycling, sitting more then  8 hours a day, e.t.c.  During  3-6  months following FLA  its neccesary to be in relax mode with mild  activities. 

  In these days  is my situation better , no more pain  , but still  taking  Bactrim  according to prescripton of Dr. K.         

Some  important results from analysis  of my data are as follows : 

FLA is  not fully  satisfactory method in case of : 

1. previous  chronic Prostatitis 

2. too small prostate.  30 ml  and less

On oposite  side FLA  Is very effective in case of big median lobe  especially  with IPP effect ( intravesical protrusion of prostate ) , where other  methods have problems.. 

Bad luck is that here is too small  trial  data  ,  26  patients of Dr. K cannot be representative. 

 Have a good time, Stan     

“And the inflamation is the  effect of it., I think , that simply  is  forbidden  to  irritate  prostate  with intensive activity - biking, motorcycling, sitting more then  8 hours a day, e.t.c.  During  3-6  months following FLA  its neccesary to be in relax mode with mild  activities. “

Stan, these are interesting comments to me. Where did you hear or read this?

Hi Moto ,

Dr. K warned me after FLA operation  in  period  after FLA  to be in relaxed  mode.  No hard work , no irritation of prostate.   After getting  inflamation  here in Slovakia  ( it was few days after intensive biking )  I visited my Dr.  and he think  the main reason  of  my  inflamation  and following  swelling  of prostate is  this  "heroic" activity after FLA.  

Dr. K  reccomended me 6 weeks BACTRIM   treatment, and my local Dr.agreed with him  and warned me about  excesive activities   and  prescribed  BACTRIM  ( local name in Europe is BISEPTOL  ) .  Now  after 10 days  Im better but must fullfill  these  instruction  for another 2-3 months . As we know  the absorption of dead ablated tissues takes a time 3-6 months. 

B.t.w. enzymatic  treatment has effect for better  absorption of ablated tissue, too.  So  Im taking Wobenzym. . 

How is your situation now ?  

p.s.

Anyway  I red  recently about good  effects of another enzyme  Serrapeptase .

Has anybody from our BHP community   some experience with it ?   Pls share with us.  

 

Thank you , Stan  

Stan,

My situation is somewhat unchanged, maybe a little worse. I have had follow up MRI and it sounds like I have little “cysts or blisters” filled with fluid where the ablation were done.  A couple large ones blocking the urethra, and many smaller ones, described to me like a bunch of tiny grapes. Sounds like I am a first in this regard, but maybe there would be others if there was a second MRI done.

I was quite active pretty quick after my procedure, which is why I asked. I had not heard what you were saying before in terms of that affecting the prostate healing. Just don’t overdo things to cause any bleeding, etc. 

I am meeting with another Uro in a few weeks to discuss either a mini TURP or Rezum to open up the little cysts, as it sounds like that would really open things up for me after the FLA. But the first uro I met 3 months ago wanted to do a full TURP on me.

Good morning Moto, sorry your FLA did not go well either. I am curious, how were you able to get your insurance to approve another MRI?  It sure sounds like we both have the same thing going on. Does Dr K have any ideas what could have caused the cysts?

Thanks Joe

CONQUER INFLAMMATION WITH SERRAPEPTASE

By Zoltan P. Rona, M.D., M.Sc.

“As an anti-inflammatory, nothing surpasses the ability of Serrapeptase to safely stop inappropriate (sometimes it is needed) inflammation in its tracks. No matter the cause or the location (it even crosses the blood brain barrier), Serrapeptase gets to work stopping the inflammation. If that is not enough, it has the ability to dissolve any dead or non-living tissue that may be gumming up the works, particularly mucus and inflammation associated with pain.”

                                                                     Robert Redfern     Author, “The Miracle Enzyme”

