Perimenopause and SEVERE joint pain - any one else??
Posted , 512 users are following.
Hi
I am 50 and have been in perimenopause for some time. I just wanted to post here to see if anyone else has suffered extreme joint pain as a result of fluctuating estrogen.
Quick history: regular as clockwork from the age of 13 - up to and after the two pregnancies in my thirties.Then aged 47 I started to get very heavy and irregular periods. Then I went for six months with no period at all, then two very scant light periods in quick succession. I have had nothing now for two months but I do feel as if it might happen soon as sore boobs etc.
I have never had a hot flush. I do however have lots of other peri symptoms, including insomnia, heart palpitations and skipped beats, and a strange 'rushing' or whooshing feeling which starts in the abdomen which I think is an 'adrenal' surge. I also have other vague and odd symptoms, dry eyes and inside my nose, and a really vile taste in my mouth sometimes - I mean really vile, like a chemical taste, unrelated to anything I have eaten. I also have odd tingling skin sometimes, which I can only describe as feeling like 'cold' sunburn!
However, about the joint pain. Three months ago I literally woke up one morning with a sore left arm/elbow. Over a few days, the pain then moved into my shoulders, and I got really worried as if was incredibly painful, and showed no signs of going away, it just got worse and worse. It is worse in the morning when I wake up, I am as stiff as a board. It is on my mind 24/7. Doing normal things is almost impossible - I have problems carrying shopping, drying my hair,walking the dog, driving...everything seems to hurt . I have never suffered from arthritic pain, and I went to the doctor thinking I had some awful bone disease, or even polymyalgia. I was told I had nerve pain!! The GP was terrible and made me feel like a hypochondriac and it was all in my mind. I was told I had good range of movement, and no inflammation. But I am in agony, and i am not imagining it.I made the mistake of asking Dr.Google too, which is never a good idea as I scared myself half to death. I never even thought it could be related to hormones or menopause, as the pain was just SO bad and I had never heard of joint pain being a symptom.I mean I have read than meno can be bad for some women, and I expected hot flushes etc, but I didnt realise it meant pain like this.
Anyway - for the last few weeks I have been having worsening pain which has spread from left elbow and both shoulders, into left hip, both elbows and now my knees. All my joints are cracking and popping loudly and even my husband can hear the awful grating in my neck and my knees....I sound like a one man band as I go up and down the stairs!
I went In for my three yearly Cervical smear on Monday, and could hardly get up on the examining couch I was so stiff and sore. Womans health is dealt with by the Nurse Practitioners in our large practice (15 GP's) and when the NP saw my discomfort she asked me what was wrong. It turns out she has a real interest in womens health, and has been involved in HRT trials and research for many years. She informed me that my symptoms all point to fluctuating estrogen, and possible thyroid involvement. She told me a load of stuff about estrogen and cartilage, dry mucosa etc, the details of which I can't remember now but which made so much sense when she explained it - even down to the foul taste and tingling skin I have also experienced on and off for months which are both known side effects of estrogen surge as the ovaries go a bit haywire. Asmall percentage of women are very receptive to estrogen fluctuations which involve cartilage, which mainly manifest as abnormally severe joint pain/menopausal arthritis but it is not an 'obvious' symptom of perimenopause.
I asked why the GP was no help, and she just raised her eyebrows when I told her which male GP it was, and told me to make another appointment as soon as possible with a specific GP (who must be more knowledgeable about womens health.) Going in tomorrow to see her.
I can't do HRT as I have a heart condition, but maybe I can do estrogen cream, or phytoestrogen/soy.) It could last for a long time I guess until I come out the other side !
So i have not yet been diagnosed, but it sounds like it could be caused by estrogen. Sorry this has been so long....but anyone else out there feel the same way I do???
Lesley.
85 likes, 1485 replies
Fanny_Jane
Posted
My gp told me it's very common and probably an inherited tendency as women can have very mild short term to very serious and long term menopauses. It's very individual.
I also have had a underactive thyroid for 30 years, although not connected with the menopause it did get worse and I had to up my daily dose.
I was unable to try HRT as I also have a heart condition but was able to use a vaginal cream for a while. I had to stop it though after about 8 months due to my system absorbing too much.
It's a rotten thing for us to go through, who'd be a woman through choice!
Goldfinch has given you some good advice and personally I think you need to see a rheumatologist at least and possibly and endocrinologist as well, your gp can refer you
Good luck and hope you get some help and answers soon. Fanny Jane.
jeannecatlover Fanny_Jane
Posted
You may have polymyalgia rheumatica. It often comes on with menopause--it did for me. PMR causes joint pain that comes on suddenly and makes you feel as if you've aged many years at once. If you're interested in following this possibility, patient.info has a great discussion board for PMR that you might want to join.
jgo jeannecatlover
Posted
thank you JEANNE, mine had totally cured with eostrogen therapy - what is the treatment for pmr ?
jeannecatlover jgo
Posted
I'm so glad you're feeling better. The treatment for PMR, unfortunately, is prednisone, a steroid that can cause bone loss and other negative effects. However it is very effective on PMR pain. And usually, after some years, the PMR goes away and one can get off the prednisone. I'm still waiting for that to happen.
