Starting on Citalopram, chatting and progress
Posted , 7 users are following.
Hi all,
i'm just starting out on citalopram, i'm male aged 47 and have been on and off lots of different antidepressants for about 15 years.
i just thought i would record here how its going and if anyone wants to chat about anything (for example how you are doing, or would like to share advice, please join in).
i started out on 10mg of citalopram, about 2 weeks ago, but for the last 3 days or so, i have moved up to 20mg. i didn't really have any side effects when starting the 10mg, but its certainly a different case now i am taking 20mg. there's a very noticeable increase in anxiety, which tends to be worse in the morning/early afternoon. i am also feeling very nauseous and am lacking appetite. i am currently splitting the 20mg dose, taking 10mg at midday, and another 10mg before bed around midnight.
i'm currently not sleeping well and feeling tired throughout the day.
i have lots of 'automatic negative thinking' going on but am trying to just do things through the day, and i have a part-time job i go to in the evenings, which i will continue to try to go to even if not feeling very well.
i guess that's about it for now then, i will continue to post updates. it can be a difficult road when starting antidepressants as you dont know how long they will take to work, assuming you are on the right one which suits you, and to find the right dose also.
sending good luck your way to anyone who is reading this and is also trying to get well.
0 likes, 37 replies
Admac73 sun47
Edited
Thanks for your account Sun47 - My story is a similar one (I'm also the same age)
I have been on and off anti depressants for nearly 30 years. Two years ago I decided I was finished with them - I felt more they had helped me as much as they were going and I was going to manage my moods without them - meditation, mindfulness and healthy eating.
Of course, the wheels have come off badly during the past year and I finally gave in when I hit the wall one time too many. You are so right about meditation - I have spent so many hours practising, on and off the cushion. I have been blaming myself for not doing it right but I now see that it's practically impossible to practice these skills when all of your bandwidth is taken up with anxiety and depression. I attended a meditation retreat a few months ago and it was tortuous. My social anxiety levels have been through the roof.
I am on 20mg of Citalopram for four weeks now, and all I have experienced so far is 4 hours sleep at night and the most dreadful anxiety and suicidal thoughts and catastrophising. I practice body scans and mindful breathing but it's not really working. I desperately need this medication to begin to work soon or I will have to take time off work - it's becoming difficult to just function on a daily basis.
Please keep us updated with your progress and good luck to everyone on this thread.
sun47 Admac73
Edited
hey Admac73 thanks for writing your story here, it really does sound like out stories are so similar. i didnt mention about suicidal thoughts so far in this thread but just to let you know, i most certainly have been getting these, but thankfully now i feel like i am moving past that stage (but when back there being in the thick of depression and anxiety, i just assumed those suicidal feelings would never go away, and neither would the depression and anxiety). so anyway like you i imagine, i just kept seeming to find myself with suicidal rumination, which was horrible and automatic, like there was part of my head responsible for either feeling suicidal or not, and this was activated.
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Regarding the whole world of mindfulness and meditation, I do wish some of the more known names in the industry would make more of a point that, their methods DO certainly work for some people, including people for example with certain levels of depression and anxiety, but then there is a certain more severe level of depression and anxiety which (in my opinion) wont actually be cleared up just by 'focusing on your breath' or 'sitting in silence', etc. And that goes for exercise also, and even diet. There is certainly plenty of evidence to back up what i say, as in, you do get plenty of people who eat a proper diet, exercise, and practice mindfulness/meditation, and yet they still have problems ongoing with depression and anxiety. So at least to me this says, there are many paths leading into suffering from depression and anxiety, and also there are many paths leading out. there is no one answer and there is no one solution. Luckily for most of us, one pathway out is, there are meds which do help us (although annoying as you know, sometimes they take a while to get going...)
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I did keep doing the 'body scans' and 'focus on breath' practices during the earlier stages of my citalopram treatment, but honestly i have no idea if it helped at all. To be honest it just feel like what REALLY helped with me feeling better was, taking a depression/anxiety medication, at a suitable dose for me (in my case 20mg), and taking it for a long enough time so that it began to work. And to me, it really is that simple. The only other thing I had to do in the meantime, was to keep going, and that's it (this was not easy or fun as you well know yourself. severe anxiety, depression, suicidal thoughts is no walk in the park. you know that).