highlevelwellness.ca/blogs/news/80706436-conquer-inflammation-with-serrapeptase

Serrapeptase is produced by bacteria in the gut of silkworms. In the concentrated form of a tablet or capsule, Serrapeptase acts as an anti-inflammatory and a pain blocker similar to aspirin, ibuprofen and other NSAIDS (non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs). Aside from this very desirable property there is growing evidence that Serrapeptase inhibits the build up of plaque in the arteries. Thus, it prevents atherosclerosis, arterial blockages, strokes and heart attacks. Unlike aspirin, ibuprofen and other NSAIDS, Serrapeptase does not cause stomach ulcers or gastrointestinal tract bleeding.How Serrapeptase WorksBecause of its protein chopping action, Serrapeptase helps thin out the fluids formed from injury, thus facilitating the drainage of these fluids. This speeds tissue repair and relieves pressure that causes pain. Serrapeptase also inhibits the release of bradykinin, a substance that induces pain.Serrapeptase is fibrinolytic which means it digests excessive amounts of the protein known as fibrin. Fibrin causes the blood to clot or become sticky. The more fibrin, the greater the risk of heart attack or poor circulation. If one is able to keep fibrin levels under control, one prevents excessive stickiness of the blood flow, hence heart attacks and strokes. This is one of the mechanisms by which one can dissolve atherosclerotic plaque with Serrapeptase.Serrapeptase only dissolves non-living tissue, leaving living tissue alone. Blood clots, cysts and arterial plaque are all gradually dissolved. Over 50 clinical trials from Europe and Asia attest to the ability of Serrapeptase to successfully treat conditions ranging from sprains, torn ligaments, post-operative swelling (edema), fibrocystic breast disease, deep vein thrombosis (DVT), carpal tunnel syndrome, ear, nose and throat infections and atherosclerosis. Serrapeptase literally digests inflammatory tissue.Serrapeptase was popularized by research done by the late and legendary Dr. Hans Nieper, an internist from Hanover, Germany who used this powerful enzyme to treat virtually all degenerative diseases, including cancer, autoimmune diseases, crippling arthritis, atherosclerotic heart disease and dozens of other disorders.Conditions and Discomforts BenefittedCancer: Serrapeptase can make other cancer treatments, both natural and conventional, work better. This is because it can dissolve the outer protective layers of cancer cells and tumors. This then enables the immune system, drugs or natural anti-cancer agents to attack the cancer cells.Proteolytic enzymes like Serrapeptase can stimulate the body to produce something called tumor necrosis factor (TNF). TNF has been shown to kill cancer cells and stop viruses from reproducing.Serrapeptase has been shownantibiotics i to improve the penetration of nto lung tissue. In a similar fashion, it can help anti-cancer drugs and natural substances penetrate deeper into cancer tissues.Cardiovascular Disease: Plaque in the arteries consists of fat, cholesterol, cellular waste products, calcium and fibrin. This non-living gunk can end up blocking coronary arteries leading to heart attacks. It can also obstruct crucial brain arteries leading to stroke and damage kidney arteries leading to high blood pressure. Many alternative health care practitioners to clean out the arteries have used intravenous chelation therapy but this involves 40 or more intravenous sessions of 2 hours or more at a fairly high cost. The only other alternative appears to be the insertion of stents or bypass surgery, an adventure that most people would like to avoid. Serrapeptase has been shown gradually dissolve the plaque that is associated with cardiovascular disease. It basically digests dead and inflamed tissue. It also reduces or eliminates the inflammation at the root of plaque formation. This process may take a year or longer, depending on the individual but it’s safe to say that anyone who suffers from any form of cardiovascular disease should be taking Serrapeptase on a regular basis. Cholesterol lowering drugs that cause liver damage, memory loss and muscle destruction are the wrong solution.Chronic Bronchitis: etc....

I will try  Serra.. and let you know later. Stan

Hello Joe,

I did not get approval for a second MRI, I paid for it. It was around $900. But my insurance is terrible, so I am paying out of pocket until a very high deductible is met anyway.

I have had three different reviews of my MRI now. Sounds like this is seen in some prostate cancer patients after FLA, but nothing is done about it because they are going after the cancer, not BPH. Dr K said he hasn’t seen this before, but I suspect that is because most people aren’t going back for a second MRI to see the results. 

Basically, they are all saying fluid has filled in the ablation areas and healed in an uncommon way.  I suspect this may be what is going on with the smaller prostates, but we would need to see more data to prove this.

I am still able to pee with Flomax, but seems to be getting worse, and a huge change from months 2-6 after the procedure, when I wasn’t using any drugs, and peeing like in my 30’s. 

Stan,

This Serrapeptase might be worth a shot, but in my case it might be too late. It has been since February 2017 that I had my procedure done.

I am traveling at the moment, but when I get home will look into this more.

Thanks for the info, sounds like you may be correct about what is going on. For the first couple of months my brother and I both were doing great. Then things just started to deteriorate. Now I am back where I was before, if not worse. I would like to get another MRI as well just to see if we have the same problems. If I can get somebody to order it up for me, I will let you know.

thanks Joe

Stan,

I have read the same patient reports and disagree with your analysis.

First, by your own admission, a 26 patient sample size is too small to be representative so your analysis based on previous chronic prostatitis and a small prostate size has to be viewed with skepticism and I believe when someone brought this up to Dr. K. (small prostate size) he didn't respond which suggests he hasn't reached that conclusion as well. As to "FLA is very effective in cases of big median lobe....", what is your definition of "very effective"? Yes, the majority of results are good but that is the case with all the procedures.

Comparatively, I don't see anything in the data so far that suggests FLA has any better results, or less sexual side effects, than any of the other less invasive procedures such as Rezum.

I also ask you to look up "confirmation bias" and ask if the shoe fits. There's a reason why we have double blind peer review studies because personal bias and investment are very strong forces even when medical professionals are involved. I commend you for the time and effort collecting and organizing data but beyond that I once again respectfully disagree on your interpretation.

My suggestion for anyone contemplating FLA is to wait until there is published trial data. But if you don't want to wait, then do not rely on Stan's, my own, or anyone else's unscientific analysis of only 26 patients. Go back to the FLA threads and read every single post by the men who have had the procedure and then make up your mind.

