Heaven ~ Hell ~ where does purgatory fit in?

HAHAHA!!! thank you for that!!!

Frustrated XxOo

Doc ~

Also, I finally got that 3 star 5 star thingy.  That happens automatically, it's not something I thrive for.  I'd be happy with a huge smile under my picture!

You are so silly, I'm still laughing about that "lift off"  lmbo!

Frustrated

Never mind that "under the picture stuff". Its all over my face, so just you leave it where it is. I am getting quite used to it being there. Doc!withasmile!!

just like karma the accruing of merit happens here with the number of your stars!!

In many ways I agree with your post. However (oh yeah, that "however") lol, I almost feel like "purgatory" is a place to dwell and yes, I believe it's full of darkness.  That's why my beliefs are, we are indeed in purgatory as this world has many beautiful things to look at and make one smile but in the end, here we are trying to keep one another afloat thus falling totally into the abyss (purgatory).  I'm def open for further discussion or if you feel this is enough,let's get a move on to the "hereafter" which you could start and I def will follow!  "If you build it, I will come", yes we're in a world of "field of dreams".

I'm hitting the hay in a few so I'll be back either later or tomorrow.  Either way, Doc, you stay well and ttys <3

frustrated xx frustrated="">

frustrated xx>

Thanks frustrated. I think there will be milage in this discussion. Don't be put off by my stuffy comment. I am sure someone will want to tell us about righting wrongs, or suffering for hurts given to others, or asuaging guilt and that sort of thing. 

You are probably just in need of your bed. The needle on your optimism dial will be down about zero. So off to bed, have some sweet dreams and the needle on the optimism dial will be reading FULL by breakfast. Nighters, frustrated.

Hi Jessie ~

I tend to "shoot from the hip" myself.  I'm feeling like Doc was feeling that this discussion has probably run it's course.  I've had a few more sleepless nights even though my intention was to "get" sleep, the body doesn't always cooperate.  Being in a "chronic" stage of pain sometimes stops the body from fighting on its'  own and even pain meds don't work.  So, after years of abusing my body by exercising, yes exercising, and taking care that I eat right, the common arthritis sets in as well as the other complications left from that auto accident.

My thoughts are still the same on purgatory and I guess I'll never know what and if it actually exists until I meet my maker.  I would love to join in a discussion of importance to anyone in here as I can assure you, I know a lot about nothing and nothing about a lot. lol

I'm going to take a much needed rest as being up all night and seeing my children and grandchildren today left me pretty much a wash.  But, if I think of another topic and no one else in here has, I'll post it.

Btw, Jessie, I like your sense of humor! I get it!

Frustrated

Jessie ~

It's all good.  I believe one should sometimes "shoot from the hip" as it may be the most honest about them.  Editing sometimes can change the meaning even if it's wasn't meant to be changed.

So, please join in as I shoot from the hip often  !

Frustrated

haha! once again I see I'm not the only one who tries to sleep and the mind won't quit. 

Do we make our own bed.  Good question.  When I was a child and I disobeyed, I did make my own bed because I knew of the consequences.  I don't know if I made my own bed when another car smashed into me going 50 mpr and everyone in front oh him (me directly) were stopped to let an old man get into his favorite donut shop on a beautiful Saturday morning in Feb.  I cannot even imagine what kind of thing I would have done to "deserve" his ignorance?  I say his ignorance as he was clearly looking out the side window yelling at someone for honking their horn!  They were probably honking to warn him to STOP looking out the window because you're going to hit someone.  Yes, I saw him coming and I saw the entire crash flash before my eyes.  I don't claim to be a perfect person nor even close to one.  I've made my share of mistakes and probably will continue on to do so.  The answer to your question, in this situation of mine, is that the input of my life was definitely played out by by someone, in a large way.  I cannot golf, yoga, exercise, walk, work, my life was changed by largely  his play on his anger.  He wasn't angry at me, but at the one who honked.  Silly people, if we read too much into what other's are doing and always think it's a direction towards us in a negative way, remember this story.  He was being warned but he took it as someone being stupid towards him and so he ignored that sign and turned it into anger, I paid dearly for it.  Did I make my own bed?  Perhaps.  At this point in my life, I doubt I did, but perhaps I could have, please someone help me out here, I'm at a loss.  Did I warrent this?  

Jessie, you haven't upset me in any way and I pray that I haven't upset you.  You just opened up another avenue for us to direct attention towards.  Let's figure this out!

Frustrated Xx

O frustrated ( who said that? ) do we deserve the bad things that happen to us? Do we deserve the good things that happen to us? I think I had better go to bed and see if I can sleep.

oh steve was enjoying your contribution...impressed with your reading...but twaddle disappointed me..we've had no value judgements so far...so steve would you say what you do agree with please.