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Admac did you start on 10mg citalopram and move up to 20mg after we week or two? if you didnt, i personally found that was less painful than just jumping in with a 20mg dose. that said it seems like u are past that stage now anyway so are now on the usual adult 20mg dose. 4 weeks is not that long so try not too worry, it certainly seems reasonable that u just need to give it more time and things will settle down and u will start to feel better. i know currnently pretty much every cell in your body will tell you its all hopeless, and you are flooded with anxiety, but honestly keep going because 4 weeks isnt very far in regarding recovery. keep us posted how u are doing.
Admac73 sun47
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Thanks Sun47, I needed to read this. It can be a lonely road sometimes and I don't talk to anyone IRL about anti depressants. So it's good to come across people in the same boat. I felt I was going mad with some of the side effects.
Yes, straight onto 20Mg. In hindsight I should have started with 10 but my GP throws medication out like sweeties. The side effects, such as the insomnia and suicidal thoughts caught me unawares. The suicidal rumination has been particularly hard to deal with - I try to use my mindfulness experience to observe the thoughts, to derpersonalise them. Hard going to carry these around but I feel I know where they are coming from.
I completely agree about meditation. There are many roads to wellness. I hope meds are my way out. I had been reading a book called 'the mindful way through depreession.' It was partly useful, but they did recognise that there was a level of depression that it wouldn't work with. I will try it again when I feel just slightly better. I am looking forward to meditating and being able to observe positive thoughts as well as negative ones. And metta meditation as well, one of the worst things for me has been how my heart seems to have closed. I find it hard to generate empathy when i feel like this.
I will keep checking this thread and look forward to reading more. I feel I am on the right road, at least.
sun47 Admac73
Edited
hey Admac yes i totally know what u mean about it can be a tough lonely road having to walk it on out own. in the past i used to keep it all secret from everyone but then i realised the energy and extra pressure of having to do that was just adding on to the problem, so now instead i make it a habit to let people who are close around me know if i am not doing well. for example i have a housemate so if i am not doing well i tell him what is going on, and he's totally understanding about it (if he wasnt, such as someone who would just say "pull yourself together", then we would have never gotten to be housemates). i also tell my brother and sister how things are going, and they are supportive (mind you it helps that they have also had issues with depression/anxiety, and currently my brother (twin brother) takes sertraline and is doing fine). i dont tell people at work though if i am not doing well as i just have a pretty casual job part-time job in a large store and my relationships with the people there are more formal rather than personal. the shifts are only ever 4 hours at a time so i just do my best if im not feeling well and just try to get through the shift.
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the metta medication you mentioned i hadnt heard of so i googled it, and it certainly looks like a good approach to take in order to improve wellbeing. there's a couple of articles on a website called 'fractal enlightment' which i found helpful to read if u want to check them out, the articles are called: 'Self-Forgiveness: 5 Steps to Free Yourself from Past Mistakes' and also '6 Practical Ways to Love Yourself'. I know what you mean about 'your heart becomes closed' when you are really unwell. the way my experience is and how i would describe it is: (maybe u can relate): when i have bad depression or anxiety going on, everything tends to point inwards and im much more introverted than usual, so all my thoughts and attention are directed at me and my suffering. even trying to read a book or watch something on tv doesnt provide relief as my general attention is just stuck more towards my own body and mind rather than the outside world. it's so good when the tablets start to do their job and you come back out of yourself again and can be interested in things again rather than just stuck in your own personal inner 'inwards' hell.
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im not sure if u do this but another thing i have found useful is, to practice gratitude. so what i do, for example this morning when i woke up was, in bed i thought of a few things i was grateful for, so in my case they were things like: "i am in a warm comfortable bed, i have somewhere to live, i have some friends, my relationship with my brother and sister is ok, i have food i can eat today.." - i know this all might sound a bit strange and some might think.. "what? those everyday little things are things to be grateful for?" but just thinking like this when waking up is a more positive approach to the day, as opposed to waking up and thinking things like "other people are doing better than me, i havn't achieved enough in life, my past was a disaster, the future is bleak, there's no point in anything.. etc...etc" (of course we know by now when depression or anxiety is too intense, then this kind of grateful thinking becomes either difficult or impossible, but i find it does certainly work well when u start to get past the worse stages of a depression/anxiety episode).