Jim

You might want to keep an eye of Aquablation as results are (no pun intended) starting to dribble in. I'd give it another year to see how it plays out in the field but it potentially has TURP like results with a much lower incidence of retro and better recovery time.

Jim

Yes, I would consider the Aquablation as well, but not sure I want to wait for that to be available. If I hadn’t seen decent initial results, I would be more gun shy about doing another procedure. Since three different doctors reviewed my MRI and came to similar conclusions, I probably don’t need much to open things up again post FLA. Just seems they have to “break” through the little cysts to get the fluid out.

Stan,

There have been some posts on this Patient web site about serrapeptase.  You can search for "serrapeptase" or try some links:

https://patient.info/forums/discuss/sinuses-vs-anxiety-298664

https://patient.info/forums/discuss/chronic-sinusitis-313405

https://patient.info/forums/discuss/help-for-alzheimer-s-sufferers--259648

Some of these have to do with sinus inflamation.  But the prostate is like a large sinus gland so similar methods may work  for both.  I do remember a post by one person saying his BPH symptoms were cured by serrapeptase. I don't remember what thread it was in though.

Thomas

Joe that is exactly what happened to me worked for a month or so and then got worse. Have you ever had  an explanation for that?

Jim

Stan: I have studied prostatitis considerably and have consulted with Dr. K on this matter. I believe failure for most focal laser ablations is due to prostatitis. Antibiotics are just a bandage and its effect is short lasting. To get rid of prostatitis, one must first get rid of calcifications including those of the microscopic acini of the prostate. Toxic metals including lead, mercury, cadmium, arsenic, aluminum etc are part and parcel of calcifications as they attach to them.  When a calcification is dissolved with an EDTA chelator there is often a release of bacteria including candida. But the real core of the issue is getting to the biofilm that bacteria produce to prevent our antibodies from destroying them. The biofilm is like a slime, a mucous secretion that antibiotics have difficulty in penetrating. For that you use a biofilm disrupter, in other words a systemic enzyme like Serrapeptase, protease and nattokinase. These agents will dissolve the protein, so that your own immune system will be able to attack the bacteria. At that point, various nutrabiotics such as wormwood, black walnut or grape seed extract will destroy the bacteria. At the same time, inundate your system with probiotics which will displace the bad bacteria in your prostate. Juice green organic juices such as cucumber, celery, sprouted sunflower and pea sprouts. These will add additional systemic enzymes for which you should feel immediate temporary relief from the prostatitis while at the same time improving your immune system and regulating your hormones. I am not a Doctor but did studybiochemistry and nutrition at a accredited University. My wife has an M.S. in nutrition and biochemistry from the same school. 

Stan...I gather you had a urinary tract infection. There are other things better than antibiotics to take. The 17 Levaquin (?) antibiotics I took wrecked havoc with my elimination (colon) for a period of time They may have been necessary after my procedure but I do believe other natural products could have been taken in conjuction with smaller doses of antibiotics.

In closing Dr. Karamanian is a gentlemen, ...a jewel of a person and I recommend him in a heartbeat to anyone interested in FLA for cancer or BPH.

Good morning Jim, sorry to hear yours did not work either. And no I have no explanation why this is happening to what seems like a fairly large percentage of guys who have the FLA. It is very depressing to say the least.

I am not convinced it has much to do with prostatitis, but to be fair I did send another sample to microgen yesterday, just to confirm if I do have a prostate infection or not.

I have also now been diagnosed with chronic Lyme disease, and have been prescribed several months of antibiotics,anti fungal meds, as well as two different meds that are supposed to disrupt the biofilms. They are similar to the serraraptase that Stan has been talking about. So who knows, if I do still have a prostate infection, perhaps all of these meds will help with that as well as the Lyme.

Joe

Joe, I agree that the link of FLA failures to prostatiis is very weak. Both due to very small sample size and the fact that a large number of men who have bph also have prostatitis to one degree or another so I would say it's more of an association than a cause. I think what we're finding with FLA is similar to what we find with all of the prostate reduction procedures. Some work well, some work OK, and some fail and even make things worse. The problem with FLA is that there isn't enough data yet to tell if it will have more or less failures than the other less invasive procedures like Rezum but from what I've read so far, if I had to make a choice today, money aside, I'd go for Rezum.

Jim

Hope it works for you Joe. Alls you can do is to keep digging. I think the 6 weeks of cipro

I took for prostatitis worked only for a while and is slowly coming back. Hoping for all of us that one day we can be bph free.

Jim

Thanks Jim I hope so to, but not getting my hopes up. But you are correct all we can do is keep trying.

Joe

Interesting you comment on Rezum being considered at least by you as "less invasive". One of my best friends just had the Rezum 90 days ago. They did five penetration through the inside of the Urethra back into the prostate on different sides of the Urethra and at different level of insertion and shot the steam thereby coagulating the tissue in the gland just as the tissue is calculated in the FLA procedure. I visited him at home a week later and he said he did not come home with a cath but had been back to ER twice to have a cath inserted and then wore the second one for four extra days. He did this at UT Southwestern by the department head.