I initially thought my problem was hormone related, so I tried HRT, but all it did was bloat up my stomach, and even six months after I went off it, the bloating is still there.
jgo jeannecatlover
Posted
Hi there again, since I last wrote I’ve put on nearly 80lbs And back to chronic muscle and joint pain and stiffness. I really don’t know where to go with it now. Because I am now also overweight the doctor or just a tribute joint pain to additional weight on my body. Any thoughts?
jeannecatlover jgo
Posted
My advice would be to see a rheumatologist and see if she thinks your symptoms are PMR.
Lesley998
Edited
Things came to a head last week, as I woke up one morning and could genuinely hardly get out of bed - I had new pains in my lower back and hips that were excrutiating. I hobbled down to the doctor appointment as mentioned and finally this lady doctor listened to me and agreed that it could be hormonal. I was given some strong pain killers - and some blood tests (at last) and I got the resuts a week later, last Friday.
NO inflammation, no raised CPR or ESR, no rheumatoid signs... but FSH was very high and after some discussion about my cardiac issues (LBBB) the doctor started me on the HRT Prempac-C immediately. She told me it would take from a week, to up to a month to see changes, but I am really not exaggerating when I say that today, three days later - I feel SO much better. I still have the pains in all of my joints, but it feels that way when you have flu, or have had a dental abcess or something, and you know you are on the mend...the pain changes somehow, not so intense.
Now.... I always thought I had a farly high pain threshold - but I genuinely have never felt anything like the joint pain I have been having for almost three months. It was intolerable. I really was starting to think I had some awful disease, or bone cancer. Just shows you how these hormones (or lack of them) can affect us. I didn't have a lot of other symptoms that women mention but I definitely got more than my fair share of the joint issues.
As for the cardiac thing - I have a permanent left bundle block, after having endocarditis ten years ago. This means heart disease is something I really need to avoid, and as I know HRT can cause heart disease, I thought I could not take it. However, I could not live with the symptoms I was having , and am happy to take the risk for a couple of years until my body moves into menopause and hopefuly get used to the lack of estrogen. I dont completely understand how it works..I mean, you can't be on HRT forever, and surely when you stop it the body just starts missing it again...and joint pain will come back. But the doc did explain that after menopause, the body recognises the situation and the symptoms are not as bad as peri.
I will continue to update on this pain and how the HRT has helped - but I hope any other woman as frightened as I was about the joint pain and joint changes can take encourangement from this that you are not going mad...it IS your hormones.
x
Beetle1965 Lesley998
Posted
I do feel like I am going crazy with all these changes. HRT might not be an option for me, but I need to consider it. This has come out of the blue for me.
Zigangie Lesley998
Posted
It's good to hear HRT is helping with the aches and pains.
I see your GP has prescribed prempac c. This is a synthetic hormone made from horse urine.
As you have heart problems I wonder if you would be better off asking your doctor for
Oestrogel and Utrogestan as these are more bio identical.
I think GPs give premarin and prempac as they area bit cheaper than the two I have mentioned.
The oestrogel is a gel you apply to your skin every day and utrogestan (the progesterone) is taken as a pill fire the first 12 days of the month.
sue417 Lesley998
Posted
lizrud sue417
Posted
I just thought I'd mention Linda Kearne's HRT cake (you can find it online).
It's based on the fact that Japanese women have very few menopausal symptoms and contains ingredients such as linseeds, soya flour, sunflower seeds etc. It is a very solid cake which doesn't rise.
I have been having a slice each day for around 2 years now and have definitely seen improvement in hot flushes and other symptoms as have my friends. Whatever you do don't stop taking it when the symptoms subside as they will return with a vengance. Anyway thought it was worth a mention.
carla25504 Lesley998
Posted
Thank you for posting this! I feel just like you were describing! It's horrible! I'm going to make an appointment with my doctor asap.
jeannie94965 sue417
Posted
Hi Sue, just a suggestion for the hot flashes, try red macaw powder. You can buy it online or at a vitamin store
I'm 48 and paramenapause, no periods for 9 months now but had hot flashes and night sweats. Starting taking the macaw and within a couple weeks they had mostly subsided. I put a teaspoon and 1/2 in my coffee with creamer every morning. Doesn't taste the greatest but after a month, no more hot flashes. As for the achy joints, this is something that I have just started experiencing the last couple of months but have recently started taking a joint supplement. This to seems to be helping the pain. You have to get a supplement with glucosamine, omega 3, chondroitin, and MSM in it. I highly recommend all you ladies try this if you haven't. It works wonders.