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do continue to get your thoughts and feelings down here Admac (or anyone else here) as it is helpful to chat to others like us here who know what the pain and misery of depression and anxiety is like. it's really good to know we are not alone and also really good to know that even those who have had the worst most severe cases of depression/anxiety can and do come out the other end, if you keep going and give it time for eg. meds to get working.
Admac73 sun47
Posted
Yes, I'm looking forward to that momment when the tablets begin to kick in and I'm not so self critical and absorbed with myself. Films, music, people - it's like there's a sheet of glass between me and experiences, like I can't quite access them.
Absolutely, I practice something similar in terms of gratitude, along with my metta, usually to finish my meditation. It can be very powerful. I will look more into self forgiveness - it looks quite similar. I'm finding it hard to do these things at the momment, so hopefully soon.
I'm waiting for a momment when the tablets kick in, though I know it doesn't work like that, it's more gradual. With Citalopram I'm finding my sleep is still disturbed. I'm holding out hope that it really helps with insomnia, as I feel this is contributing to my anxiety and depression.
Patience, patience.
Admac73 sun47
Posted
I'm struggling with this at the momment. After over four weeks I thought that I'd start to see some slight shoots of recovery but my sleep is as bad as ever and I'm in the throes of a low period. I have a script for two more weeks then I have to call my GP for a refill, so I'll try and get a minute with him then.
I don't like changing meds, I need this to work desperately. Is it worth my while trying it for longer than six weeks? A couple of times for a few hours I thought I was starting to have more positive thoughts but they soom plummeted again. I know a watched kettle doesn't boil but if I had just one or two better days I think I'd stick with it. I'm very close to taking some time off work to get through this, which is not good.
sun47 Admac73
Posted
hi admac i was wondering how you are doing and have been checking back here, sorry to hear you are still stuck in that awful waiting game, waiting for results. give it the next couple of weeks to see if the tablets start kicking in better, and then after that you could chat with your doctor about what to do next (options like giving it more time, or meds change, dose change, etc). if you have access to a more specialist psychiatric team perhaps u could get a referral to them? keep going ok as you will certainly reach the recovery phase, i know it really, REALLY sucks in the meantime though
Admac73 sun47
Posted
Thanks for checking in again sun47.
It's five weeks now and I've had some pretty low spells this past week. I have been experiencing sore throat/ear problems which the nurse in my GP's Surgery advised might be sinus problems. I'm on anti biotics, anti histamines and some nasal sprays - I'm noticing that my anxiety is through the roof, and my mood a lot lower and flatter. I'm wondering if there's been a bad interaction between the two medications. The enclosed medical leaflet seems to suggest not to take them if on MAOI, which citropralam isn't, but still.
Five weeks. I'm so frustrated that this isn't working and don't want to give up on them. Each day I think, well I'm one day closer now, but it never comes. I'm going to try another few weeks, then call the GP. It's hard to get two minutes with him, and he'll probably just go with whatever I suggest. Mental health services are in a sorry state here on the NHS. I make use of the volunatary services when I need to. I'd get a referral to a specialist team if I was in immediate danger. I was told eight months for counselling last time. But I might have to try again.
What about you, how are you getting on?
sun47 Admac73
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hey again admac im thinking, would you say your case generally is more a problem on the anxiety side of things rather than the depression side? (or both equally?) in my case i would say my issues are more on the depression and negative thoughts side, as opposed to anxiety (although i do certainly get both anxiety and depression if left untreated). since your case seems more on the anxiety side of things (?), have you heard of the med called Pregabalin? that's something which we can get in this country (UK) prescribed for anxiety, and personally i took it in the past and i did find it worked. maybe that's something you could consider looking into? it doesnt usually take too long to work as it's not an ssri type of med.