He had answered an ad that was mailed to his house by the Hospital on a free men's health seminar and when he attend it was in a large ballroom with about 80 to 100 people attending. Several presentation were done on men's issues including a slide show on Rezum. He seems pleased with his results but will state it is not any less invasive than FLA as it does invade his urethra considerably. He feels that each Rezum patient will need a catheter when they go home because the swell occurs the same as with FLA. He did get retro as a results. I am sure that is a case of hitting the ejaculatory ducts. He is ok with it as sex is not a situation in his house that is a major issue. The good news is he is still a great putter so he is happy.

@j12..."interesting you comment on Rezum being considered at least by you as "less invasive".

--------------------------------------

Please re-read. I didn't say Rezum was "less invasive" than FLA, I simply lumped FLA and Rezum together in the category of "less invasive" procedures compared to TURP. This is commonly accepted.

Glad your friend had a good Rezum outcome and that it did not effect his putting.

Jim

Good morning my friends.  I have been trying to fellow the Rezum procedure and I don't know if you have found out the same has I.  Most of the Rezum procedures that have had good result were under 4 injections.  If the doctor goes at the top and the bottom of the prostate and leaves the center alone.  These men had good results and did not get retro.  I know one of the men was the one doctor from the TV show The Doctors.  He only had 2 injection just where the sphincter and the prostate meet.  He had good results and no retro.  A lot of the other men that have had it done seam like these doctor are over killing the prostate 10 or 12 injections.  I know it depends on the size but I think that is to much.  You friend had only 5 injections.  I don't know for sure but I bet they did a injection in the center.   I guess we all have to pick what we can deal with but I do feel that it is the doctors skill on the procedure that will have a better outcome.  Take care all  Ken  

Hi Jim,

I've been following this forum for probably a couple of years, since I ended up in the ER with AUR in the summer of 2016. Tried Flomax, Rapaflo, and discontinued due to side-effects. Have been doing CIC since then and researching every day about potential treatments for my 91G  obstructive prostate. Thanks for all the CIC tips, especially the "dive bomb" approach, which I think has helped me avoid UTI's! I had pretty much settled on FLA and was getting ready to make an appointment until the recent reports of not-so-great results, which scared me quite a bit. I've been going back and looking at some other alternatives that I had previously eliminated from my list, particularly Rezum and Urolift. I've watched a bunch of videos, and some of these Rezum docs are implying that their success rates are very high and rates of retro are low to non-existent. However, this is in contrast to some of the reports here of guys who did end up with retro. Do you suppose these outcomes are particularly operator-dependent? My doc in San Francisco just started doing the procedure in January and has only done about a dozen, with mixed results. I'm looking more for someone who has done at least a hundred. What do you think?

Regarding Urolift, I'm wondering if it is really reversible as they say (if it doesn't work). Also, I've read conflicting reports about whether the staples are stainless or titanium.

Last, though I really appreciate this Patient Info forum, I find it incredibly difficult to navigate around and search for historical comments; I wish they would make it more user-friendly!

Thanks for reading.

Best wishes,

Fred 

Hi Fred,

I share your concerns regarding FLA. I never thought there was enough patient data to make a conservative treatment decision but in light of some of the recent results even more so.

Rezum is not retro free, nor have we learned is FLA. From what I've read here, 10% retro seems like a reasonable expectation for retro if you go Rezum. I do think operator experience is important and personally wold look for a doctor who has done at least 100 and then I would question him on his success and retro rates.

It is confusing about Urolift. Apparently most of it is irreversible but the anchor cannot come out? That part bothered me as well but really haven't researched it that much. And yes, very hard to navigate here.

Rezum looks the best minimally invasive option at the moment if you're willing to accept a 10% chance of retro. Aquablation looks promising, but I'd give it a year until we have more data.

Jim

Jim

On the Urolift I was told that they are made of stainless still and a nylon sutures. They can be removed and does not stop any other procedure.  I have had mine for over 3 years Have a great day Ken.  

Hi Jim,

Thanks for your reply.

I think the staples or pins can be removed, but maybe not the bands. Not sure from the way it is described.

Regarding aquablation, I'm not sure I want to CIC for another year while waiting for results. It's limiting my lifestyle to have to take catheters everywhere. When I go on a trip, I have to ship them ahead. Makes me feel way older than 69!

I'm going to go talk with some docs who have a lot of experience in both Urolift and Rezum and see what they have to say. I'll let you know what happens.

Thanks again, and best wishes,

Fred

Light1,

Look into Dr Sethi at Pacific Urology in Walnut Creek & San Ramon California. He has done over 300 rezum at this point, more than anyone on the west coast.  His phone number is 925-937-7740.  You have to leave a message and they call you back.

Thomas

Hello Martin,

could you please give me the contact info.for Dr. K

thanks much,

Robbie

Hello Jim,

can you recommend any Dr. that perform the Rezum procedure, I'd really appreciate it.