I'm not sure what I believe, Thoughts and idea are not physical but are none the less real and as far as I know are the only things that are real yet have no actual material in their make up, even energy in its various forms can be measured and is particulate in constuction (maybe on a sub atomic scale)

It therefore seems to me that after the body dies, ideas and thoughts have no reason to cease as there are nothing physical to die.

Now, going down another line, when I was at school I was taught a thing called conservation of mass which says that mass cannot be destroyed only converted into into something else sometimes with the release of stored energy which also can't be destroyed.

What happens to thought once it's thought?, does it cease to exist or is it indestuctable?.If the latter is the case then presumably it either goes on to approach infinity or it's absorbed by something and stored or it's converted to something else (material or energy).

If it's absorbed then maybe I believe in reincarnation,if it's on it's endless travel then maybe that is Hell.

With the reincarnation bit, some schools of thought believe that it happens until such time as it (the soul?, thought?, idea?, what ever) has got to the stage where it's living a perfect life and doing all the right things and thinking all the right thoughts and then is ready for the next phase, heaven nevana or what ever the belief is.If that's the case then life here on Earth is probably Pugatory. If it's absorbed, maybe by another brain some thoughts could be second hand or maybe even, there is a finite amount of thought and it's all recycled.  I don't know what to believe. Is there such a thing as original thought???

 

PS. Don't be impressed with my reading list, it also contains The Sun, The Mail, The Mirror etc..... On the plus side, it also contains The Beano

Hi steve, 

So you are not at all convinced that there is a purgatory at all. As a bonus you have kindly identified where the word and its concept comes from. I too don't go along with purgatory. Then there are ideas that purgaratory is conceptually the very rough spots we all have to strugle through as our life progresses. There! we have three general ideas already. It will be interesting to read how they are fleshed out with variaty of detail. 

Many thanks Steve. This is an exciting beginning. I look forward to reading some more.

A nice ironic PS. plus, I also used to read the Beano, well into my 20s. I haven't read it for years. I prefered it to the other papers.

Steve, that is wonderfully interesting. I will need some time to absorbe and mull over that. Thank you a lot. 

Meantime, what do you make of information? In business law it can be intellectual property but it has no mass. It has no mass but it can be exhibited electronically - computer programs and data; represented in printer's ink on paper; recodered and used in each cell of our bodies in strings of amino acids arranged in a double helix.

Might purgatory be real after all ( I still don't think so) but have no mass? If so, do we in the aftelife have no mass ( again I don't think so )? You have a way with argument ( the logical setting out of reasons leading to a conclusion.) I should be glad to learn what you say in connection to purgatory, the place or the concept.

So the Beano has 'a life of its own'....thus Minnie the Minx..my fave... is still alive ...but without form !

Is that not the nature of spirit ?

a concept without form ?

a concept without mass...sorry... to follow your words

Steve ~

This is exactly what I'm saying, "the rest of us either go straight to hell or work our socks off getting "holy" enough to enter eternal life (after life) of bliss".  Are we "working it out?" or just here to merely follow suit from the product of our parents? 

[email]lol@Twaddle[/email]!  I couldn't agree more!  Priests, who abuse children, they "go straight away" because of their stature here on earth?  that is twaddle! indeed!  I believe there are only a very few who could "enter" w/o any means of trying as they have always, always been good people.  Even priests, popes etc...make definite mistakes.  Are they forgiven? Most probably if they ask for forgiveness.  However, John Paul II, may God rest his soul, my beliefs are he HAD no choice but to re-establish the Catholic council, look at what was happening before his eyes w/ his "own" people.  Another discussion to be posted at one time or another.

But, thank you for your response.  I very much enjoyed a refreshing look on things.

Frustrated

Marey, we are all entitled to our opinions, right?  I believe what he said "twaddle" was just his humor.  I got what he meant.  I think I did anyway, those "selected" few could go straight away w/o having to answer to anyone?  I do agree with the fact that it is just that...full of it! (twaddle) lol sorry but I found that humorous, wrong? I apologize if I have offended you as that isn't my intention.  My intention is to perhaps show you another view on his remark.

Frustrated

Steve ~

Yes, please continue with your original thought as I find it to be just as this discussion suggests, your opinion.  Opinions count.

Please keep on with your writing as perhaps when the time is right for some, they will understand.  Right?

Frustrated

I'm still trying to understand.

Perhaps the original thought and/or the idea of recycled thought theme can be likened to the finite spin or twist theory. Maybe a thought is bought at the expense of another thought because there is a finite amount available and it's all being used.

Your ideas sparked a question in my mind. Can man think any thought that the creator God has not already thought? Can any man have a truly original thought or does all original thought lie with the creator .

Steve, where have you disappeard to?  You are a very interesting person and add much to any discussion!  Your knowledge and your humor is truly needed in such discussions!  Please keep on posting, I've enjoyed it immensely! Yes, from The Sun to Beano, you are well diversed in every aspect of your life aka as complexed!   I hope you are well.

Frustrated