GP Doctors can be a tricky bunch cant they, sometimes u feel like they just dont have time to look into each case at any level other than the surface. That's why i tend to just research things myself online reading reviews or looking at clinical trials data etc, and then just ask the GP for what i want, and then they tend to just prescribe it! (i tried to get bupropion for a while though but that was huge no no).
Regarding myself i would say im not doing too bad but i do have some side effects hanging around which i do tend to always get when taking ssri's (that's one of the reasons i wanted to try bupropion, as it's not an ssri)... so i tend to get the increased tiredness in general, and also i tend to have more vivid dreams (which i find annoying to be honest...). also i still have an upset stomach in general but its not as bad now as when i started the tablets, so im hoping in time that just passes.
i do still have the odd dip in mood sometimes, but luckily now the citalopram has had time to work in me, i can avoid ending up stuck on that path again and instead not become overwhelmed. hopefully you will reach this point soon also, and dont worry if you dont with citalopram as trust me something certainly WILL work for you and u have to keep on muddling through in the meantime. you will feel really good and proud when u get through your current situation and get into the 'feeling better' stage, and realise u are a tough person to bear this kind of crap, as we all are who keep going no matter what ok.
i hope u will keep me posted over the coming weeks ok, cant wait when the point comes when u start feeling better, its going to be great. i know your body and mind are telling u that day wont ever come but dont worry, u are on the road to fixing that, and each day u are getting closer, so keep going.
Admac73 sun47
Posted
Thanks for checking in again Sun47. It really helps, and encourages me to check in and see where I’m at, be accountable. I appreciate the value of this forum and your encouragement.
Glad to hear you’re not doing too bad. It sounds like the side effects are tailing off – do they ever go completely? My main one now, I think, is insomnia and a jitteriness, like I’ve had too much coffee. Heightened anxiety. I can feel the tension in the bones of my face. I’ve had insomnia for a year now, and I think it’s worsened since I started this. I haven’t had vivid dreams, but I suppose you have to be able to sleep to get those.
I’m going to persevere with 20mg for another six weeks. I’m muddling through, somehow. It’s the hope that things will improve, from stories such as your own and encouragement that are making me put one foot in front of the other. I have returned to the office this week, which is hard, but it’s introduced a new set of stressors, which is maybe allowing me to forget for a while – when I’m alone, working at home, I’m constantly aware of my low mood and how I’m just waiting for something to improve.
Anxiety and depression, for me it’s a chicken and egg scenario. Recently, depression sweeps over me like a black cloud, a sudden change in the weather. Takes time to get out of it and anxiety is always ten times worse. When the depression eases, I’m less anxious. And then there’s times when being in a constant state of anxiety just wears me down until I’m depressed. But recently – depression.
I really don’t want to increase my dosage – I want to give it time. I hate the idea of going through more side effects again, I’d really have to take time off to cope with those. What is surprising me, after six weeks, is the strength of the negative thoughts – I don’t expect Cit. to be a cure for that, I expect blips and bad days as per normal – it’s just the persistence and severe nature of them. I think my previous meditation and CBT skills are saving me at the moment.
I’ll check in again soon, for you and anyone else reading I hope things continue to improve.
sun47 Admac73
Posted
hey admac i really hope your negative thoughts ease down soon, that's such a tough side of this whole thing isn't it. regarding your question about if the side effects go completely, it does seem to differ between people but regarding myself, i would say now my stomach after several weeks of being on citalopram 20mg, does not seen to be as bad now, although i made some diet changes, eliminating things from my diet which seemed to make my stomach feel more upset.
regarding vivid dreams, that's something personally for me which doesn't go away if i am taking ssri type meds. i'm changing my attitude about the vivid dreams now though, as in, to finally accept that between having untreated depression/anxiety, or vivid dreams, i will take the vivid dreams. i keep reminding myself that things could be much worse.
hopefully your insomnia and jitteriness will improve over the coming weeks. it took around 2 months for my upset stomach to improve and i have certainly read other stories about some side effects only easing up after some months.. i agree with you about, i dont think i would increase the dose at this stage if the current side effects you are experiencing havn't actually passed yet. maybe one option is, give it a few more weeks on citalopram (or longer if you both want to and feel you can), and then if it's not working out you could simply try something else, such as eg. sertraline, a popular ssri which might simply suit you better.