Robbie

Rob  If you go on his site it will give you his contact information  I do have a phone number for him.  I think it is his office number that he called me from  Very nice man.  Ken

If you go to the Rezum website and enter your zip code it will produce a list of doctors in your area. If you are near or don't mind traveling to Southern Illinois, there is a doctor there that someone recommended. Also, JerseyUro, who posts here does them in NJ. Things to ask are: How many have they done. What kind of results are they getting with cases like yours. What is the incidence of retro. And do they offer  twilight anathesia. I personally suggest urodynamic testing in many cases prior to any procedure so you will have a better idea of what kind of results to expect. What size is your prostate? While the data for FLA is in my opinion too small for any analysis, smaller prostates have not done very well.

Jim

Hi Fred,

I'm curious what direction you have decided to go since you are in my area and mentioned the three options I'm thinking about - urolift, aquablation, rezum.  I just sent an email to the folks at PROCEPT in Redwood City for a list of docs who do aquablation in the area and plan to call Dr Sethi in Walnut Creek regarding Rezum tomorrow.  Am just starting out here - have to get up 4-5 times a night and have a real slow stream, no other symptoms so not too bad, will see my PCP on Monday.

John

Good evening John.  Do you know how big is your prostate.  If the prostate is the problem  Start out with the less evasive procedure.  Which is Urolift.  I had mine over 3 1/2 years ago. No cutting and no side effects.   Rezum is ok for some men.  few side effects and about 10% retro.  The men that have had the best results were the ones that only had 4 injection 2 on top of the prostate and 2 on the bottom  Leaving the middle alone.  Now Aquablation is still new.  But it is just a different way of doing a Turp.  Still in trails.  Have a great day  Ken

Prostatelasercenter[/b].com[/b] has all the information on his practice. Great doctor to talk too, never in a hurry to get off the phone until all your questions are answered.

I had my FLA a little over a year ago. I would say I am 90% happy with the results. I go on these blogs every couple of months to see how other members of the K club are doing and would like to share some of my experiences. I noticed you are having some issues with cysts and I believe I had some of the same issues. I started using Serrapeptase 40,000 SU not for my prostate but for a large cyst that has been on my neck for over five years. I took one pill before bed and after only three days I noticed the cyst had gone in size by over 50%. Also on the third night I got up to pee and two or three blood clots were part of the result. I know Serrapeptase is suppose to help with scar tissue and cysts and I wonder if these blood clots or cysts were being removed because of this supplement. After the blood clots came out everything was normal, no more blood. This supplement is interesting and I am going to take it for three months to see if there are more benefits.

Hi Steve, what specific brand of serrapeptase are you taking ? Thanks. Hank

Also, are you taking them between meals, not with meals ? Hank

brand is sunergetic, 40,000 su. I take one before bedtime

Thanks. Hank

Steve, 

Thanks for sharing. It’s worth a try, as I am one that has the cysts after FLA. mine have been described as a bundle of grapes there are so many.

Dr. K said my main problem when he did the ablation was a large cyst that protruded into my bladder. If this supplement is reducing the size of my cyst on my neck, I got to believe it will do the same if there are any cysts on my prostate. I have a feeling this may be our answer! 

Yeah, but what else is it reducing/doing to your body? I’m a little skeptical of it for that reason. And I don’t know what the long term effects are. 

I am wondering if I am not too far along with healing anyway, since it has been 18 months since my procedure.

How long have you taken the supplement?

Steve, I read your original post regarding Serrapeptase and then researched it quite a lot. I decided to give it a try. I have had a LOT of inflammation issues for many years. I did many things in my youth that caused a lot of injury. I rode Rodeo for 2 and half years, had accidents which broke 7 ribs, my arm, my clavicle bone, my pelvic bone, my right hand. 

Then a little later in life, after realizing the sport was not for me and catching a break for good job, I worked for the phone company but I fell off a pole which caused a compound fracture of 2 vertebras in my back.

Then in my 30's I matured and decided to work for my self in the new exciting, emerging software world that, at that time felt and looked like the wild west all over again. This industry looked like a battle ground at that time because software platforms were being decided on the fly. Made up as we all went along. This was back when CPM operating systems and machine languages were going to beat out those kids in the garage with that DOS stuff. That is until IBM decide who would actually be the winner. It was a wonderfully exciting time. We would imagine computers the size of your house that might do what your cell phone does now. 

I sat at my desk for 16 hours a day and wrote code and gained wait and a stomach and was no longer a fit and trim cowboy wannabe . But the injuries I had created with my previous live style have never stopped hurting me. In my late 60's now it takes me about an hour, yoga and a really hot shower to be able to move in the morning without a lot of pain. Add to this that now I play a lot of golf and the inflammation is a constant issue that has just become a way of life. I am so use to it that sometimes I forget everyone does not live this way. 

I have been on the serrapeptase now for two weeks as of Thursday. One pill at night before I go to bed. I can not begin to tell you how much this supplement helps my pain. I am not sure what it is doing for my prostate because the relief from the pain is so good that I am overwhelmed at this point. 

I was smart enough to NEVER take the pain pills the doctors would and wanted to give me. 