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lena00520 jeannie94965
Posted
Barclaypip1 lena00520
Posted
Me too! My fingers feet elbows and knees ache and I'm worried it's linked to something else! My bloods indicate I'm entering menopause and have been very up and down for 3 years. If you google anything it arthritis or fybromyalgia and I already ha e a headache condition so any advice would be great! I also get itchy skin and tingling and the pains in the body are worse when I wake BUT I'm aware they are there throughout the day just not as bad x
connie72847 jeannie94965
Posted
HI Jeanie,
I too am new to this forum and enjoyed reading all these comments. Thanks for recommending the red macaw powder. I too like everyone else am feeling this "great time of my life" adventure. I am turning 52 this year. I have had the hot flashes pretty badly, and now they are in a state of none--BUT for how long? I see them come and go. I will try the red macaw powder. I will also get back with you. I recently started with the achey joints like everyone else. I am in the fitness industry (personal trainer, yoga instructor and Pilates instructor) I am trucking on everyday knowing this is whats going on. My knees ache so badly, and my hips too. oh and elbows. I am finding that walking or riding my stationary bike really helps with the cardio, and I love Pilates on the reformer as its so great for the mental and physical strength of the core. I also have thyroid issues but I am on the minimal dose of 25. I have read that Devils claw is another great supplement to take for achey joints, and I am waiting for that to come in. I have tried some supplements for menopause and really got no relief...Like black cohoursh--sorry I spelled that wrong, but after talking to my doctor that interferes with thyroid and I really never felt anything. I thank you for recommending your supplement suggestion. Hang in there everyone! We can get thru this. Just keep moving! I am not giving in any time soon! thanks for all the comments and suggestions! much appreciated!
sue93674 connie72847
Posted
Hi Connie and everyone!
I have severe lower back pain and both hip pain. I do feel like Im 80...and Im 54. Im on HRT and progesterone. Perhaps need a dose adjustment. I am so grateful you are all here! All gp's think Im bonkers. My gut tells me it is hormones and not something else, but sometimes the pain and exhaustion is so much I want to get xrays and mri's but my insurance is not good. Sometimes it helps just to be reminded that it is possible to be hormone related. Im self employed and sole provider for my family and really need to function! Does anyone have experience with devils claw? Ive been reading about that a bit. Thanks so much for being here.
connie72847 sue93674
Posted
Hi Sue,
I have tried Devils claw before. I had cortisone shots in my lower back about 20 years ago, and during the recovery time I tried Devils claw, and gluclosamine sulfate. I did see a difference. I recently had (9 years ago) 2 lower back mircodysectomy surgerys in L-4-5. I am doing amazing today, but I did not retake the devils claw. I read the post above of trying it and I am waiting for it to come in. I ordered it online... I live in a very small town that does not have a health food/ supplement store. I will keep you posted on my findings. i pray I don't go thru the pain that I have been reading about here. I just keep moving, and doing my Pilates. I will keep you posted on what I find. I know that it will take some time before I see a difference, but if it works like last time. I m a believer. I will update again soon! Also my doctor does not believe in HR replacement. I have done some reading on it as well. I guess its like butter....one day its good for you and the next day it is not, so I am sure alot of Docs are either for it or not. Mine just said if I can get thru it without--to do it. All health risks of taking it are not good. I also don't like taking things (drugs). I know sometimes the supplements too are a risk.... time will tell.
Parsley1003 connie72847
Edited
Hi
Interesting reading from everyone.
I started the menopause unknowingly aged 42....went to GP with painful joints. He was a wise old owl and suggested menopausal symptoms. Blood test revealed I wasn't peri menopausal but right in the menopause! No wonder I felt so awful.
HRT was started mainly because of my age and bone density issues likely.
I put on 2stone but had varying types of HRT and found one that suited and lost a stone but found weight management an issue anyway!
At 49 I got oestrogen receptive breast cancer. Had an op to remove cancer, radiotherapy and had to come off HRT. I also had gallstones which I had removed the following year, linked to HRT I think.
I have very, very stiff joints: fingers, hips, elbows, knees especially! I saw, a Rheumatologist and it's not Rheumatoid arthritis but some natural degenerative changes. Not enough to cause the discomfort I get though.
My muscles feel like they are going into a cramp in lower legs and forearms and I've read magnesium deficiency can be a cause so I take a multi vit. All in all I think all of it is menopausal and some of us get it more than others... I'm getting it!
I'm now 54 and thro Cancer but joints are a devil! I regularly do spin classes and swim very fast and very well. Stiff first thing mainly.
My weight has evened out but is a stone heavier than should be but GP said at menopause a woman should lower her calories by 500/day.
Dryness was a huge issue didn't realise what it was for a year of terrible discomfort. Went to a GU clinic thinking I had something dreadful: the insides were sloughing and causing terrible irritation like a bonfire! They gave hormone pessaries which worked but on the low dose they didn't... Pharmacist recommended vagifem moisture stuff. It's brilliant and rehydrate the insides. I havent had to use it since last yr as things have settled... It's life sadly but when you are the one in it, it's wicked.
Exercise is definitely the way forward for both mind and fitness ....I've always exercised and to feel such stiffness and be robbed of a certain freedom to do some exercises is soul destroying. Kneeling difficult, gripping with hands a no-go at moment but ever hopeful it will settled in time...
A lot of people don't realise that joint pain is a symptom of menopause... My first indicator at 42! Keep moving!
churchy1 Parsley1003
Posted
Do please try Maca root or Macafem; your symptoms are so similar to mine and I have really transformed my life with a really simple, but more importantly, NATURAL cure. Very best of luck . Do try it - I guarantee it will change your life. X