Admac73 sun47
Edited
I haven't checked in for a while, so thought it about time I did so.
I think it's about nine weeks now, on the 20mg. I persevered with the 20mg and I'm glad I did. Somewhere along the way I began to sleep better, as my anxiety levels dropped. I can get seven hours sleep regularly now, which is a huge boost to me. The side effects seem to have eased.
It has been a slow, imperceptible transition. No lightning moments of joy. I don't wake up with a baby elephant on my chest, dreading the dawn. I can get out of bed, prepare myself for the day. I don't experience severe anxiety in every social situation. This has helped me to socialise a bit more, but citalopram doesn't work so well with alcohol. It's a depressant, of course, and I felt my mood plummeting like a bucket down a well the day after. Drinking alcohol is often like stealing happiness from the next day.
I still have 'down' periods that come upon, but they don't completely derail me. I don't catastrophise just as much. I don't fantasise about suicide as much. It can still pop up but I don't feel the need to indulge it.
Odd thoughts and feelings pop into my head, but I feel in control of them. I continue to practice mindfulness, meditation, healthy eating and continue to exercise.
It's early days but for me happiness at this stage is the absence of severe unhappiness. I can see a little bit more into the future now. Hopefully things continue on an upward trajectory; slow progress, now that I am out of the danger zone, is fine with me.
Thanks to Sun47 for the words of wisdom and support and to anyone at the early stages, stick with it, it takes time. I appreciate everyone's story and situation is different but I think patience is best with this medication for the first few months. Ultimately I hope to come off citalopram when my life is on an even keel and I am able to deal with life without spiralling downwards, but I'm not thinking about that yet.
sun47 Admac73
Posted
hey admac im really glad to read that you are seeing some progress now, and given more time those dips in mood you still have will lessen and lessen until you find yourself feeling much more stable and stronger.
i'm the same with alcohol, im noticing i seem to be ok if i just have one or two drinks (330ml bottles 5% vol. alcohol) in the evening say, but any more than that and it can make me feel more crappy the next day, so i just dont go over that limit, and also i dont drink them every night, just sometimes.
by the way now im feeling better im starting to eat some crap food again haha ... i think i need to try to get back to the healthy eating again and stick with it 😃
Admac73 sun47
Posted
Do you think the medication affects appetite? I've noticed I'm also eating a LOT of junk food, I find myself craving it, never did before....Yes, alcohol is an issue - on the one hand I'm glad to be able to socialise with people, as I didn't feel like doing that for a long time, but I have noticed I get drunk quickly, which I don't like. Hangovers are pretty horrendous, so back to near abstinence for me. I feel a lot better, and don't want to jeopardise progress with alcohol.
sun47 Admac73
Posted
i actually like the fact that i need less alcohol now to feel the effects of alcohol, as it works out cheaper that way 😃 this is quite common it seems, it often says it in the included leaflet that drinking alcohol while on these type of tablets can increase the effects of alcohol.
yep i get the craving things like sweet or junk foods. it seems to be very common when taking these meds. myabe its something to do with dopamine levels, not sure. anyway it seems generally ssri meds tend to affect the following:
energy levels (either an increase, resulting in some agitation/edginess, or decrease.. the decrease seems very common; tiredness, sleepy feelings etc)
body temperature (for some an increase so eg. more sweating in general)
appetite (increase in appetite, weight gain --or a loss of appetite.. also cravings of certain foods eg. sweet things etc)
mood (increased aggression for some people. i tend to get that, but its only a slight increase so not an issue.. to be honest i dont mind an increase in aggression as it means im more assertive, and assertive people are less prone to depression. (therapy often involves trying to make sufferers more assertive and less 'being a victim' and having a helpless attitude to life.)
i guess we just all hope to get lucky and hope that the med we take hits the right spots. if any of the above become too troublesome sometimes u just need to try a different med and see if u suit a different one better.
onwards and upwards admac 😃