My Focal Laser Ablation results took care of my BPH symptoms for the most part and i am so blessed to have found Dr. Karmanian. I am very pleased with that and it is now a year and 7 months out. I cannot be more happy with that results. I pee like a normal 67 year old man should pee. 

But, I never believed I would again in my life be at a point again where my body does not feel crippled and that is where I am now thanks to your post and comments. I hope this post does not jinx my new found results. We will see how long it last. I thank you for your post on the topic. I am taking a 100,000 spu dose on an empty stomach each night.

You get a lot of men on this thread who advise people what and what not to do even when they have not done the procedure they are warning against!  

I also think the FDA is a very rigged deal in this county made up of 15,000 bureaucrats and the passed and future lobbyist.  One thing everyone should be very glad about  is that Trump pushed, and then signed the "Right to Try Act". This will be such a blessing to those who need hope and a chance to fight. 

Thanks again for the information you shared. 

 

John, what is the specific brand of serrapeptase that you are taking ? Thanks and thanks again for all your FLA contributions to this forum. Hank

I have been taking 40,000 SU for approx. two weeks. I asked my doctor about the product and he was familiar with supplement. He said people in Europe have been using this enzyme for decades and there have been no issues on long term use. Look up some of the different companies that offer this  product on Amazon and look at the reviews. I take these reviews with a grain of salt, but I believe this product may work, to what degree I am not sure. I have just started doubling my dose to 80,000 to see if there will be any more relief with my aches and pains. I have a feeling the blood clots that I passed may have been cysts that were killed with this enzyme. Nothing ventured nothing gained.

You and I are the same age with the same issues and philosophies. I started to take Serrapetase for my aches and pains and my clogged arteries. After more research and my passing a few blood clots, I realized this product may eliminate some of the dead scar tissue and new cysts that may start to form near the prostate. I would like to enjoy the remaining years as pain free as possible.

I am taking Enzymedica "The Enzyme Experts" Non GMO Therapeutic by SerraGold 60 capsules for $24.00 It is 100,000 SPU of Serrapeptase. 

This is all on the front of the bottle. SerraGold TM seems to be the product name.

I just went to the Family Health Store and bought it. It was the only one they carried and they said it had very high ratings. I planned to do efficacy research across brands but my result was so fast and so good that I have yet to do so. But I will. Doctors Choice is also a good brand I read about

I am not touting anything to anyone just reporting the results. 

Enzymedica brand called Serragold. Serrapeptase. 

I sent you a PM

Hank maybe third time is a charm. 

it is serragold by enymedica

Nope, can't get through. look at your pm

yes I ask my doctor also and he said the only thing to be concerned with was that someone taking blood thinners should not also at it. I can't say the enzyme name as I will get moderated. But you already know the name 

If you are anyone wants the brand and product name I will personal message it up on request. Lots of them out there. 

I just played 18 hole in the heat for the third day in a row and usually I can't even walk for a couple of days after that but i am not even hurting today. I have a torn rotator cuff that I just live with and have for a long time. it is also much better with this product. 

Got it. Thanks again John. Hank

That would be wonderful Steve if it did help with the new cysts. I also passed some late tissue after about 5 months from the time of my FLA. And I also know that Ross did the same thing. So, I think it is a common thing with FLA recovery and it is not only good it is normal. It only happened twice to me and once to Ross. So maybe the Serrapeptase will help with that. It can not be bad as it means something cleared out!

John

Mike here.  You are still out there doing the pitch for FLA.  That is great.  I have had several issues come up in the  last 4 months, so I have been incognito on the forum.  I will call you in a couple days on the phone.  

It is so good to see that your procedure is still holding up as is mine.  We are the 2 longest running patients for the BPH portion of the procedure out there.  I don't know how anyone could as for more.

Mike

I am very happy for both of you.  That all went well.  Take care  Ken 

Mike, well I wondered what happen to you? I was afraid you were having too much fun in Mexico. Yes, call me it will be nice to catch up .

Hi J12080- I'm on blood thinners and I've been taking it for about 2 weeks. It raised my INR very slightly [so far], so it's not affecting me enough to stop taking it. I'm on warfarin, which is measurable and also has an antidote. I prefer to not be part of a worldwide 'testing program' for the 3 new anticoagulants. They are not Vitamin K antagonists like warfarin, so you don't have to moderate intakes of green vegetables with the new drugs. I read there is a class action lawsuit against the makers of Xarelto for bleedouts. There's supposed to be an antidote for one of the three new anticoagulants soon. 

Warfarin has been in use for over 60 years, and all the drawbacks are already known.

Anyway, for me, I use a warfarin INR testing device. A pin prick on the finger and about a minute later I have the result. I have had to test my blood more often, like every 3 days to see what is going on. So far a very slight increase in the INR, but just fine, still in the range of 2-3 [2.4]. If you don't have a testing device, you'll have to go to the labs more often and have your INR tested. 

Cheers- J

PS- "I'm on blood thinners and I've been taking it for about 2 weeks."

I've been taking it [Serrapeptase] for about 2 weeks.

Cheers

PSS- I've been on warfarin for about 13 years.

Hi John. Good to hear that you are doing so good. I just past 5 months post FLA and things are doing great, I usually get up once per night to pee but, unlike before the procedure have no trouble at all starting the flow.

I may have to try the supplement you are talking about. I stopped playing golf last fall due to feeling like you described for a few days after 18 holes, could barely move around I was so stiff and my lower back was so painful.

Rick

Jay, it was  my understanding from my own research that it is not recommended to take Serrapeptase if taking a blood thinning drug. My doctor also told me that but he may be reading the same web site as I am. I just wanted to make sure you are aware of this and you have done your own research on interactions with other drugs before you decide to take something. 

Just do your research Richard as this is an over the counter and internet available product and you want to get a good preforming brand and correct dosage. Good research is the key. 

Also, most important is you want to make sure you have no drug interactions with medications you may be taking. Also, it is always good to tell you doctor and run it by him. Though I did it after the fact and he confirmed everything I had already researched. Good Luck, it helped me fairly quickly. Within the first week I could tell the pain level difference. If you wish to hear the brand name and product name I have tried and did not get it in my earlier post, just let me know and I will PM you. My product dose was 100,000 spu which seems high to me. I cannot cut it in half as it is a capsule. i think Steve's dosage is about 40,000 to 50,000 I am not sure of what is best or what each person may need but this one worked great for me. I sure am in a better mood. Pain makes you a negative, depressed person. It actually makes you act old. I am cautiously optimistic about this regiment I am now using as I feel so much better. At least at the moment. And I honest believe if there is inflammation in the Prostate Gland, I do plan on calling Dr. Karamanian's office and telling them about this Serrapeptase development. I think it will also help that. It is truly amazing to me what part inflammation plays in our lives. 

Good luck and let us hear. 

John

Good morning John.  I am going to ask my heart doctor to see if it would be ok if I tried it.  I have arthritis in my tail bone.  Sometime if I sit to long I'm in a lot of pain when I get up.  I'm on a blood thinner for a stent that I have.  If it can help that and anything else I think it would be great  Take care  Ken

Good morning Kenneth. That is a good idea. I know that on the internet, in reading articles and medical reports out of Europe, It is heavily touted for cardiovascular inflammation reduction. Also for sinus inflammation as well as muscular tissue and organ inflammation.  My doctor brought up the Cardio as he knows my situation with the blockage I have had and refused a by pass four years ago. So he said it should be good for atherosclerosis which is blocking of the veins and coronary arteries. I don't know, not why I tried it but would be great for me as I am not going to have a by pass unless I have a heart attack and of course I live through. I a now one year past when Baylor Heart Hospital said I would be dead. Thanks to Cleveland Clinic, I think I did it with diet and life style change.

So if Serrapeptase can add benefit to this with artery inflammation reduction, I am all for that. I am actually cutting back my dose to three time a week now to see if the results I have gotten reverses any. If it does I will up my dose to every other day and if not, I will try twice a week. My objective is to take as little as possible of anything to get the results needed. I also take Tart Cherry juice and Curcumin pills twice a day but these are food based and I am not concerned with there long term effects. Serrapeptase is a natural enzyme which is different. An Enzyme is a natural substance produced by some living organism that acts as a catalyst to bring about a specific biochemical reaction. In this case the living organism is a Silk Worm. It is extracted from the digestive system. You can read all this and more on the internet.

Good luck Kenneth I hope you get find as good of relief on that pain as I did. All the Doctor have for me is chemicals and surgery. Not interest but as the last resort.

 

Hi Richard, did you have large median lobe ? I just wonder if it was the cause of your problem starting the flow before FLA ? Thanks. Hank

Glad it works for you..  I don't know how much I should take.  I saw that it goes from 10 mg to 120.000 mg  I will have to see what my doctor said's  I did see 40.000 mg  Maybe if I take 1 a day that will help  I will  see.   Take it easy  Ken 

Kenneth, I don't know if I said but I am taking 100,00spu each night before I go to sleep and I don't seem to have any issues but good ones.

As long as you pay close attention to the INR, you can take most things if you're on blood thinners. It's a balance... even with vegetables. Whatever you do daily, the intake of warfarin can be adjusted. Yes, you have to be careful. I took ibuprofen morning and night after my FLA, and kept close track of my INR during this time. Antibiotics have been the worst thing I have taken that really mess with the INR. The antibiotics can send my INR skyrocketing... much worse than the Serrapeptase. You just have to monitor more closely which you can do with warfarin because it is measurable. The new blood thinners are not measurable so if you are on one of the new blood thinners, it would be best not to take Serrapeptase. I am very knowledgeable about the use of warfarin. I self-monitor, and self dose. Most do not do this.

Yes I did see that.  I can all way go up if I have to .  We will see.  I want to talk with my doctor first  Ken

I take Brilinta 90 mg 2 x a day  I will ask my doctor first.  to see how much.  He may have be start at one dose and go either up or down.  Have a good day  Ken

I have moved my dosage up to 125,000 and definitely feel a difference. As stated earlier I started using this enzyme to reduce inflammation and possibly clear some of the plaque from my arteries. I had bypass surgery six years ago and do not want to go through that surgery again. I've read that some people take doses up to a million Spu's a day with no side effects. I am going to take the 125,000 for a year and see if there is a difference in my next stress test. The other reason I believe it may be good for a person that has had a FLA is that it removes scar tissue and possibly cysts. Also I believe it may help sufferers of  prostatitis since this enzyme takes off the protective layer of bacteria and virus making it easier to kill.

I am publishing latest data on 120 patients with 1-2 year follow up. The manuscript will be in the Journal of Vascular and Interventional Radiology (JVIR). I will also post it here. The bottom line is that properly managed low or intermediate risk prostate cancers treated with FLA have no urinary or sexual side effects and that the need for retreatment is about 15%. I will present these results at multiple medical meetings this and next year. We are following about 300 patients and will continue to publish results as time goes by. I have joined other physicians in the focal laser international network to continue to refine and perfect this technique. 

Eric,

Any data for treatment of BPH, or is it all for the treatment of prostate cancer?

I understand that FLA is the same treatment in BPH as in targeted Lesion removal in Prostate Cancer. I am wonder did you separate the procedures by the directed treatment need between BPH relief and PC? If so, what were your numbers and what was the results? 

Where are you practicing? 

hello, could you please clarify something for me ..I'd really appreciate it. Are you saying that you're using Serrapeptase for prostate problems - in place of having a procedure or after having one?  I'm trying to find something to relieve my having to pee every two hours...day and night (I never get a good night's sleep) Plus like one of the others in this post ...I have severs arthritis in my joints and my tailbone. Sooo, if you could explain what you've found out, I'd be very grateful

Robbie

New Study for Prostatitis sufferers using Serrapeptase (Serrazyme ...40 i.u. serrapeptase)

Format: Abstract

Send toCurr Clin Pharmacol. 2018 Aug 2. doi: 10.2174/1574884713666180803114654. [Epub ahead of print]Differentially enhancing effects of long-term treatment with Serrazyme, Boswellia and Pine on seminal bacterial detection in patients with chronic bacterial or inflammatory prostatitis, probably related to several degrees of bacterial adherence.Vicari E1, Malaguarnera G2, Vicari BO2, Salmeri M3, Salemi M4, Castiglione R1.Author information

Abstract

BACKGROUND:

Prostatitis is a recurrent urinary infection in males and is often difficult to cure. The aim of the study was to examine whether anti-inflammatory effects of enhanced drainage of prostatic secretions, obtained through two months treatment with a proteolytic enzyme mucoactive (PEM) compound (Serrazyme and other constituents), influenced qualitative or quantitative expressions of bacterial growth in seminal cultures.

METHODS:

450 patients with prostatitis syndromes were randomized either to PEM therapy (intervention group) or to no treatment group. All patients were followed at the end of a 2-month PEM continuous treatment period (T2) and further two months after withdrawal (T4).

RESULTS:

After treatment, 15 out of 107 (14.1%) patients with Chronic Bacterial Prostatitis (CBP) showed negative seminal cultures, while in patients with cat NIH-IIIA prostatitis seminal cultures became positive in 33.3% cases with low bacteriospermia. After two months from withdrawal, although among CBP patients the total number of isolates and colony forming units (CFU) counts showed not significant changes compared to matched-values observed at T2, microbial parameters varied significantly among inflammatory prostatitis patients.

CONCLUSION:

The results of the present study showed that 2 months of treatment with PEM, decreasing bacterial adherence and inflammatory prostatitis, reveals a subgroup of apparent inflammation associated with infection that microbial biofilms likely mask in inflammatory prostatitis patients.

KEYWORDS:

Bacteria; Serrazyme.; biofilm; chronic bacterial prostatitis; inflammatory prostatitis; quantitative bacteriospermia

PMID:

 

30073929

 

DOI:

 

10.2174/1574884713666180803114654

 

Thank you.  Very good to know.  Ken

Interesting... Serrapeptase also has some VERY interesting possibilities in clearing clogged coronary arteries... and helping MS patients...  well worth looking into...

Tusc, I would look into it a little more before downing having a big Mac But seriously, I have read some good things but also some cautionary reports, cautionary in the sense that good study data may be lacking. Personally, I'm a minimalist and currently don't take any meds or supplements and to be clear supplements and meds are sometimes not all that different. YMMV.

Jim

I agree to a point... I used to overdo it with supplements... too many and too much can be bad news... Serrapeptase, as I said, is well worth looking into... not that there are many heavy scientific studies on it, too expensive for anyone not Big Pharma...  and it is not patentable...  so they never will (like marijuana) but considering there is really no current treatment to unclog arteries (other than heavy dose niacin), short of surgery... why not at least examine it?  Big Pharma put out a bunch of negative stuff (BS IMO) on niacin, as they have a BIG interest in keeping the statin drugs flowing...(dangerous stuff)... also, MS is a bear, and again, why not look at potential alternatives?  Easy to be a "minimalist" if healthy... right?